Hi i have a staffy on day 58, shes gained weight but is not noticeably pregnant, i recently spoke to the stud owner and she told me that still being swollen at the rear is a sure sign that she is pregnant, she has not been scanned and we are still questioning is she isnt she, She is still very swollen, has anyone found this a positive sign or can this happen with  phantom?

Any advice will be appreciated. This is my first litter.

You seem to have put many post asking for advice about your bitch being pregnant or not, but no-one will be able to give you a definitive yes or no as every dog is different, my own bitch has stayed slightley swollen thoughout her pregnacy but getting nearer to the due date (now day 60) she has swollen alot more and it has become softer getting ready for the birth, you only have a few days to wait, if you really must know then take her to the vet for a scan so at least you will know for sure and put your mind at rest.

Clair, you really need to get your bitch to the vet, we cannot tell over the internet, you have be advised quite a few times in your previous posts to do this. If, by reading your previous posts, your bitch was mated on 27/29th March, then her due date is on Monday. Although she may go slightly over this date, but she should definately be looking pregnant at this stage, with only 3 days to go.....

To be honest I find it a bit alarming unless the posted is already set up and just hoping for the best.   I am concerned that the poster isnt ready and can't understand for the life of me if still in doubt why she hasn't been checked by the vet. 

Maybe I am a parinoid owner but it wouldn't be me. :-(

Well one observation is that is she is on day 58 and this is your first litter I think by now I would have had her scanned.

Are you ready if a litter arrives?  If she is in whelp they can arrive at any moment.

I may be new to all this but i am not so irresponsible as to not get prepared for what might happen, i have the book"The rearing and whelping of puppies" and have read  it back to back. I am fully prepared if she does whelp and she has been checked by a vet, he cannot say for sure if she is or isnt without having a scan, which we had been advised against.  I am just anxious and thats why have been asking questions for reassurance. But dont worry i wont be bothering you any more.

Clair

When i first discovered this site i was so relieved that there are people out there who know what their doing and have the experience to be able to answer my queries, however some the posts back have made me sound like an irresponsible owner.  I love my dog to bits and all i am is concerned.  Thanks to some others like "I Love my girls" who have been a great help.

I'm sorry Clair, but reading one book certainly doesn't make you prepared for whelping a maiden bitch.  Reading a recipe book doesn't make you a chef, does it?  I hope all goes well for you.

no but we all have to start somewhere dont we. You learn by experience.

Sorry Clair, not when you're dealing with living beings!! :(  Maybe when you want to learn to use a computer.  You can't hurt it if you get it wrong!
I'm quite sure that you "I love my dog to bits " but that's not enough when mating a maiden bitch. Knowledge, either from yourself or somebody with many years' worth of experience is what's needed.:(

Are you a breeder? If so how did you learn then?

Sorry to butt in, but I learned through being in constant contact with my first bitch's breeder, who had at that stage been breeding dogs for over 40 years. What does your bitch's breeder (not forgetting the owner of the stud dog!) say?

Yes, I've been breeding for over 20 years.  I spoke of my interest to the breeder that I bought my foundation bitch from.  She requested that I went to watch her next mating, visited weekly to watch her bitch develop.  Attended the whelping, which started at 2AM!!  |I then visited each week as the pups grew, including for weeks 6/7/8 arrived at 7AM so that I could see what greeted her in the morning!! ;)  All this when she was over an hour away and I had a 6 year old daughter to consider too.  When she saw how committed I was, she agreed to help me mate my bitch and produce my first litter.  She came to sit with me while my bitch whelped!  Most serious potential breeders who are concerned for their bitch, have a knowledgable mentor who is willing to share their experience to help them learn.
I also started my working life as a Veterinary Nurse, so I had a good idea of canine anatomy and behaviour, but not mating and whelping.
Clair you really do need on hand back up and support from an experienced breeder.  You only have to read this board to read of tragic consequences that can be avoided by knowledge!  Help is happily given here, but it's very difficult, sometimes impossible, when information is given by a novice.:(  Please ask you bitch's breeder to help you.

I have to say Clair.  I agree that still being swollen is a good sign.  Having bred dogs for over 30 years now  I have never had a scan done.  As I always say if they are they are.....if not.....well we can always try again.  I always prepare for the iminent arrivals and as you only have a few days left then all I can say is Good luck with your first litter.  Always a very exciting experience.

