I am fuming but strangely calm :D

We bought some very expensive sofas last April, in a sandy colour. A pair, each with a manual recliner on the end.

Around 6 months ago, i noticed a mark on the recliner footrest and thought it was just dirt, however more appeared and we realised the leather was appearing to flake off, leaving some underneath. Now, this is not really where the feet go, but on the ends where the leather is stretched.

I was a bit miffed, because we had had long talks with the salesman about tough leather, due to our dog leaping onto the sofa. We did choose the toughest we could afford, and I even remember scratching the samples to ensure the leather would last.

Now, just a year later, we have had the upholsterer come round and tell me "It's wear and tear" and that this does not come under the Sale of Goods Act. Have just spoken to Trading Standards and it's possible she is correct, but I intend to fight this , first by writing a letter to the furniture retailer and sending by recorded delivery.

I am just gobsmacked that a very good make of furniture (G plan) is so flipping shoddy!!

To add insult to injury, she mentioned the recliners were sold with plastic foot parts and had we cut them off? NO we hadn't, we have tucked them out of sight; but no-one wants to sit with stupid plastic footrests under their feet, with manufacturer's wording on, anyway!!

Anyone else had  a similar problem? Please share!

Lindsay
X

I don't think that is reasonable wear and tear at all, our leather suite is now about 22 years old and probably wants changing :) but up until about 3 years ago there was not a sign of wear on it and we have always shared it with the dogs.

hi yes we had a new sofa and chairs last august and although its doing alright at the moment the sales man wanted us to take out insurance with them which i was prepared to do untill he told me it didnt protect against ware and tare,or stains due to curry or wine ! or childrens crayons or biro or damage coarsed by pets such as chewing or scratches. since my house is full of children and dogs and we always have a curry and a glass of wine at the weekend it seemed a total waste of money so i can well believe the problems you are having .

I know Dylans, I feel the insurance is very wrong sometimes; you end up thinking "well what exactly are we protected against then?!"

I tend to not get out the extra insurance now because it's not that helpful.

Lindsay
X

I agree totally Isabel!

If our sofa was say, even 5 years old I wouldn't mind quite so much, although I certainly wouldn't recommend G Plan again! But less than a year, for recliners which they know people rest their feet on, is a complete farce!

To be honest it's not wear and tear really; i feel it's a problem with the leather or the manufacturing process.
I kick the recliners footrest hard when i click it back into place: there are no scuff marks there, on the flat surface. Strangely the flaking is around the parts where the leather is stretched over a bendy bit such as a corner...

Lindsay
X

Well we got our Leather Navy settees 4 years ago, they cost us a fortune but have been well worth it. They both recline to lay flat, very relaxing, and have had absolutely no problems and if I actually bothered to clean them more they would look as good as new. I even wash them with washing up liquid I doubt I am meant to use that, but it works. Ours have had 4 years of abuse from the kids too, jumping on them etc and spilling all sorts of stuff on them. We got them from Courts and they were £2000 a piece.

Hi Gplan doesn't exsist anymore it went under in 1993 my partner stripped the factory out while he was at Uni.As far as I know from him the Gplan name is used under licence and would be made by someone else probably not very good although my partner is a cabinet maker didn't rate Gplan anyway before they went under.

Briony

God I thought about having leather but think I'll decide against it.  I have had two SWD's jump up at me when I've been drinking red wine and not at my house either :d  One time it went all over ther persons sofa where myself and a number of SWD nutters, oooops I mean fanatics were staying, oh and all over my head.  I looked like the Phantom of the Opera.  Then 2 weeks I was having a lovely meal at another SWD owners house when one of her dogs just leaped up into the air without any prior warning straight onto my lap, resulting in red wine all over the kitchen and my brand new top :d

I do still feel leather is good - having a hairy dog i got so fed up of having to clean our material sofa all the time, hairs got everywhere LOL. In many ways i prefer the cosy look of material though!
Sounds as if you have a lot of fun with your SWD's ;)

Lindsay
x

Yeah Lindsay Spanish Water Dogs are wonderful it's just their mad owners that you've got to watch out for :d

GPlan factory still in Glasgow I believe if it is the same G-plan we are talking about ;-) but under Morris furniture.

