<<most people would cross the road if they saw a staffie coming. That might be people stereotyping all staffies, it might not be very fair either, but I know that if there is a staffie coming that I don't know, I would rather cross the road than take the risk of having my son attacked. >>

:( rather sweeping statements!!....I don't find that most people cross the road when i'm out with my crew............and as for crossing the road to avoid having your son attacked every time you see a staff...............do you cross the road every time you see a GSD, rottie, doberman...........I would suggest you are more at risk from the traffic........nothing personal but please do not tar all staffs with the same brush - there are plenty of loving, well adjusted staffs about - they are not known as the nanny dog for nothing!

In my time I have seen several labs bite people, a few collies go for dogs/people, been bitten by a rottie myself and am growled at by my best friends GSD every time I visit (this one has bitten several people apparently). But I judge each dog as an individual not a breed. Like many other posters I am fed up with the negative publicity and like to do my bit by making sure my staffs interact with lots of dogs and people. Blame the deed not the breed.

They are just saying that because of the name staffs have got they are weary, they are only human after all... NO one has said no other dogs attack, the opposite has been said infact!

Edit to say, I have been bitten by 2 Jack russells, I am a bit weary of them now...Loads of small dogs snap at my dog, I cross the road to avoid them unfortunatly...

quite right Poppynurse
people are entitled to their opinion but it should be well informed and impartial. Stereotyping is the worse thing a poster can do 

I have owned a Staffy and a Staffy x (rescue) and now I have a yorkie... without a shadow of a doubt I would say the Yorkie is the more Fiesty breed and the only one I have been bitten by. But how I see it and people will disagree is that if a small dog bites not a lot of damage is done however if a staffy bites it causes more damage and therefore more of a reaction from people.

My Staffy and staffy cross were the most gentle things but I always kept them on leads in public.  The thing that WINDS me up no end is people who walk the street with dogs off leads saying "I know my dog and he doesnt need a lead". At the end of the day a dog is an animal and no matter how trained can be unpredictable no matter what breed.  This over confidence is dangerous.  People who have staffys because they think they are "hard dogs" need banning from keeping animals full stop!

Dead on Leanne, I agree with all of that.

Zoe can I ask how the dog managed to attack if it was on a lead?  Its owner must have let it get close enough to carry out an attack?  I really dont get people I really dont! and the dog will suffer now. 

it pulled and came loose from its handler :(

It really affects me hearing things like this, I must admit I have a bit of a phobia about dogs fighting so am over cautious with my dogs, my new pup is being well socialised (puppy class and neighbours dogs) but no matter how much I trust him I will still have the attitude of not really trusting dogs I meet on the street or in the park.  If I take him on my shopping centre and there are these "trusted dogs" off their leads I pick my pup up, or walk the other way.  Probably dangerous for me if the off lead dog wanted to attack but I would rather that than get my pup hurt.  Good job hes not a great dane isnt it....

Leanne K

'But how I see it and people will disagree is that if a small dog bites not a lot of damage is done however if a staffy bites it causes more damage and therefore more of a reaction from people'

Yes you are right it there is a fight between two dogs the majority of the time the other dog will come off worse because a staff is so strong. They do a lot more damage than many dogs.  I agreed that this is the reason why it produces more of a reaction from people. 

Secondly, if this dog gets put down then i feel that is very harsh because the dog was on a lead but sounds like it unfortunately caught its owner unaware and managed to get loose, its happened to me but fortunately without any harm done. 

Just noticed this thread :-(

I have a staff that can be agressive with 'some' other dogs but she is allways under controll.

I think people forget what staffies were bred for!

If someone bought a collie & it started to round things up - no problem. But when people buy a staff the have to realise they were bred to fight other dogs :-( & take steps to make sure that never happens.

When I was out shopping a couple of days ago I heard a crying & rushed over to the van where it was comming from. There was a male staffie with a muzzel on that had got the muzzle stuck on the gear stick :-(

Lucky the van door was open but I could not free the dog so I undid his muzzle - lol - you should of seen the onlookers run!

I know I put myself at risk but I was very carefull - he just licked me to death!!

The owner returned minutes later (he was just making a delivery & had only been gone 10 mins.)  He told me he muzzled him when he was left in the van as he ate the seats otherwise!

No one else would help - I did wonder if they would have if it was another breed?

