The Kennel Club is asking that puppies should be banned from being sold from pet shops to be included in the new Animal Welfare Bill. I think we should all be supporting the Kennel Clubs stance on this issue, as it something that all the campaigning groups against puppy faming have been asking for for a very long time. If you feel as strongly about this issue as I do then perhaps you would care to write to your MP.   

well considering I have the dreaded petsville in sutton down the road I'm 1000% behind this I'm sick of seeing the pups in those cages it's not right.

Dis you see the little chihuahua in there last week it was £1900. Horrible place loads of different pups in cages.

I refuse to enter that store, I've avoided it since I was 11 too heartbreaking, I would never ever purchace anything from that place I want it shut down asap. Poor little chi how would it cope :( ok gonna cry now

is there any leaflets or posters that can be downloaded to educate people about the plight of these petshop puppies?  there is a large superstore near us that churns out loads of different breeds and people are still buying from them!  am wanting to put up some posters etc at work to try and persuade people not to go there,
thanks,
kelly

So what happens to pups born to ordinary people and which they cannot or make no serious effort to sell to private owners and may use a local petshop as an outlet?

I think the emphasis on pedigree breeds should be dropped, they are not the majority of dogs and their lives are not more important than non-pedigree dogs.

If those people are given an escape-route from their responsibilities they're more likely to allow the situation to recur.
:(

Responsible breeders don't make little or no effort to place their puppies in life long homes.  The people you are talking about are the ones already supplying the stores and should be discouraged at every turn.  The emphasis on pure bred don't is not the cause of this trade.  If there was only mongrels in the world there would still be outlets like this for breeders who don't care where their puppies go and people either ignorant or uncaring about where they get them from.  Don't forget many of the customers just would not qualify to get a puppy from a responsible breeder or rehoming centre.
Scratchy, unfortunately these stores, and indeed their suppliers, are not breaking any laws so any leaflets or posters would have to be worded very carefully to avoid libel. 

If petshops were compelled by law to have very large posters in their windows stating that the puppies sold from those premises came from irresponsible breeders who couldn't care less about their fate (which is obviously true is they can't or won't make serious efforts to find them permanent homes), then perhaps fewer of the public would be conned into buying them.

:) Oh, if only!

Isabele

>The people you are talking about are the ones already supplying the stores and should be discouraged at every turn. <

davdee
No, the suppliers you are talking about- not me-are well organised buissness people, full or part time, breeding this and that for profit both as a full time buissness or part time buisness.

Most have shrewd buissness minds, feasible business plans, a proven ability to make profit from breeding dogs for business purposes, plenty of experience at legal routs to follow to get rid off their product, i.e. pups of any kind.

.The people I am talking about are the hundreds of  thousands of ordinary dog owners, very much the majority of dog owners, some unemployed some who get a dog without much more than an impulse thought beyond "I think I'll get a dog for the kids" or "I want dog, so so and so down the road has one for sale I'll get that".

These people are not breeders even in the widest interpretation of the word. Many just let their dog have a litter or it gets caught out at random, many of their friends ask them to - "Have pups so I can I can have one" - -"Yes that's a good idea so I will" - others don't care and if the dog gets caught out and pregnant time after time it does not matter to them, many of these sell what's left over to the local pet shop or any other commercial outlet.

Loot and other papers are full of such adds, very few people like this even think about how they are going to deal with a litter once its born. Staffs are supposed to be the most popular breed in the country and the vast majority of them in the cities have no pedigree and they are always being bred in cities just on a whim.

Its not just Staffs which proportion of the breed do not have pedigrees GSDs are another breed of which very few have papers and of pet breeds which do have some kind of documentation thousands simply do not register their litters. The average dog owner has never even heard of KC and KC has not got the slightest clue about the average dog and its owner/potential buyer.

Many of these private owners do sell to people they know and then find they have some left over which they then either sell  outright to a local pet shop or let the pet shop have them and get commission from the pet shop for those which it sells.

As far as the buissness breeders already mentioned they would just flood ebay and almost certainly ebay would attract  ordinary onwers with surplus pups to those who either (a) had internet access at home or (b) those who would simply walk into a cybercafe and join ebay from there.

Selling pups, of any kind, is a profitable business and banning sales from pet shops or stores would simply drive it underground-good heavens drugs are sold outside schools in full view of CCTV- at least if pups are sold in petshops their immediate welfare is on display and at least monitoring of the conditions is accessible to those who should take interest in monitoring pup health in these retail outlets, if it went underground that would cease.

So to repeat my point and question. If outlets such as pet shops/stores were banned from selling these dogs how would it benefit the welfare of dogs? what would happen to these dogs? They will be born make no mistake about that and a current national outlet i.e. pet shops and stores will not be available to give these pups some chance, what happens to them?.

>As far as the buissness breeders already mentioned they would just flood ebay and almost certainly ebay would attract  ordinary onwers with surplus pups to those who either (a) had internet access at home or (b) those who would simply walk into a cybercafe and join ebay from there.