Edit to add I think the gplan suites etc were sold of but the cabinet making bit is now done in Glasgow..
http://www.gplancabinets.co.uk/cms/cmsfiles/about_us/about_us787.asp

Hi Briony, and Blue: I didn't know that about G plan - you live and learn! One of the reasons we chose them was because they have been going for so long and we had G Plan furniture in the family home

Lindsay
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Hi Tigerlily,

What's a Leather Navy settee, is it a particular shape like a Chesterton?

<< Ours have had 4 years of abuse from the kids too, ...>>

Ours has only had the dog leaping onto it every now and then! <g>

Lindsay
X

Sorry I worded that all wrong, navy is the colour as in navy blue!

Hi Lindsay,

Trouble with leather furniture is that there are so many different grades of leather - and unfortunately not always reflected in the price point :(  It's important to establish how a leather has been treated for colour ie. if buying a cream/stone leather sofa is the leather that colour all the way through or is the light colour basically dyed as a "spray on" effect on top of a much darker skin.  It takes very little wear and tear or even just sunlight hitting certain spots to reveal cheaply mass produced skins - as I said, not necessarily cheap to buy.  We did a LOT of research on our leather suites before purchasing and have to say although they cost a heck of a lot of they are dyed through and through the same colour so don't show any variations in shading etc despite quite heavy abuse from the Belgians (as trampolines!) and me being rather over zealous with cleaning (although I'm careful to feed the leather every couple of months to prevent drying out from central heating etc.  In your case I'd certainly press on hard with a complaint - it sounds as though you've been well and truly ripped off.  Good luck, Teri :)  

Definatley go for it and see if you can get anywhere -- i certainly owuldnt expect a leather sofa to wear out due to a bad design fault, in a year.

That IS what this is after all, either poor quality leather where the grain and colouring has worn off where its stretched, OR a bad design putting too much strain on the leather, or more than likely both!

There is a lot of very poor quality upholstery leather out there, its pretty cheap to make and looks nice for about half an hour if you dont really know what you are looking at ( and even if you do in some cases) and when you are buying furniture you really CANT check the quality of the leather at all!

I would be VERY angry!

Em

Hiya Em

<< This IS what this is after all, either poor quality leather where the grain and colouring has worn off where its stretched, OR a bad design putting too much strain on the leather, or more than likely both! >>

Exactly! This is what i feel :).
We visited loads of shops and most of the leather, although looking lovely, was obviously not going to cope with a dog leaping onto it. So we kept looking and this leather did seem the best at the time

Apparently they also re stuff the sofas, so we were really hoping this sofa would last us for ever one way and another.

Lindsay
x

Hi Teri,

We spent ages looking around for a good leather suite (our first, bought with money from my father's estate :( ) and asked about the suitability for this particular leather for dogs etc...I even scratched the sample with my finger nails LOL. We chose to buy the tougher more expensive leather. I feel really let down on this. I hate to think you may be right, and that although generally the whole suite was expensive, the leather may be not so good.

Where it's flaked away, there is darker underneath, but not sure if that is just where the leather has become rougher underneath and so has captured more dirt.

My friend has exactly the same sofa, a Chloe, but with no recliners. Hers has stayed in beautiful condition, and her Flatcoat and Retriever rub up against it every day but no sign of so called wear and tear! The same with the other parts of our sofa, Banya leaps on it every day and we have no problem with the leather at all; I feel the problem is with the recliners and the leather on them.

