How do you go about doing breeding plans, properly though over along time?

Warm regards Susan

Elaborate a little.  Do you mean long range planning?  I am often thinking bout where to go next wtih my breeding when the latest bitch pup I am planning to keep is wet in the nest or even before she is born :D  Sometimes plans change, but I usually have some likely ideas wirring about in my head.

Hi Brainless, i've heard alot of people talking about it, i suppose i mean what goes into a breeding plan are you trying to achieve a certain look over twenty years or three, if you know what i mean, or are you trying to achieve it in the litter your planning.  Is that a set idea of what your trying to achieve or do you change with each litter with what it's lacking, if it is lacking of a certain criteria.  I've been up since six so i dont even know if i can understand my own reply to you, sorry if you i haven't explained myself properly.

Warm regards Susan

I think it depends how old you are now, Susan!  At my age my long term planning is done!!! :-)

To just be thinking about Flatcoats, we started from scratch about twenty years ago.    We had had working labradors and Kerry Blues before that, so had a fair bit of experience under our belt, but with the Flatcoats we have had the chance to have a real plan .

Our first Flatcoat was a super dog - re-homed, and taught us the delights and downfalls of the breed.   He was used at stud a couple of times, but we didn't continue the line.

I then bought my foundation bitch from a well known breeder who had used a successful show dog.    Unbeknown to me at the time, he was noisy working, and this came out in my bitch, so I had to choose partners carefully.   She had excellent conformation, trainability, and she worked amazingly, but she was noisy.

She had two litters by very quiet dogs , both good conformation, who were quiet.    Both had different dogs in their background that were in common with hers, but on different lines - say 3-4 gens back.

Over time, from each litter I kept a bitch pup by a different dog again - again, quiet dogs - one to speed up one line which was a bit slow for me , the other of stunning conformation, and useful worker.

If you're following me, I now have two diverging lines from my original foundation bitch, and after three generations I can use my own dogs to backcross onto bitches from the other branch.

I now (after 4 generations) are beginning to see the fruits of my efforts.     Dogs of good conformation, who have pace and style, who are quiet and work well.

I bring in new blood now by asking for pup if a bitch comes to one of our dogs, and I particularly like her and her breeding.

I know it's more parameters than folk who don't work their dogs, but therein lies the fascination!

HTH

Jo and the Casblaidd Flatcoats

Any long term breeding plan will look at pedigree lines, as has been said, from even before the puppy is born.

Another aspect you must take into consideration is the health of any animal you breed, and that starts when you consider mating your bitch, you should find out what health checks need to be done, and select a male who is also health checked and passed all the tests required.

Temperament of your bitch and the male is also important, do not rely on ringside gossip! Go and see the dog and make sure you know what he is like really. An example of this is that at Windsor on Friday I overheard somebody telling another person about "how nasty tempered" a certain male dog was, my own male dog had just spent the previous ten minutes stood nose to nose with this dog and they had wagged tails at each other, with never so much as a rumble even! The "worst" exchange which passed between them was a lick!

Next you have to consider conformation, if your bitch has a poor shoulder placement or spreading feet, according to your breed standard which is the "blueprint" you should be striving to breed to, then you should find a dog with a correct shoulder placement and good tight feet. So you need to understand your breed standard and what the correct construction is.

The idea is to always strive for better construction, good temperament, good health and in some breeds, such as gundogs good working ability. So when you mate your bitch you hope to get good puppies, only breed from the best, be very selective, and you should do the breed of your choice no harm.

If in the future you decide to keep a dog, you should be equally picky about which bitches he is mated to. They should be of good temperament, good health, and good construction. As you will discover there are always people who just want a litter because their bitch is a nice pet, this is not an ideal mating very often as the owners will not have new homes waiting for a puppy, and may find they have to run on puppies until they are six months old or so. As the stud dog owner you are equally responsible for every puppy born.

We devised a long term breeding plan last year for our bitch (and her progeny) and found four dogs who were from a very similar line to her's who each had virtues we wanted to put into our breeding but sadly that was all wiped out when she contracted Pyomoetra before we even used dog number 1! We were unable to contact her breeders to see if they were planning another litter so we decided to go into another line that will mean one outcross first of all (as long as nothing goes wrong) then using the original breeding plan we had. Problem is now that it is one year on each dog is a year older and the 'new foundation' bitch is only just 9 months old so the problem is now that we will have to remove one dog from the programme or look at other alternative lines. In theory long term breeding is a good idea in my opinion as long as you stick to your guns and don't get swayed by the 'latest' trend to use a certain dog because everyone else has. With a long term breeding plan you should end up with three, four, five etc generations of typy, similar breeding with some noticable improvment in each litter.

Thanks everyone for your advice, i'm twenty seven in august but i'm looking at the  long hall, the dog i've got at present i'm going to try and learn the ropes with her showing as i've only just started and while i'm there i'm going to seek out a good breeder and buy another dog in a few years time, when i now what i'm looking for, then i might think about breeding if i learn everything i need to.  I've got alot of goals but i'm going to have to plan, at present i'm happy entering a few shows and watching what goes on.  Thanks for the advice most apprieciated.

Warm regards Susan