It's against ebay's rules to sell live animals through them, and such adverts are routinely removed.

You're right, very many breeders have litters for the usual reasons of 'it's nice for the kids to see the miracle of birth' etc, but if such people have an escape route through which they can profit from their folly and lack of responsibility, they'll never see the point of changing. As long as selling pups, whether pedigree or not, through pet shops remains legal then it will be seen to be acceptable, and the puppy farmers laugh all the way to the bank while their stock suffers.

Whilst I agree with the point you are making about individuals buying a puppy/ dog and then breeding from it on a whim and selling the puppies in the free ad papers to make money and then repeating the excercise at the next season and so forth. In general these are not the individuals that are keeping the pet shops, pet superstores, (do not forget that some boarding kennels also have a pet shop licence to enable them to buy in and resell puppies too) they are all keeping the trade alive.  These are the ones that are buying in the puppies, that are supporting the puppy farmers and keeping the trade in puppies going. Then on top of this, the general public that insist on purchasing a puppy that cannot be seen with its mother!  If they walked away then it would have a domino effect and the trade in puppies would dry up.  Because the last thing a pet shop wants is puppies sitting waiting to be sold when they have have become too old and have lost their baby cute look. 
I cannot understand why someone walks in a pet shop and willingly hands over as much as £500 plus and many times much more for a puppy that has a dubious background whos' parentage invariably cannot be verified, has been breed irresponsibly, suffers far too often from a hereditary complaint. On top of that worms, fleas, lice, are not uncommon, together with gastro enteritis and parvo.  The paperwork is mostly incorrect too. Then when the puppy falls sick after a few days they and only then do they start to question why and realise that there puppy has possibly been bred on a puppy farm in Wales or S Ireland.  Why didn't they ask this question before purchase where is the mother of the puppy? Not in the retail outlet obviously, cannot be seen, then walk away.
Think of the breeding bitch subjected to producing a litter every season. Often living in a converted barren barn or pig sty, with no comfort. Maybe some even in purpose built kennels, it makes no odds, the breeding bitch will still be a breeding machine to produce those puppies sold from pet shops at an large over inflated prices.
It is a very cruel trade that only makes the breeder and pet shop rich, very rich and it has got to be halted. You work out how much money a breeder makes having 50 labrador breeding bitches (and many puppy farmers and commercial breeders have more - one has 150 +) producing a litter of 10 pups every six months 50 x 10 = 500 x 2 = 1,000 pups in one year! OK you can say that these are exagerated figures, maybe they are but only slightly but that individual is making a mint of money, just because the public insist on buying a puppy from a pet shop. Don't, think of the breeding bitch and do not help the breeder and pet shop get rich on something that cannot speak for itself - the puppy and its mum.                 

Unfortunately no matter how much education is put about there will always be people who, because they could not offer a decent life to a dog in terms of time or lifestyle, would never be allowed to buy one from a responsible breeder or pass the vetting of a good rescue place.  I sometimes wonder what happens to the many people that I have refused a puppy to, some may have squeaked in under a more lenient breeder's rules but many I'm sure would not get one from anyone who loved their puppies.  Most gave me no hope that what I said had persuaded them that they cannot offer a puppy a reasonable home so presumably they will have been more than happy to buy a puppy in this way and hang the consequences.
They are the reason I think we are all banging our heads on a wall about this issue.

Wot we all seem to forget is the puppy farm/breeder does not get a lot for there pups they are sold to a dealer who then sales on to the pet shops very few pet shops buy direct from the breeder one of the main dealers for London pet shops lives in Herts.
Wot a lot dont see is where the pups are kept iv been in one of the bigger pet shops in East London and saw pups in plastic bins in a room away from the shop this is to stop the puppys from barking also they give the puppys some sort of drugs as if anyone who breeds knows how playfull pups are but you go into any pet shop/outlet all the puppys seem to do is sleep?

Davedee

>>>So to repeat my point and question. If outlets such as pet shops/stores were banned from selling these dogs how would it benefit the welfare of dogs?>>>

Impulse buying would be reduced as prospective owners would have to make the effort to find a breeder and maybe travel a little further.

The horrendous conditions of some puppy farms would be more likely to be exposed with buyers visiting.

The conditions of transport endured by very young puppies in the hands of dealers would cease to exist.  A dealer once told me (many years ago) that bulk buying/transporting was cost effective so covering any losses during transport.

>>> what would happen to these dogs? They will be born make no mistake about that and a current national outlet i.e. pet shops and stores will not be available to give these pups some chance, what happens to them?.>>>

If pet shops are banned from selling, fewer dogs will be bred, there will be more room in our rescue shelters.  Owning a dog will be become more of a privilege and less of a whim.  JMO

Julie

Why can't they also try to include puppy farms in the bill as well as pet shops?

The problem there lies in defining 'puppy farm'.