Out of interest Teri, what sofas/leather did you decide upon? :)

Lindsay
X

If the letter avenue doesn't work (Make sure it is addressed directly to the CEO of the company, always worth getting his name) Also make sure in the letter that you state that you followed the treatment recommended by the manufacturer. It is also under 12 months old so should come under a guarantee ? Leather doesn't just 'flake off' ? I would consider getting a second opinion from an independant furniture restorer and see what they say :)

Lucy
xx

I believe getting a second opinion from someone independent usually costs about £200 so that will be a last resort (if we got to the small claims court stage) but hopefully that won't happen!

Anyone with half a brain knows a sofa should not be flaking with just a few months of normal use. It's not as if we've been wearing outdoor shoes on the sofa, or hit it with a cricket bat <g>

Thanks Lucy :)

Lindsay
X

we paid alot of money for our sofa 3 yrs ago and its brilliant . still in the same condition as we bought it in :) no flakes nothing , every few months you do have to look after leather as it can dry out .clean then protect and shine it :) Independant Inspectors often as for about £150 for an inspection if it goes to court then you could end up paying another £150 should the judge ask the two inspectors of both sides to meet up ,
and court costs , of course should you win you would be able to claim back all that :) £200 is max one person can claim a day at court ;)

Lindsay,

This is not acceptable IMO.  We bought two "Lazeeboy" leather two seater reclining sofas in navy blue in 1999.  They cost £3,500 at the time and are America made.  The leather looks as good today as it did then.  Fight this one - G-Plan used to be a reputable company.  This is NOT how reputable companies behave

Good luck!

Thanks everyone, I'll come back on here and let you know the outcome!

Lindsay :)
X

Hi Lindsay,

We used to live in a very small house with a tiny living room, and at the time it was only my husband and I, so we decided to just get one leather sofa. Off we went to Courts on a Sunday afternoon 1/2 an hour before they closed(!!) but we were determined we were going to get a sofa ordered before we left. We left 10 mins after closing having ordered our sofa and feeling a bit unhappy at the 8 weeks delivery date (which actually turned into a 16 weeks delivery date!!)

A year down the line, we noticed the same 'peeling' effect you have explained. We did exactly the same as you, tried to get it sorted through the "cover", but no luck we went through Trading Standards and they couldn't do anything. So we could do nothing. We went through a 3 year fight with them, to try and get them to do something, by which point we had already moved house once, and were on the verge of moving again!

We gave up in the end, when we moved into this house which has a huge living room, we decided that we needed more than one sofa anyway, and we went to all of the furniture shops we could find, and explained to them the fight we had had with Courts, and they said about the different grades of leather, and that what we had bought was a dye sprayed on to the leather, and it was this dye that was peeling off. They told us about going for the leather that had been dyed all of the way through, also that we would be better with a sofa that you can actually take the cushions off, for ease of cleaning and to be able to see what whether the seats were made of proper springs or sponge (which had been a problem with our first sofa).

We searched every where and found a few sofas that had been dyed through, but hardly any that had zipped cushions, then we found it!!! The most comfortable, dyed through, zipped cushioned sofa we had ever seen! It was nearly £5000 for a 3 seat sofa and a 2 seat sofa but we thought it was worth it. L

ess than 6 weeks later it was here no problems what so ever, even with the lovely furry cushions that I had fallen in love with in the store, that when I asked if they were included with the sofas, I was told they were for sale for £50 each, so we decided to look for other ones! We have only had them for about 18 months now and apart from them looking better the more they are sat on (and jumped on by our now 3 year old son!!) they are still as gorgeous as the day they arrived!

Also I have a good tip for you, the best thing to clean any leather sofa with is a feather duster (ours gets very dusty on the back where no one ever touches it) and then go over with baby wipes. It gets it all nice and clean, it is damp so it gives the leather a bit of moisture, it leaves no residue, and it doesn't make it shiny like polish can, and it smells lovely afterwards!!

Good luck with your fight, I hope you get further than we did!

Natalie

Hi Natalie,

Thanks for your story, sorry you didn't manage to get anything out of Courts :( Did you go to the small claims court at all, or get an independent upholsterer in to give their verdict? I know those are some of the avenues we can go down. I've also been in touch with "Qualitas" who are an independent organisation which many furniture retailers now belong to.

