just walked flynn up the road from the shop to do the banking. passed a couple trying to post a letter who had a westie on a lead. this westie went NUTS, barking agressivly jumping,standing on its hind legs, & what did the owners do? nothing,didnt even look at it!!!!
do people think that because its a little dog (& they can hang onto it) that its ok?

THEN thesetwo blokes went passed  & one said  "Gooo westie" in a sarcastic voice, then it darted out & tryed to bite his ankles,still nothing was said.

flynn just looked at this dog as if to say,"what on earth is wrong with you/" but what if he hadnt? i guess as the bigger dog hed have been to blame

I had a similar experience with Hen.

A westie snapped, lunged and barked at Henry as we walked past and Henry (and you know how soft he is!) just gruffed back at him as if he was telling him to pipe down and the owner of the westie said "you should get a muzzle for your dog"!

Needless to say, I had a word with them!!

Some people just dont have a clue with dogs if mine are going near a dog i watch them like a hawk even though i know they get on with other dogs. I guess they though seen as their dog is small and its not about to pull them over it doesnt matter its no distraction or danger to them just other people.

I know where you're coming from.  Roxy (toy poodle) and I were at the park the other week.  I always keep Roxy on the lead as her recall is terrible!  :rolleyes:  Four young girls then came sauntering along in our direction with a big dally (off lead) who lunged and pawed at Roxy leaving her shaken and with a big muddy paw print on her back.  One of the girls said, 'Sorry, he's like that with other dogs', to which I replied that she should have him on a lead then.  I was so angry.  Roxy is very small and dainty compared to other dogs and I hate to think the damage they could do to her with one swipe of their paw, even if it is in play.  :(

Yes I dread walking our Bichon now because of this very reason.  He has the added problem that uncastrated dogs are very attracted to him since he has been castrated and won't leave us alone.  There is a large dog that sometimes 'gets out' of its garden, its a labrador cross Doberman and its absolutely nutty and won't take no for an answer.  My dog has had at least two dangerous encounters with the damn thing now and its so much harder when you are in the middle of a field and there is no one else around and this large monster of a dog is continously jumping on your small dog.   I know some small dogs can stick up for themselves and get aggressive but unfortunately our dog hasn't got even a tiny bit of aggression in him and won't fight back.  The first time I encountered this dog it knocked me over and I hurt my knee whilst trying to protect our dog and the second time just over a week ago my daughter (whose dog it is)  aged 13 took him for a nice pleasant walk in the field one Sunday afternoon and the same dog came hurtling down the field towards them and jumped all over our dog and the 13 year old boy who it was with just couldn't stop it.  When our dog got back he was quite shook up and was sick, although miraclously unhurt.   Even dogs with their owners pose a threat if they are off lead because by the time their owners catch up with them it is too late and our dog has been knocked over, pawed and hurt by uncontrollable uncastrated dogs.   I really wish that owners of large dogs that haven't got them trained properly would get them castrated because I just know that our dog is going to get badly hurt, maybe have his back broken one of these days.

I know you're only protecting your dog, Anna, but it's a bit unfair (when you're dog is suffering the side-effects of castration) to wish the chance of the same thing happening to others. :(

I'm sorry Jeangenie but I don't agree because a large dog who is castrated or even a medium sized dog would be able to defend itself.  My other dog a GSD was a very large dog and I had him castrated and no dog would even think of jumping all over him.  I was just saying that if the owners can't control their dogs, not that all large dogs should be castrated.  What would you say the answer is then, that my dog never gets a walk because I have had him castrated and other dogs that are roaming round the streets which is meant to be against the law can come and jump all over my dog and injure him badly or even kill him and this is okay because it is my fault for having him done in the first place?  I know you are against castration in general and I would never have a small dog done again after this but he has got to live with this for the next 14 years or so and there is nothing I can do.  If I don't walk him I'm cruel and if I do walk him I am risking him getting a nasty injury.

It does seem to be the case that a growling,snarling little dog is deemed "cute" and funny, but if it was a bigger dog they would be aggressive! Some little dogs can do just as much damage as a bigger dog, but becuase the owner can just pick them up it doesn't matter! grr!!

My dog has never snarled in his life.  I don't like any breed of dog 'growling or snarling'  big or little.  I am not just a small dog owner out to get all big dogs, I actually prefer larger dogs and the bichon is my 13 year old daughters.  I had a large dog myself and if he was off lead and I could see some dog approaching that he didn't know then he would go back on the lead again because I know the damage a big dog can do to a small dog.  A lady I used to walk with had a few dogs and one was a bassett hound and she used to tell me to let my GSD off the lead but I was terrified of him bouncing on the Bassett and injuring his back so I have been in the position myself you know.   I can't stand snappy small dogs either. 

I'm not saying that at all, Anna. What I'm saying is that owners of larger breeds get just as upset if their dogs are harrassed (as I was when a couple thought it very amusing that my (spayed) bitch was having her legs bitten by their two vile chihuahuas) as owners of small dogs. Maybe your GSD didn't suffer from feminising syndrome, as your bichon (he is a bichon, isn't he? If not, I'm sorry, I'm muddled) appears to. Not all castrated dogs suffer from it.

