Thinking of joining the board but have to sort out cookies or something. thought i would ask my question to all you people in the know anyway.
I bought a leonberger puppy ( Holly ) and we love her to bit's, anyhow we took her to her first show last week ( our first show too!! ) after our class a lady came over to us and asked her where we got her from as the catalogue did not make sense, i told her that i got holly from a lady that lives near potters bar and gave her the breeders name, that can't be right she said that one of the parents in the catalogue have been dead for nealy two years, i told her i had seen the dad, but the lady insisted this dog died over two years ago.
When i got home i got out the paperwork for holly and there was this dogs name as her father, i phoned the lady that i spoke to at the show and told her it was not a mistake it was on her kc paperwork, she told me to speak to the kennel club straight away as this must be false paperwork, so i did, they told me to send the paperwork to them , and if it is found to be true that then as far as they are concerned they would have to recall the paperwork for the whole litter and be investigated.
I spoke to the breeder and she said yes the dog had died and that i was really stupid to report this to the kennel club and if i got her in trouble i would never be able to show a leo again
What have i done , is it my fault?

Chris

Hi, if you click on the 'tools' at the top of your screen, click 'internet options' then 'privacy' set to allow all cookies then you can join.

Dee

And by the way, no its not your fault at all.

Blimey!!!
Well first off you haven't done anything wrong, and if your dog had ever won anything significant and someone reported it (ie that the father was dead before the litter concieved) then you would have been disqualified.

As for the breeder, why would she do this, what is wrong with using the real sires name - do you now know who this is, is the dams name correct?

The breeder is totally in the wrong here and if found to be true will i suspect be disciplined by the KC and possibly banned, you on the other hand will not be in trouble.  I doubt if you could ever show your current dog as the pedigree is not confirmed, but there is no reason why you could not buy another one to show in the future.

Sharon

You have done exactly the right thing it is so important for the good of every breed that the integrity of pedigrees are maintained otherwise everybodies breeding plans and health checking becomes totally worthless.  If you had continued to show others would have spotted it anyway, by acting immediately your actions will be welcomed and approved of by everyone with the breeds interest at heart.  Sadly if it turns out to be true you will not be able to show your puppy again unless it is reregistered following a DNA test to find the true identity of the father and I fear that would not happen as it is very likely registration rights will be removed from the breeder.  If, however, you add to your showing family another pup from a respectable breeder I am sure you will be welcomed back into the show fraternity with open arms :)  I'm sure you will not want to part with your dog now but if the pedigree is found to be false I think you will be able to sue for the cost of your puppy and possibly damages as you clearly intended for her to have a showing career and presumably the possibility of breeding if she did well.

Surely the breeder would have shown the buyer a copy of eye/hip/elbow certificates from both sire and dam, I know I was, not saying it was the buyers' fault cos we dont know what came about? Maybe the breeder sold them as 'pets only' and wasn't expecting to be caught out with someone showing? Maybe if the OP joins then we can find out.

Dee :)

If they falsified the pedigree it would show the results of the phoney parents which may well have been good, why else claim a false father.  The poster certainly did not do anything wrong in showing even if you say you only want a pet there is nothing to stop you showing only breeding or exporting can be endorsed against but you are right that will probably be what caught the breeder out.

Seems unusual that in a breed with relatively few registrations, this breeder wasn't caught out by the Breed Records Supplement - I would have thought somebody would be on to it as soon as it was published?

M.

Exactly what I was thinking. Having owned leonbergers for 10 years I know the Leo club stud book checks all litters and I'm positive this wouldn't have been missed, because the stud book receives all registered litters from the KC. And to be exhibiting the dog must have been KC regd.
If the OP would like to PM me, just click on my name, and let me know which show and name of your dog, I will have a look for you.
To be honest, I think this is just another WUM. But we'll see if I'm proved wrong
and contacted. :)

Unfortunately unless the guest registers they cannot PM you.

I'm with you on this one leomad. On the 15th we had a 'guest' slating off a leo breeders' house, two in march wanted  a leo breeder to mate their dogs with GSDs (as if) and if I remember correctly another guest said a breeder had un-registered litters, and yet another had too many litters from the same bitch. It seems to me that someone out there is using champdogs for their own personal grudge against one or more leo breeders knowing this is a well read forum.

Exactly!!!!

I think it may be worth posting this thread and the fact there has been a spate of these to the leo club secretary so they can investigate a possible problem affecting them in or outside their breed.

Thank you, I think I might just do that

Hi Brainless

Ive done that already... :)

Leomad, have pm'd you

So have I :)

Have had the following note from Sarah Sevastopulo

"Many thanks for sending me this - I can help if the question asker contacts me direct. It is probably someone stirring it again. We have a website with all Leonbergers and their pedigrees on it www.leonbergerstudbook.co.uk and these are checked through the KC BRS. We do not however know when Leos die !! But those shown etc are seen regularly. You can add this to the list if you wish.
Thanks again,"
Regards Sarah

I think she has posted as a guest asking the poster to get in touch

Can someone in the know let us know if the guest ends up e-mailing Sarah? If they havnt bothered then we know for sure this is a wum post

Received:

"If the guest who had a problem with her Leo and its pedigree would like to e-mail me direct I will help her solve the problem. Regards Sarah (LCGB Secretary) oldholbans@tiscali.co.uk