I don't think your experience bodes very well for our complaint, but we can only try :).

I feel it is absolutely dreadful that companies can get away with this shabby treatment of their customers! A year is nothing and leather should last longer; when it does finally start showing its age, it should be in a pleasant way (ie as in an old shabby but comfy armchair) and not by peeling and flaking IMO.

Thanks for the tips re the cleaning etc, I have heard baby wipes are very good; my friend is a horsey person and so uses saddle soap which is also very good.

Thanks again for your input, it's much appreciated.

Lindsay
X

Hi Lindsay,

You are completely right about companies just wanting their money, and not worrying about customer service or satisfaction (mind you, it was a very nice feeling to hear that Courts had gone into liquidation!!!) from the moment we ordered our sofa to the time we gave up and ordered some new sofas, they did nothing but lie, accuse us of being liars, and basically do anything they could to make sure they weren't liable for anything.

It started as I say when we ordered the sofa, the woman that took our order was quite rude, and seemed not bothered at all, but we thought it was because we were keeping her at work late, and it was a Sunday so all she probably wanted to do was go home and enjoy the rest of the weekend, what was left of it. Anyway she sold us a sofa, and an insurance policy (£150 for five years) but it was an extra policy that covered wear and tear, and also it would replace old for new (so if they couldn't fix the problem, then we would get a new sofa, which would then effectivly restart the cover for another 5 years on the replacement sofa) which we thought was well worth it, the lady said the sofa would be 8 weeks in coming as because it was made in Italy and it was July, companies like this tend to close with the schools for a summer holidays.

Eight weeks later we had had a telephone call from delivery men saying they were outside our house with a sofa, and nobody is in, I said well I am in because I have answered the phone and I looked out the front door, and couldn't see anything that looked like a delivery van. So we cross referenced the address which was fine until we got to the post code, we lived on a street called Lavender Way in Rushden (Northamptonshire) and these blokes had gone to another town called Rushden, and a Lavender Way, in a different part of the country! Considering we odered it from Northamptons Courts we thought this was really clever! So I asked him when he would be at our house, and I got told that we would have to pay another delivery charge, because we had given them the wrong post code, apart from the fact that we had never heard of another Lavender Way at another Rushden, even if we had gotten a part of our post code wrong, what are the chances of it being wrong but also being exactly the same as the one for this other Lavender Way? So we had a week of arguing about the delivery charge until we said we would either meet them half way with the delivery charge or we would come and pick it up ourselves (the later meaning the hiring of a van, but we would have rather paid the van company more money than what Courts were going to get out of us!!!)

So at 9 and 1/2 weeks after we had decided to meet them half way with the delivery cost (another £40) It was a Thursday it was supposed to come, so I waited in, and I waited and waited and waited, nothing came all day, no phone calls, or sofas. By this time I was about 5 months pregnant, using a blow up airbed as a couch, because our house was so small we had had to get rid of our old sofa before the new one arrived, I rang them up about 5.30 and they said they had no knowledge of the sofa being delivered on this day, and that it had actually been sent back to Italy the day before, as they couldn't store it at the store any longer!

These sorts of things went on for another 6-7 weeks, until it finally arrived after going on its travels back to Italy, and on the plastic sheet covering it, it had some Spanish writing so I don't know if it went for a mini cruise or something (perhaps it had never come from or been back to Italy at all??)

A couple of days after the sofa arrived they sent the insurance policy through the post, which on closer inspection didn't cover wear and tear and certainly didn't offer the new for old part that had really been why we had taken the cover out, so we rang them and they had said that their policies had been changed two weeks ago, and that there is only one policy available and this was it, so we asked for our money back, which took about 9 months(!!!), by which point I had had the baby, we had moved house, and the very first signs of the peeling had began (which I mistook for the first signs or the old cosy armchair marks that you describe).

