I have an 20 month old black mini Schnauzer and a 41/2 year old Wire Fox Terrier (both neutered).  We have been having great problems with the Wire turning on the Schnauzer for apparently no reason.  2 weeks ago we were on the verge of giving the Wire to a rescue to be rehomed as he is a charming dog on his own.  We were told that the Schnauzer breeder should never have sold us the dog knowing that we had a male Wire.

We are trying to establish the wire as top dog (as instructed by our vet) to see if this will help the situation.  I love both dogs equally but the Schnauzer has gotten away with murder as he is very cute and like to please but he is driving me insane with his barking.  When we go out for a walk he will bark at anything (but mostly at other dogs).  I have tried ignoring the barking and walking on (does not work), I have tried making him sit while the other dog passes (does not work), I have tried telling him quiet (does not work).  He appears frightened by other dogs.

Is there anything else we can try to see if the barking could stop.  He did attend puppy training classes at which he barked all the time and the trainer did say we were going to have problems unless we got this stopped.

Any advice.  Sorry for the length of the post it.

Just a couple of points - in a domestic situation there isn't always a top dog who is highest ranking an ALL situations, so making one a 'top dog' in all situations may be making the problem worse, in feeding situations for example.

I'd suggest the Schnauzer beleives he is protecting the pack. What did the puppy trainer suggest to stop the barking?

I can agree with digger - I have two entire male mini schnauzers 8 years apart - the youngest is defiantly the top dog when out on walks, but the old guy doesn't mind this - indoors their 'ranking' changes depending on the situation - in the garden the youngest shouts the odds, at tea time the eldest is in charge, sleeping arrangements are at the eldests instruction, it changes depending upon the situation but it works for them so that's good.

I don't know how 'badly' your schnauzer barks but it might be worth noting that they are a terrier breed and some can be a bit on the vocal side! :D

My eldest only barks at 'threats' - my youngest likes to announce to the world that he is going out for a walk and will regally bark at other people/dogs - he particularly likes the sound of his own voice when he is out playing in the garden but we have other dogs around us and you can hear them 'talking' to one another lol.

I've always accepted the barking as being part of his personality - he has done it since I got him at 7weeks and trying to stop him results in us all getting sad and depressed.

You say he seems frightened of other dogs when out - hence the barking, could it be possible that he feels 'picked on' by the wire indoors and is trying to regain some domination on the outside, hence the barking?

I don't know any simple solutions but I think your first stop should be a behaviorist; they are reasonably inexpensive when you think what peace they could bring to the home and they will help you sort out any problems within their relationship :)

I hope you get it sorted soon.

Roxanne

I have tried a behavourist (Bark Busters) initially it was for the wire because he was attacking Bert (Schnauzer) but she said that Fred (Wire) was protecting the house he was always sitting facing a door or walking round the room.  She showed us what to do and we have been trying this and I believe he is a bit calmer now.  She also said that we were going to have problems with Bert because he was so cute (proved right).

The dog trainer never actually gave us any information as to how to stop Bert's barking.  When I call Fred in the house he comes to me (sometimes a bit reluctant, still working on him) but when I call Bert he rubber ears you.  You have to go almost up to him before he will come.  He will come to you for a treat but I don't always have a treat on me in the house to entice him.

I walked them both this morning and we met a Greyhound and Bert went mental, so much so that I was feeling a bit anxious because I felt he was getting Fred excited.  Ideally if I had the time in the morning I would walk them separately but I have to get to work and take the dogs over the my mum's to be looked after during the day.  She alternates them between the cage and letting them outside and seems to manage this but the dogs are never together at any one time and I feel I am not getting any enjoyment from them because I am always watching for trouble.

try a childs water gun dont let him see it and fire him in the face each time he barks at another dog and treat and praise when he behaves .

If, as you suggest in your original post, Bert's barking at other dogs is motivated by fear, then I would be concerned that using something like a water pistol might make him feel worse.  Not only does he see the thing that he fears, he also gets squirted in the face.  It certainly won't change his feelings towards other dogs.

This is just my view but I think it would be worth contacting a reputable behaviourist, someone from the APBC, if you want to be able to keep both dogs and walk them without hassle.

My post about the airedale sounds really similar to this.  My pup barks loudly at other dogs but is also quite scared of them if they run up to her.  Squirting her in the face wouldn't work because she loves water and would think it was just a game.  The behaviour patterns of you dog sounds pretty much the same.  it's really frustrating and your'e always on edge when taking them out because you don't know what will happen. Also people seem to think you can't control your dog if they bark constantly.  my sympathies are with you!

this might sound a bit the wrong way round to you but it worked on my mini and she was barking all the time at nought. When he starts to bark tell him talk, but the very second it stop's say quite good boy in a really nice voice and give him a tip bit. I found this stange for a while but after about a week I relised the barking was getting shorter and Kizzzy was turning round to face me and being quite. It took about a month to be able to give her the command quite and for her to take notice, but now she only barks when there's something to bark at and as soon as it has passed she's waiting for her praise for stopping. I was told i should now give her the talk command and see if she does start to bark, but don't think i will bother with that one.lol Viv

Several things concern me with your situation - firstly trying to establish your dogs pecking order for them will only cause more conflict.  To some extent you need to let them work things out.  If you are concerned that they will do damgage to one another then stick baskerville muzzles on them when they are together and keep their nails short.  At 20months old bert is just trying to find his feet and fred is justly telling him what his boundaires are.
You don't say in your posts how bert reacts to other dogs off lead - this would be helpful to know.  For the barking on lead can you enlist the help of another dog owner who you can work with?  What you need is a dog that won't bark back at him when he barks.
Start with the friends dog sitting somewhere and work out at what distance to the dog bert starts to bark.  You should ON NO ACCOUNT SQUIRT HIM IN THE FACE WITH WATER as one other poster suggested as this will make him snap.  In training the water is used as an interruption to the behaviour and should make the dog break its stare - the water squirt should only ever be from the back across the top of the dogs ears and as they turn to see what it was you reward them for stopping barking.  You should teach your dog a watch command to get him to look at you on command and you would add this to the approach of the other dog and the use of the water interruption.  Your approach towards the other dog should be under control, if he barks, squirt his ears, command 'watch' as he looks at you and reward and praise, when he is relaxed and interested in you and the reward you should take another few steps forward.

With regard to other dogs off the lead I have only ever let him off with my brother's dog who he does not see all that often.  He is wary of him when they meeting but within a matter of a few minutes they are running around the garden.  He just seems an extremely highly strung dog because when he is out walking he is always looking around himself as if he is watching his back at all times.  Fred just walks beside me.  I must be truthful and say that they are not allowed off the lead outside as I live in a built up area and am frightened of the traffic for them.

Thanks for everyone's advice and I will certainly work with him and try and get him better with other dogs.  It would make taking them a walk a pleasure rather than torture.

Thanks again.