Jo
xx

I want another staffy and when the time comes to get him/her I think I will have a good chat with people on here.  A chap at my training class said "dont get a staffy he will attack your dog if left alone" what a sad attitude.  I have owned a yorkie and staffy together before and if you introduce correctly then a staffy can live with any other dog.  Staffys are known as Nanny dogs they are very loving, quite soppy creatures in my experience but there again I have never played rough with mine or taught them to dangle from tree branches (yes ive seen this happen).  If your staffy is breed from good tempremented parents and handled right they are no more aggresive than any other breed.  *gets off soap box*

Coleystaff

Please see my reply to Poppynurse, I think I have made myself clear.

The thing is people who are like I was - ignorant - THINK they know everything there is to know about a staff, just because they have seen the negative press, and they 'know' that Staffs are nasty dog's, it is only when they talk to someone like you and Poppynurse and others on here that they realise that atually there is more to this breed than the nasty ones. Most people won't be coming on here to find out if Staffies are nasty or not, and most won't know someone down the road that has done the breed justice, most will carry on thinking that all Staffies are nasty until the same happens with what has happened to other breeds, that have had a bad name and somehow even with all of the ignorant people, the breed comes through it and do well again.

I am not for one minute saying it is right for so many people to be mis-informed about this breed, what I am saying is that I know HOW people can come to their conclusions, and if you really hope to change peoples view, sitting sprouting off about it on CD just isn't going to be enough.

thank you Natalie
your responsible words make all the difference to us Staff Owners.I dont honestly know what the answer is to the problem of irresponsible people owning dogs . Its the same as saying some people shouldnt have children and they shouldnt we all know that but they still do. Perhaps as individual Staff owners we can ensure that we do our best to educate people to their good qualities, we try and let Giorgia play with as many dogs as possible with their owners permission. She plays every day with dogs and hopefully these owners will always remember their good experience with a Staff.

I think because Staffs were bred to be a fighting dog, peoples view on them will never change completely. As others have said if any dog has the chance to fight, and it wants to, it will!

I think because of the way Staffs have been bred they will always want to fight, likewise in my breed they will always want to herd things, even having never seen livestock, and of course there will, as you say, always be some Staffie owners who shouldn't be owners of any dog, and therefore Staff attacks will carry on.

It must be very hard for you to take all of the knocks that Staffs do get, I know I get very defensive when someone says they don't like something about my breed, but it is the way it is, and apart from waiting it out, and dealing with it the best you can, there is nothing that you can do.

Can't the breed club(s) do something to try and raise the profile of good Staffs?

Well said Coleystaff :) ;) :)

I think most people know that staffies are not as aggressive and dangerous as some people think BUT as they are "popular", especially with the wrong kind of people sometimes, they are maybe more likely to be reported attacking other dogs or even people. They are strong dogs with a "fierce" look to them (even if their temperament is not fierce) and sometimes owned by people who want them to be aggressive or to look it at least. People who have no idea how to educate them properly. As they are strong and their jaw is powerful, any attacks are usually more spectacular and therefore more likely to shock. But that's only my view :-o

I have just trawled through all the posts abut this terrible incident.  It should be posted on here not as anti-staff campaign but just as information about the poor training that most dogs get.  I am a trainer/behaviourist and specialise in aggression and come from quite a busy town.  We see more GSD's than staff's in all areas but I do not think that makes GSD's any worse than any other dog or staff's any better.
Every dog has the ability to do horrific damage to another-staff's unfortunately are the choice dog of lets call it the 'lads' mentality at the moment where as a few years ago it was rottie's.  Any dog in the limelite and being overbred will appear in the 'news' more.  Labradors are the most overbred dog in the country so there are going to be more incidents involving them.
Staff's can be lovely dogs, they are notoriously good with people but poor around other dogs as are all of the bull breeds mainly due to lack of early socialisation.  It is unfortunate that many of this breeds owners (and I do hope you all understand the type of person i am getting at here) are the 'lads' with their token staff and their can of lager.  Dog off lead doing as it pleases owner too busy guzzling to be bothered and if the dog gets into trouble they adopt the he's a staff he can take care of himself attitude.
I deal with many dogs with aggression problems and at the moment our star pupil is a Staff - he came to us like a killing machine but is now playing with other dogs.  No breed can be blanketed with a sweeping statement as all dogs like all people are different.

Poppy nurse - Like I said in my last post, this is (or was) down to my own ignorance.