About 2 months later when it was clear it had started peeling, we were so fed up of them we didn't know if we should just give up then, but my OH rang Trading Standards and told them the whole story, and they did give us some light at the end of the tunnel, they said that because at the time we paid for it (not wanting to carry hundred £££'s of cash with us) by credit card, they said that if Court's would agree to take the sofa back, and then if they messed about with the refund, that our credit card money can claw the money back from Court's, which we thought was great, the trouble was getting Court's to agree to take the dam thing back!

We went through the C.A.B., we looked up our selves the legal side of our argument, we had our solicitor look into it, we did everything we could, but because we had cancelled the insurance policy, which they mis-sold us in the first place, we didn't have a leg to stand on, everyone we spoke to had said that legally Court's were in the right, and that only morally had they questions to answer.

As I said yesterday this went on for another 2 years or so, until we gave up. It is something that always annoys you, even as I am writing this I can feel my hands tightening up!!! As it is, in some ways I am quite pleased that it turned out the way it did, else we wouldn't have the gorgeous sofa's we have now, but I just wish it wasn't so much of a pain in the backside! (especially at 7 months pregnant sitting on an air bed!! When the sofa did eventually come I took great pleasure in popping that bed!!!)

I hope you have more luck than we did! Sorry for the long post, but it is difficult to slim it down anymore without leaving out major details.

Natalie

Hi Natalie,

Thanks so much for posting all of that, it's very helpful and interesting to know that you even got your solicitor involved and to no avail because Courts were legally in the right (although, as you say, not morally!! ).

It's times like this i wish "That's Life" was still around. I may try to contact one of the consumer programmes at some stage, but we shall see what happens...I do wish I had known about G Plan being taken over, because I would have had faith in the old company. We had their furniture for years in our family home - in fact, I still have one of their sideboards in my living room, as solid as ever!

Take care,
Lindsay
X

Hi Lindsay

I understand your anger at the length of time the sofa has lasted and would probably fire off a couple of letters just to see what happens.

However there is expensive and expensive, we thought about replacing out 23 year old suite a couple of years ago and decided to live with it because to replace it with similar quality in draylon would cost about £6500. However this does give you a 20 year guarantee on the frame. This is because it is made to 'traditional' standards.

Unfortunately peoples perception of price for suites has been squewed by the fact that you can buy one for a couple of hundred pounds. However as with many things in this life you do tend to get what you pay for and we found that anything other than the likes of Parker Knowle or Lazy boy just doesnt have 'proper' quality materials and workmanship. So long as you dont change your house/taste ever few years they work out cheeper in the end. As I say ours is neary 25 years old and the only real problem with it is where the cats have used it to sharpen their nails!  So £6500/25 makes it £260 per year, which starts to look good value compaire to some of the cheep alternatives.

Good luck with getting your problem resolved. If all else fails it may be worth contacting a consumer program such as the one on 3 counties radio, who would at least be able to advise you of your options and often get results just by being part of the beeb.  

Hi Bluebell,

Our G Plan sofa cost around £3000 which we thought was lots of money - however, had i known what was to happen, I would have rather spent more and got a really good strong sofa that would last almost a lifetime! :( I always considered G Plan to be on par with Parker Knoll but was I wrong! Thought I was buying quality, but again, was wrong. It is very frustrating and has in some ways dented my confidence in actually getting other items in the future; it seems no company is to be trusted, and the Sale of Goods Act isn't as helpful as I always believed it to be.

I'm still composing the letter and ensuring i don't say something which later they can use against me (ie I'm not actually going to refer to "wear and tear" or even alleged wear and tear because they may suggest I agree it is wear and tear and not their bad leather which is the problem).

Thanks every body for your very useful advice and comments :)
Keep your fingers crossed for me!

