We have put a deposit down on a black labrador puppy with a breeder.  We were a bit worried because the parents have not been hip scored but our worries were put to rest as the breeder has both parents and 3 generations of grandparents which look fit and healthy.  Im still a little bit worried as ive heard labs are prone to problems in this area??  

It's always a gamble. Good hip-scoring parents can produce crippled offspring; dogs with appalling hips can appear healthy. If both parents are unscored you are taking an enormous gamble, which might, as in my case, pay off, and you have no problems at all. However, if there are hip problems down the line you have absolutely no legal comeback whatsoever. Caveat emptor. Buyer beware.
:)

Now i am going to throw the cat among the pidgeons.  The breeder has both stud and bitch, neither of which are hipscored!!!!! You mention nothing about current eye certificate.  What were the hipscore of the 3 generations of the other dogs and bitches, and previous eye test results.  Please,  all of the above send alarm bells ringing.  I would also hazard a guess that these Lab pups are Chocolate????  I have a beautiful bitch, which for all the world LOOKS fit and healthy, but she has the highest hipscore on Labrador records!!!!!!!  I am really concerned for you. 

I have to echo Kayc here, except for the chocolate - as you mention black pup ;).  I have a lab with HD, and you would never know to see him - the only way you can know is by xray and scoring.  I would also be concerned - a good breeder wants to breed the very best pups they can and will have no hesitation in getting the relevant tests done (minimum eyes and hips in labs).  I cannot understand why they are prepared to risk their future pups developing problems, and why they haven't bothered to get them tested

Ooops missed the black pup bit, sorry, but principle is still the same regardless of colour.

Thought so Kayc;), but I understand why you thought it might be chocolate.

Guest, the overiding thing that would concern me is that if they are prepared to breed without taking the relevant health tests, what other shortcuts are they taking and how much care and thought are they really putting into this litter.  Personally, I'd avoid them.

Hi
The trouble is, even if you have seen parents and grandparents and they LOOK okay, there is nothing to say that they ARE. I have a Golden Retriever with VERY severe HD (hip score 48/48 !!!) and you could not tell there was ANYTHING wrong with his hips until he turned 6. Then he went downhill all at once. So I'd be worried. There is no guarantee that low scoring parents will have low scoring pups, but at least the odds are better.

Marianne

I had a BC who had a score of 34:34=68 he never had any pain or arthritis but obviously I never bred from him as that would have been irresponsible towards his possible puppies & owners

MM, same here, with all the treatments Penny is getting, and with the warmer weather, there is no outward sign of her HD or arthritis.  At the moment she can outrun all my lot, the only noticable difference is the rest can stand on hind legs, Penny just bounces lol.  It is such a shame, as Penny has the most beautiful Lab head I have ever seen.  I keep thinking if only I could place Pennys head on Tia's body. :P:  Pennys hip score is 96 total with arthritis showing on x-ray at just 18months. Both parents and gparents etc, all had low scores, well below breed average. I had intended to breed with Penny but will never be able to do that

Breeding from unscored dogs is totally irresponsible and completely beyond comprehension.
Kay

I know someone on another forum who took this gamble, however they didnt actually KNOW that hipscoring should be done.

They do now!

Their pup is now 11 months old, and in a lot of pain, he is doing well, because although his owners were relatively clueless when they got him, fortunately they are NTO the type to turn a blind eye, or dump him in a rescue......

This dog (yes this one IS a chocolate lab) has horrendous hips and for a while could barely walk, there is talk of operations and all sorts and he has cost his new owners a fortune, not just in money but in heartache and emotions.

Hip Dysplasia is both a genetic thing AND a nuture thing..... you could have a good pup with good hips bred from parents with ace hips, but make him fat, over exercise him, let him hurtle up and down the stairs and bounce around and you could concievably cause problems.

However, to take the risk of buying from someone who admits they havent hip scored, and believes that the fact their other dogs LOOK healthy is a good reason NOT to do this is quite frankly stupid. Breeders like these are part of the reason WHY hip dysplasia is so common!

Em

Brett went swimming every day from the day after I had his hip scored(Jill Read was spot on with his score)He never had any arthritis & was always a really well muscled dog. He was still ok the day I had to have him PTS with cancer of the spleen at 12 1/2 last year

My next puppy will be from working ISDS parents who have been hip scored & eye tested-no guarantee of course but at least his breeder does all the checks & more pedigree research than most people for suitability etc doesn't mean he will have good hips but at least he will have the best of starts

I would never buy a dog from untested parents even if I was really desperate

I always wanted a weimeraner, but one with a tail.  The only undocked litter I could find was where both sire and dam were owned and neither had been hip scored.  This was a *pet* litter and the reason they werent scored was because the vet said that HD is environment related more than genetics, needless to say I didnt buy a pup and ended up with Irish Setters instead :D :D