I have already said before I started coming on here, I thought all Staffies were nasty, surely in my case now I have been 'educated' about Staffies, and have since said I was in the same boat as most people (who don't know anything about dogs) the fact that I have been able to change my view on Staffies is a good thing isn't it?

Yes I don't like the look of them, but like I said yesterday, not everybody will like the puppy we will be getting - that's someone's own personal choice.

I do understand that you are fed up of people like me that think all Staffies are nasty, but up to a point you should give them a break, and instead of having a go at them, educate them, tell them where they are wrong, people don't know everything about every breed. As annoying as it to you that people don't understand your breed, you must realise that the reason they don't understand, is because they read the papers, see all of the negative press about Staffies and, maybe wrongly, but naturally, think all Staffs are the same.

It doesn't matter what type, size or how obedient a dog is, if its going to attack and finds the oppotunity to attack, it will.

I have a reminder of that every time I look in the mirror.

I was attacked by the most well behaved, obedient SMALL dog that I have ever known.  The dog just flipped! thats all you could put it down to.

Its just a smaller dog is easier to get hold off so you can pull it off.

People tend to be scared of bigger dogs because of the fact they can over power you but from my experiance you need to keep an eye on the fluffy cute ones aswell.

Any dog would snap if provoked, they have limits just like us humans.

I think part ot the problem is that amny staffie owners are not aware theat their breed can be difficult with other animals.  they see how good they are with peopel and don't see the potential problems.  This is true of many people who have dog aggressive dogs of many breeds.

Many pet owners are absolutely horrified at hwo dog aggressive their dog can become due in msot part to insufficent socialisation.  Many owners don't bother with training classes for their dogs until they have problems.

I have a staff,who because I fostered dogs for rescue has little to no interest in other dogs.However I would never underestimate the damage she could do as I have witnessed a few staff attacks on other dogs,and one when my daughter fell over in someones house and her dog tried to attack her.She is a wonderful dog but has been very hard work from day one,and its only now that shes six that shes calming down.In responsible hands they are wonderful dogs,but they are reknowned for not liking other dogs and that is something the owner should be very very aware of throughout the lifetime of the dog.
I have other smaller dogs but I would never ever leave her with them if I was not about,even though she has never once shown aggression.I would be very nieve if I thought that she wasnt capable of it.

Why don't owners keep all their dogs on leads,and under good control in public places,including parks etc.If they need to get more free running exercise then they should stick to their own gardens or drive the dogs in  their cars to a safe  spot.What is wrong with a dog ON a lead,he or she is out and getting exercise after all.Any dog may be deemed unsafe if off a lead in a public place.Some of the worst offenders we have seen are mongrels.

Bit radical! :)  The majority of dogs are perfectly sociable, certainly mine is, most people know if their dog is not so I think it is quite adequate for those to be on a lead when necessary.  I try not to use my car unless essential we've got a planet to save you know :)

Do you actually have a dog ?

edit to say : I missed the bit about driving to a safe spot, a park is safe for a dog, a friendly dog that is, its the unfriendly dogs that cause the problems and quite often these dogs dont have sensible owners who subsequently take them to the park and thats when the fights occur.

I cant believe the posts on here. very little 'if any" concern has been shown for  the blind person and his poor dog who where going about minding their own affairs. what state are they both in now i wonder, will either of them ever get over it ???  all a lot have commented on are the "poor staffie" getting the blame again----well the facts are it was a staffie, how about the injured party , or is that secondry to the  guilty parties breed, i so hope not.  guilty is as guilty does.

I hope the guide dog is okay, there's a very long waiting list to get one...

Exactly the issue. I have a friend with an assistance dog, who is SO well behaved. BUT after 2 nasty incidents with collies he is absolutly terrified of them and it is getting to the point where it is stopping him doing his job and making the person who he assist life a misery.

On the subject of staffs, one of the problems that we have here is a VERY nasty piece of work who breeds them in such a way as to make me think he only wants fighting dogs and to make money, but can we get him stopped - can we heck! I often help a friend with a training class and one of the first questions that we ask of new staff puppy owners is where did it come from. If it was that 'breeder' we sit them down and warn them of the past experience that we have had with him and his pups. One brave soul tried to take his pup back as the vet had found medical problems only to be 'encouraged' off of the premises with a shotgun :o  Sadly it is a breed that does tend to attract the wrong type. Having said that my Lab is getting quite grumpy and often sounds as if he would take a chunk out of another dog - touch wood nothing more than a lot of noise to date :D

I wouldnt expect my dogs to get their free running excercise in my backyard,they really only go out the back to toilet,it's their yard and it's boring :)

My dogs are NEVER on lead,they dont need to be,all dogs need free run excercise daily,this just cant be done on a lead,not much fun for them either!