Lindsay
X

Hi,

Personally if you want *quality* go to a quality cabinet maker (partner is one) choose your own hardwood get made to a design of your choice or a copy.My partner is also a very experienced french polisher as well as ahighly skilled cabinet maker complete with a BA (HONS) degree as well as many other qualifications being making funiture since 14yrs old (comes fromy family of cabinet makers so its in his blood so to speak :-) )Basically personal opion what you see in the shops most are rubbish take alook at the joints most are glued not hand cut proper dovetails even the factory dovetails are not as good.
Depending on what your wanting they are not as expensive as you might think and certainly get a well crafted piece of furniture and not something that is mass produce with corners cut made to look expenive and good quality when in actual fact most hardwood cabinet makers would tell you exactly how its been made basically rubbish.

Briony

Ive gotta say i agree with Briony.

Since i started making leather stuff....it really HAS hit home how much people are settling for poor quality goods, because its a cheap initial price.

My dad still has a three piece suite, a fabric one, sort of cordroy ish stuff, it is MY AGE, and yes its got some wear where several generatiosn of cats have used it as a scratching post. It has also survived two children bouncing on it, using it as a trampoline, a bed, somewhere to hide half eaten sweets etc..... but there is no knackered bits from people just using it as a sofa, nothing like that!

People have forgotten how much work, effort and TIME goes into making an item properly, so taht it looks good and lasts for years.
Companies are not interested in making £10'000 out of one person in 25 years, they would rather make £3'000 out of one person every 2 or 3 years.

People no longer expect the items they buy to last them much longer than the guarantee, which is why these days you CANNOT buy a dishwasher that will last you 15 years, or a washer or a telly (mines 20 years old!) or ANYTHING......

People dont want to save up for things any more, they want it NOW and so companies offer credit... but you cant offer credit on a suite that costs 10k, so give them a crap one that falls apart after they paid it off and they will be back for another one.

Because people by cheap crap that doesnt last, theres nothing to hand on to future generations.....

We have a throwaway society who are more interested in cheap rubbish that lasts just longer than the guarantee than they are in quality craftsmanship, and it makes me damn angry tbh.
Now, if you go out and look for it, you are hard pushed to FIND good quality stuff.

Back to my own area of interest, if you do a search for dog collars, you will find cheap and not so cheap mass produced rubbish..... in fact you can pay some STUPID amounts o fmoney for garish things encrusted in fake diamonds, that has cost the manufacturer mere PENNIES to make......and will last your dog a few months.

Yet go and see how many people you can find hand making quality gear online?

So far and not including me, i can find three in this country. I think thats shocking!

Lindsay i do hope you get a positive response to your imnsho, VERY valid complaint, however i really do doubt it.

</rant>

Em

Very good points :) When we redecorated our lounge last year, we did think about changing the 3 piece suite. In the end we didn't - we had it cleaned and it now looks as good as new. It hasn't got a mark on it, it's 12 years old and will probably last the same again. It wasn't the cheapest, but value for money. A cheaper one would probably have packed up years ago - particularly with my weight on it :D I'm not bothered about it not being the latest fashion :)

Daisy

I totally agree with the whole throwaway society remarks, it's almost got to a stage where we all expect cheap shoddy goods to last a small amount of time.

What is the world coming to ? 

I will certainly consider seriously a quality cabinet maker or similar next time we need furniture :)

Lindsay
X

Hi,

I totally agree we live in this buy now pay later society to get the goods we want so we can have the latest things.Personally it put pressure on people puts them in finiacial strife and the goods are not built to last or particuly (sp)well made ading insult to injury.

Nobody wants to wait and save anymore to get an excellent product and having the satisfaction knowing you saved hard its all paid for and I think you apprciate it far more.

Its good to hear Lindsay that people are cooming to the traditional cabinet maker for pieces of furniture.Depending obviously on your requirements it can be no more expensive than in well known shops and you get traditiomal hand crafted piece out of good quality hardwood to your choice of finish
with all traditional methods used, and there is just no compassion to fine dining table seating for 12 made out of beautiful hardwood then traditinally french polished desined either by the cabinet maker,yourself or similar copy.You get exactly what your wanting  to fit your home.

People think cabinet maker expensive - as i say not necessarily true but y far a better piece .