Thanks Molly1, I have a friend who breeds St Bernards who will be with me the whole time.  She has given me lots of help and advice. I am taking this very seriously and i know the amount of time and commitment that it entails.  Fingers crossed everything will be fine.

Clair did you bitch ever have puppies ? Just wondered as never saw an update. :-)

Hi Clair
yes, good luck with your first litter- i will hopefully be having mine in 7 weeks. I hope that peoples attitudes haven't put Clair off asking for help now if she needs it. Keep the vets number next to you and let him know once labour starts. It seems a lot of people here begrudge you breeding if you are  a novice but you are right- everyone had a first time. And dont forget dogs have litters all over the world with no intervention from man- just as women have babies (speaking as a midwife) so the best thing is to observe and ring the vet if you are worried. i hope you will let us know how she gets on. Good luck!
Debs

Thanks Debs

Of course i will let you know how she gets on, i have the vets emergency number and whelping kit is complete.  Good Luck with yours.

Clair

HI Clair,

I didn't see anyone saying you were irresponsible,I think people were shocked. I was certainly concerned when I read your post.

Clair a lot of people do not like scans but there is no fundamental evidence to say they cause any harm.  People avoid them just like they avoid upsetting the bitches by not taking to the vets etc . This I fully understand BUT IF you were at the vets which you have said you were and you still couldn't tell, and the vet couldn't tell by feeling her then you should probably have had a scan done. Advice telling you to not scan at this stage could be equally as bad. I stress the could be.

I personally think for a first litter if in doubt she should have been scanned so you can see if it is a singleton.. it is was a singleton and that is the reason she isn't showing she may and more likely could need help with whelping. It is different is she is obviously big and heavy with pups.

Love doesn't come into action when whelping bitches , common sense and extreme caution does.  I can't say for everyone here BUT most people I know if there is no signs of growth then a scan is done to check if there is no puppies and also if there is only one. If a bitch is only having one generally the care to the mother in the last week is different. You dont feed the same amount of protein etc as singletons are generally big anyway.  A member on here had a singleton last week that she was unaware of it was 2.5 times the breed puppy average and she was lucky to get it out alive.

I am not trying to frighten you BUT you have to be aware.

I canonly endorse the advice blue has given.  Take heed and perhaps find out whether there are no puppies or perhaps only one. You then know how to deal with the situation in the right manner. Good luck anyway

OK just to add a little twist.................

what would breeders have done 20 odd years ago when scanning wasn't as widely available??
(apart from take their bitch to the vets, and lets face it some vets are better at predicting pregnancy (Or not) than others and i imagine the same also applied back then.)

Hanstrip,

Breeders took the chance 20 odd years ago, if they have deaths etc ( which was probably higher then) that was the chance they took.

TOday we have the technology so we don't have to take so many risks. :-)

Hanstrips, I am of the old type I suppose, even though I'm youngish :d  I have never ever scanned my dogs, heard so many bad things regarding it as well as good.  So many things seem to be done today to dogs that would never happen in nature and does make me wonder what we are doing to them sometimes.  I know that we all want to do what's best for our dogs and be prepared though.  I'm sure that in my other breed that many years ago there weren't as many problems but we people have caused more by messing about and making the breed smaller and smaller.  When they first came into being they were between 40 and 50 lbs now they are between 4 and 7 lbs.

I get nervous every time my dogs have a litter, which isn't that often and think are they aren't they. 

I hope that all goes well Clare.  Please realise that it isn't that people are having a go at you, it's that they love dogs and want to make sure that everything is done correctly.  There are so many people out there who don't care and just put a dog with another dog and then leave them to it.  Keep us up-to-date with how things are going!