Must add that i never walk them on or near roads,otherwise i would have to put them on leads,but when we go to the park or a trail it is their walk,not mine,and i try and make it as enjoyable as i can for them,which means giving them free run!

Sorry mate many of us don't srive,a dnin fact aggression on lead is much more common than off.  Dogs off lead are able to communicate properly.  If they never get the chance being on lead may control them but they are more likely to be aggressive or fearful than ever.

The thing with Staffs is they have heightened aggression towards attacking other dogs, its in their nature, just as its in a greyhounds nature to chase or a labs nature to retrieve. The other thing is they do a LOT of damge when they attack, its what they are designed for and what they are good at.  I make no excuses for the dog or the owner, I havent seen the story, however it is a dreadful accident and I am pretty sure thats what it was, as ACCIDENT.

For the record, there is a Lab guide dog round here that GOES for other dogs!
Dawn.

Thank you Bowers, this is why I posted, because I was upset and shocked both for the owner and the dog..I did not want another discussion on staffs getting the blame all the time...In this case it was a staff, be it the dog or owners fault it was a staff, I cant help it being that.

Zoe

Will you get to know how the guide dog is, If so will you let us know.

There was an article on the news last night about a Staffie that attacked an 11 year old boy, whose tummy and side was ripped open - it was put to sleep by the owner immediately.  I understood they are good with children though?  I knew nothing about them at all until reading things on this site and now my heart misses a beat if we meet one when out walking, even though I have never had any problems, but that is probably me being too easily influenced maybe, but they do look a bit frightening.

i have to admit (with my tin hat on), that i am petrafied of them. There is a cross breed who my boy plays with and the first time i saw her bounding towards me i nearly peed my pants.This is because my sister had one who was lovely and we were out with him when a JR came up barking and jumped on his back, sonni just turned and bit him. He had him hold around the stomach and he was badly bleeding and we couldnt get sonni off him. His jaws had locked. A passer by did something to his bottom??? and he let go. The JR owner contacted us to say the vets bill was over £1000 with the dogs stomach and intestines ripped. He said it was his dogs fault and that was the end of it. They are so powerful and since then im scared to death. He was lovely with the children though and so gentlewith elderly people. I know there are well trained and obedient dogs out there and my opinion is that it is not that they necessarily attack more than otherbreeds at all, it is just that they can cause a lot of damage when they do, this incident was one bite. The majority of them are lovely dogs and if another breed was as strong we would be posting about them instead.

That was the JRT fault! (or the owners of the JRT)

My staffie was attacked by a puppy (the pup was only playing I think ) but if I had not been there & stopped my staffie getting hold of the pup, it could of been nasty.

I got the blame though as I should not have one of those dangerous dogs!

My poor staff was covered in cuts from this puppy & her mouth was quite sore where she had been bit - but if she had bit the pup back she would of killed it - and got the blame for somthing I dont think was her fault :-(

I have never met a person aggressive staffie - if you look at the pictures of these 'nasty staffies' in the papers they look nothing like a pedigree staff. They look like a APBT or a cross.

I totally agree with you, my fear though is probably an indication of why they get a bad name. They can do soo much damage with one bite it's scary. It was definately the other owners fault as sonni was on a lead. The point i am trying to make is that i dont believe they attack anything/one more than any other type of dog, but it gets big press and bad names through the damage it can do, (which is unfair). My experience was to highlight my point. I hope this is clear and not offensive. I think there should be laws against who is aloud to own a dog dependant on their breed, (not just staffs). Then we would probably see a lot less animals needing rehoming. Too many people get a pup because it is cute. We researched all dog breeds thoroughly before we got our boy, and as my other postings showed it was still a shock.