What ever happen to saving up and paying cash instead of credit cards yes u may have to wait longer but then your really sure of what your wanting
all paid for.
Same with puppies everyone one yesterday ie ven had a enquiry did i take credit card for a puppy :-o  I wont repeat what i said to that.

Briony

The only thing I would say on this, and it doesn't include me, as I have bought our sofas, and sourced furniture from India, so we know it will last years, however a lot of people do change their decoration every 3 or 4 years (sometimes even more) and so like to change their furniture along with it.

Also that, these sofas that you can get now, that are like 'buy one get one free' and things, are sometimes the only way people can afford to get a new suite. My Mum has had 3 new sofas in about 11 years, and this is because she could only afford the cheaper ones, even though she knew they wouldn't last very long. She now has some leather ones which are more of an investment than a price because you can see they will last for years and years, but she just couldn't do that before.

I was very lucky to marry a man, who works hard for his money, we are certainly no where near 'well off', but we can afford some of the good things in life, whereas if I had have married someone who didn't enjoy his work as much, we would have been going down the same route as my Mum used to, and not be able to afford any thing else.

Just my two pennies worth :D

Hi,

But in the long run certainly is not cheaper if you have to change it because the cheaper sofa you brought in the first place was still overpriced and didn't last because it was pooly made.

To be honest some of the* better quality made second hand sofas* are still better than the cheap new sofa to be brought and to touch up any wood on them by a quality cabinet maker or re upholster to bring a more up to date look but a piece funiture that will the test of time.

Depends wether u want to throw money waway on these cheaper inferior frames .
THE ONLY PEOPLE THAT MKE MONEY ARE THE CREDIT COMPANIES AND THE SHOP THAT RIP YOU OFF :-(

We are not ultra well off with 5 children and 4 dogs however I too am lucky to have partner that makes quality traditional or modern furniture that can stand the test of time and i know im not being ripped off and i have the better piece furniture always even if i have to wait along time for it as our customers come firdt ;-)

I would sooner make do with second hand and save hard than be ripped off just to have piece now.

Also alot of foreign funiture brought in from Afica and india is load of rubbish the shops buy it in bulk cheap and then sell it over here to the public as something really nice well made (supposedly)over inflated price for what is .With a trained eye it sticks out a mile .

I think today its about more keeping up with the Jones's especially with funiture and cars.

Briony :-)

Hi,

Also worth to point out if you have a local good cabinet maker get them to cast an experience eye over furniture or wood brought in from abraod get them to look how its been made the kind of finish on it and the hardwood that been used to tell you if your getting ripped off for what u just being charged for.Afican and indian woods are still not as good as English  solid walnut,oak or Burr ;-)

Briony :-)

Hi Briony,

My Mum worked hard all of her life, and still does, but despite this, she had a lot of money troubles, which obviously I won't go into, but this left her with HAVING to buy cheaper furniture, even knowing it wouldn't last long, because she couldn't afford any more at that time, I might add she didn't take credit out on any of her suites, she saved from the moment she bought a new one, till it was that worn that she NEEDED to then go and get another one. Now she is in a much better job, that pays her worth, and she was then able to buy the sort of suite that she wanted for years but couldn't have afforded.

The furniture I got from India was not bought in a shop in the UK, it was bought from India, by me, and believe me here is no way the furniture making skills have anything to live up to. It is as solid as the day we bought it, evn after being lumped about in my ever changing ideas of what looks nice where LOL All of the cabinets are very solidly built, and have never shown any sign of stress. Although it was quite expenisve, compared to English made 'wooden' furniture, I would never go back to oak, or wallnut, and I can't wait for to get some age into the cabinets, it is the sort of design that only ever gets better with age!