Hi Hanstrips.  Most of the "old breeders" used to palpate their bitches at 4 weeks, to know what they were dealing with and would teach their apprentices to do the same.  Without the internet or even the telephone - can you believe NO telephone!! :O - experience and knowledge in many fields was passed on through word of mouth.  Books are excellent 'written knowledge' but there are some things that are much better learned hands-on.  You don't need to have a degree to be a good dog breeder, but you do need the knowledge to help your much loved bitch at this critical time.  Those who think that all bitches whelp naturally without human intervention have a lot to learn!  Sometimes it works like that and for those owners, they should be very grateful.
Obviously there are some things that have changed over the years for the better and some things that we wouldn't want to go back to :(  But my concern is that it's genuinely difficult to give good advice on the net when information on the situation is being given by an inexperienced person.  All anyone can really say is "Contact your Vet" who IMO is often not as experienced at normal whelping as an experienced breeder.  Vets are great if the bitch needs unzipping, but as a Veterinary Nurse I had never seen a normal delivery, nor has the newest Vet at my local practice today!

So true Val.  A couple of years ago a friend of mine had a SWD litter and she'd never seen a litter being born before.  She'd read all the books etc.  She phoned me at work and i went through all of the, now is there a bag there, etc. etc.  Took her all the way through it and when the pup wasn't doing anything told her over the phone what to do.  Got some funny looks from the secretaries in my office :d  My friend did brilliantly !!

Left work early and rushed to her house and she'd had another one in the short space of time.  Then I let her get on with the rest of the litter but just advised her now and again.

As you say vets aren't always that good with pregnancies.  My mum took a Pomeranian that she was sure was pregnant to the vets and the vet told her that she wasn't pregnant and to keep an eye on her "just in case", more to cover her back, less than 12 hours later she had a litter of 3 which is a big litter, average 2.

HI clair, sorry you have had such a bashing here but it can be difficult to know what to advise sometimes. In the situation you are in, if she IS pregnant then my concern would be that she may  have one or two very big puppies which may be difficult to deliver and can often result in a c section. When labour starts, be sure you know when she enters the pushing stage which can be 24 hours or more later.
Once she has a pushing contraction for the first time a puppy is normally delivered within 2hours. Contractions start far apart and by 1 1/2 hours later the contractions ( if no pup has been born yet)  should be coming every few minutes. If they slow down noticeibly or stop ring the vet.

If after 1 1/2  hours of regular contractions no puppy is produced, ring the vet and tell him and be ready to take her in. Take everythng with you in case she has one in the car and a calm driver if possible.Make sure your mobile is charged up and a flask of coffee is always welcome if you are hanging around at the vets in the middle of the night while they do a c section!!

On the other hand if she isn't pregnant, because she is still swollen she may be having a false pregnancy and that will need treating when you are 100% sure there are no puppies. If that is the case I strongly advise you to use homeopathic treatment for it which is inexpensive, completely safe and in my experience 100% effective

When I bred my first litter my bitches breeder, although very helpful, was 4 hours away so clearly not able to assist at the actual welping, I read all I could but the most helpful thing I found was the GDB Whelping video.  I bought mine several years ago and don't know if it is still in 'print' but it came from DBI communications I also found their rearing video a tremendous help.

Have a missed some posts has there been posts deleted? I dont' see where clair has had a right bashing..

Clair, everyone is just concerned about the situation.   Sometimes posts can seem so vague and make readers panick more BUT people are being responsible by given you the advice honestly.  The advice is not personal :-)

Let us know how it goes if she is. Good luck:-)

PS ditto what Val said that the breeder or the stud dog if they will mentor you will be your life line..

I have only had a scan done on 2 bitches....both times it was wrong.Vet was also wrong oce saying no pups and there were ,once saying just 2 and there were 7.
Personally I don't bother with confirming pregnancy I just get my bitch checked out pre mating and again after delivery.
I know a first litter can be very worrying  especially if you have no experience and no one to ask for advice.
Good luck anyway and I hope all goes well for you and your bitch

Hi Kia, Ive only scaned once because of my bitches wheid  behaviour.The vet said there were 8 pups and to take her have and get some sleep, as she was not ready to whelp,so i went home fell asleep on my bed ,and 20 mins later my bitch ran upstairs and jumped in bed with me and delived her first pup with me in the bed ,then went on to have 6 moor in her whelping bed. Because vet said there were 8 i was left thinking she still had pup inside her. I could not feel any pups in her tummy but i took her back to vets to be safe. There were on moor pups left inside her and they had got it wronge. Ive been breeding for years now but iam still learning, you can never have to much experience can you regards debbie.