Please don't be put off by the negative press - many of these reports (and I agree they are devastating for the parties involved) label the dog a staff if it so much as looks a bit like one......It would be interesting to know how many of these are 'true' staffs.....staffs are known as the nanny dog for good reasons - I currently have four staffs and three children (7.10 and 13) the house/garden is always full of neighbours children as well and I have never had the slightest concern for their safety (and no I'm not daft but my dogs are proven 100% with children) the biggest danger anyone faces from my crew is being smothered and licked to death. I am fully aware of staff history but if dogs are bred for good temperament and raised properly they are excellant family dogs.

i dont think the people who bred them initally as "fighting" dogs could have coped if they were people aggressive aswell.
i have never met a people aggressive stafford & the staff that attacked that boy must have had something rreally wrong with it

"however it is a dreadful accident and I am pretty sure thats what it was, as ACCIDENT."

How was it an accident ? from what I've read the Staffy attacked the guide dog - NOT accidentally, not 'oops silly me there I go biting another dog' but on purpose :( - I was not going to post this as  I do hate to be negative about another breed but my Terv girl was attacked two weeks ago  during her agility training - one of the two Staffs that are also in her training class ran into the tunnel while she was in it and attacked her leaving a deep gash on her neck and a torn ear. She now shakes with fear when we get near the training field and last week I could not get her to go anywhere near the equipment so she just sat by the field and I tried to make things as calm and pleasant for her as I could - I am MAD !. As long as  the Staffy myth - "that gameness should be an intrinsic part of the breed " is encouraged by owners and breeders then these dreadful 'accidents' will continue to happen :(

Yvonne

It's sad really my sister cleans in the pdsa and last night she said there was a staff and a lapha apso not sure how you spell it anyway the staff attacked the lap apso and broke it's jaw and ripped all it's legs while the owner was sitting waiting to be seen.

Warm regards Susan

Reading the original post, i feel terrible for this poor guide dog and it's owner.

Zoe, you said'' and they had a small child with them aswell'', yes we all know staffs were originaly bred for fighting and therefore can have a tendancy to be aggressive to other dogs, but whats the kid got to do with it ?

The way i read it, you were implying that these owners were irresponsible to have a child with an dog aggressive staffie, come on we all know how great staffs are with kids !!

Sarah

Obviously those staff owners here are defending the indefensible, to explain one little thing to those 'knowledgeable' owners, Staff attacks are different because the breed is bred to kill other dogs and they are as capable and efficient at their breed purpose as a Border Collie is capable and efficient at herding sheep.

For those living in the real world and who have pet dogs, as opposed to these dog killing dogs bred for one purpose, including attempting to kill guide dogs, loved by someone who cannot see. Moves have been underway for some time to have this breed banned, it is now a high probability that there will be secondary legislation to that end, so, to those with a realistic perception of this awful breed please do three things so the problem will be eradicated.
1. Write to your MP asking for a ban.
2. Write to the EFRA committee who will be consulting on this, address:
EFRA Com
7 Millbank
London
SW1

There is now a pressure group which has gained in credibility over this past two years and they are influential, your letters will support that group and eventually get rid of this horrendous dog killing breed once and for all.
Thanks to all those who do make the necessary moves.

Incidentaly tennostaffs, if a collie starts rounding sheep up because its owner cannot control it,it will be shot dead.

Mmmmmmmmmm, interesting. 'Realistic' never once seen or heard of before this post, now comes in with such a ludicrous and belligerent statement. Methinks it's an original Champdogger in disguise too cowardly to comment under their own username. You've been busted! :p

realistic
you have made my blood boil

Ignore it, that is the exact reaction they posted for! You lot all go bananas and they sit back laughing!

will do

I can only speak as I find :) Fortunately, here, most people are responsible dog owners. It's rare to see a stray. There are several staffies, but I have never had a problem with any of them. We often walk round the field with a dear, young, entire dog (off lead) who is only interested in his frisbee and interacts happily with my two and their balls :) Another lady has a rescue staffie bitch which is always well-behaved. One lady has a male staffie who is always on the lead and might be aggressive (I don't know), but she has him well under control, so there is no problem.

There are plenty of breeds that can be problematic with other dogs - but responsible owners know whether they have a problem and keep the dog on lead/away from other dogs. Staffies just seem to attract the wrong sort of owner. It's a problem with the human rather than with the dog :(

Daisy

Had a discussion recently on another board about the very same thing, it is unfortunate that some breeds do attract the wrong kind of owners and see certain types of dogs as status symbols :-(
My sister has a Staffie, she also has an Autistic daughter who was 6 when they got him, he is the most patient dog I have ever met, a real family dog.

There will be no legislation against "humans" Daisy, just the dogs, 'realisticaly' speaking.