Others may not like Indian and African woods, but I will always go back to get my furniture from there. I suppose it is all down to personal preference. :D

Natalie

Hi,

I agree if you like that sort thing thats fine,But I yet to see one piece of inian wood crafted as well as any fine Craftsman in this country using a good quality piece of hardwood ;-)

There is only few craftsman in this country my partner one them that can do detail ,carving ,frenchpolishing the lathe  and the fine finishing and workmanship, his sister has also been out to India and Africa and the funiture that was sourced and the wood that was brought back despite paid over odds for was inferior as he said wouldn't put his name too.It may be solid and can be knocked about the top cabinet makers would not rate it.
Bottom line forget any shop wether here or abroad get a top cabinet maker if necessary go out to the wood choose your timber  from the trees or look at timber with the cabinet maker and then have piece funiture made.
I very much doubt you have seen superior quality furniture that a top cabinet maker in this country can do because you won't find it in any shop they use cheaper cabinet makers with less experience and skill to keep cost down.
However each our own :-)
I for many years also had second furniure as I could not even afford cheap funiture in shops like your mother ;-) in end inturns out my old 2nd hand was better quality like i said anyway .
It wasnt until i got a better job and a divorce and my new partner being one of the top cabinet makers that I really began to understand wood and its qualities.
Not something that can be told in a shop by a salesman/local indian cabinet maker  ;-).
Then I know im lucky because cabinet making has been in his family for generations and believe me if indian wood was anyway half decent he would be using it :-)
Just our opinins based years upon years of cabinetmaking and we get timbers delivered to us from all over the world :-)

Briony :-)

Hi Briony,

Well, you, or your partner, obviously have a better idea of what would be considered as 'good' wood and 'bad' wood than I do - I am by no means an expert, but having said that, like I said I am more than happy with the quality, and I see no reason why it shouldn't last for many more years, heres hoping anyway, because I am deeply in love with it ;) LOL I love all of the things about it, that possibly someone like your partner that likes perfection wouldn't. I love the bits of knocks on it, and how the iron work is so obviously done by hand, just the things that makes the pieces unique basically, as I say I won't ever go back to English furniture, unless it had these same indifferences about it. I like to look at the units and think where it could have been before, it already looks 'old' when you first get it so it is as if it already has a life time of tales to tell - pretty silly considering its a lump of wood! :D

Natalie

Hi,

An english craftsman can give you anything you wanted including the knocks and bangs and you can have indifferences in English furniture if you so desired.
It comes down to how good the cabinet maker is.Some of the wood my partner has stored and used has centuries of tales to tell ;-D.

Also ALL wood we used from all over the world, also including our English  walnut and Oak comes from renewable sources unlike many Afican and indian woods.
We carefully select our trees where they come from before they are chopped down and planked ;-)

Yes my partner puts alot of love and attetion into each piece of wood and if he didn't get attached he wouldn't love doing what he does :-D and loves to see furniture he has made many years ago when customers come back time and time again for another piece and he remembers where all the knots and crannies are looking as stunning as when he first crafted it.
Presently hes about start a fantasic Grandfather clock for a farmer whose family have grown Walnut trees on the estate years ago and the pattening in the wood is is completley awesome the tree itself is more than few hundred years old :-)History to tell it certainly has.

Briony :-)

That sounds wonderful Briony, I don't lay awake at night thinking of beautiful wood, but it nice to hear someone who is pationate about something :D

Natalie

Hi Natalie,

I know what you mean :-D,we are as passionate about our Koi and dogs as partner is about a piece of furniture,sad I know but often he falls sleep designing and thinking about customer piece of wood or furniture sometimes its infuriating when i say to him " what did i just say" can't remember say it again :-o

Briony :-)

Oh my hubbie only does that when I have let him watch football! But it is great for "telling" him that you are planning a trip to the Trafford Centre on his credit card at the weekend!! :D He then can't say "no way, not after the last time!" after I tell him when he is listening, as he knows he was in the wrong for not listening the first time!!!

Works every time ;) LOL

Natalie

LOL @ Natalie

Briony :-)

Did you pay for the sofa with a credit card?  Just a thought but you might be able to claim compensation down that avenue.
Lara x