All dogs should be under control, that should go without saying. But if a person walked a bitch in season around you'd expect dogs (even msome castrated dogs) to take an interest. If a castrated dog is giving off similar signals they're bound to react in a similar way. They're animals, after all. It's neither your fault nor theirs. It's very very unfortunate.

I have a westie who does appear to become aggressive as he does snarl and bark at big dogs. I do my best to keep him away from the big dog and human ankles. I am sorry that the westie did this and more to the point that its owners did nothing to stop it. My westie does this, I think as a defence mechanism. He was attacked by a dalmation some months ago now and hasnt forgotten the awful experience. I always blame bad dog owners when their dog, large or small snarls, barks or generally appears aggressive towards another dog or human. I always apologise for Mack's behaviour, and if possible explain why I think he is doing it. I suppose there is always going to be bad owners out there. I think that all dogs are amazing, big or small and just because I have the most fabulous westie (not biased at all!!) it doesnt mean that I dont gasp at the sight of a big dog. (Sorry if I have gone off the point! I have just woken up from having a menieres attack earlier this afternoon)

Sorry Jeangenie, its just that I am really worried and stressed out everytime I walk him because I am wondering if today is going to be the day he gets injured.  I lost the dog I loved more than anything last year and I couldn't bear to go through that again this year.   It just this Lab x doberman is always getting out of the garden and it is going to cause an accident before too long.  Its was out on its own again when my daughter was coming home from school today.  I only had him castrated to try and help his skin problems because someone who I know has a friend who has bichons and said they tend to have hormone problems and speying or castrating would probably help, all it has done is make things a hell of a lot worse for him.  He is a lovely little dog and he loves all other dogs too, he loves the guinea pig, the hamsters, he is gentle with everyone and everything and thinks everyone is his friend.  I just wish vets would warn people about this syndrome before they have their dogs done because it has really spoiled his and our lives. :-(

I couldn't agree more that owners should be told the pros and cons of any treatment, so that they can make an educated decision, rather than simply being told the usual outcome.

Have you discussed the possibility of hormone treatment for him? I'm told it's pricey, but usually effective.

I will have a word with the vet when he goes again but if it is pricey then I probably won't be able to afford it.  Have you any idea just how pricey it is?

I'm sorry, I have no idea. If you do a search on here for posts by JackieH you might find out, because one of her dogs had this treatment.

Thanks Jeangenie, I will do that :-)

I think that she may have left champdogs because it says that user doesn't exist when I put JackieH in the search :-(

Hi there,

It's actually Jackie H (with a space) which is why its not coming up in a search :)

Here's a couple of old threads you might find interesting.

http://www.champdogsforum.co.uk/cgi-bin/board/topic_show.pl?pid=205725;hlm=and;hl=HRT#205725

http://www.champdogsforum.co.uk/cgi-bin/board/topic_show.pl?pid=355317;hlm=and;hl=HRT#355317

http://www.champdogsforum.co.uk/cgi-bin/board/topic_show.pl?pid=24032;hlm=and;hl=HRT#24032

Sorry, the links aren't working - you may want to PM Jackie and see if she can offer any advice :)

Hi Ice-cosmos,

Thanks for the links I will have a look.  Thanks also for the Info about Jackie H.

Anna

Oh sorry, I have just seen that you have said at the bottom that the links aren't working, thanks anyway.

If you copy and paste them into your browser it will bring up the topics :)

I also wonder if chlorophyl tablets might not help. 

This has a useful deodorising action, and sherleys used to sell them for use on bitches in season and for other body odors. 

You can also get capsules in health shops as a dietary supplement.  The tablets used to be used in colostomy bags, and it was the main ingredient in amplex tablets years ago. 

I found the deodorising tablets by sherleys and the heatlh food shop capsules useful when I had bitches in season, and for a certain older dog who thought poo eating a delicacy. :D

It is also the main ingredient in those expensive dental chews called greenies.

If something like an internal, or even an external deodorant might help, would be wortyh a try. 

Try bitch spray for external use before walks.  Of course some of the reason for the interest may be his ultra submissive behaviour too :(  as it was in a large Springer whose life was made a misery. 

He could only enjoy meeting other dogs in the controlled environment of the dog training club, as off lead he was just too frightened and would run away.

Hi Brainless,

I have got some bitch tablets which are made by Johnsons the only problem is I have to remember to give him a tablet at least 30 mins before I walk him and with the rush getting my kids off to school and my youngest to nursery I sometimes forget.  When I have given them to him I haven't met a dog to test them on. 

I wouldn't say he is submissive, he will approach a dog if he is off lead but he won't go right up to it unless he knows it, and if it looks friendly then he starts to play with it and is quite confident and happy.  He isn't nervous when he is out but does get scared if a dog does keep jumping on him but never gets snappy just gives me a look to say 'help me please'

To be really effective I would suggest that he got the chlorophyll tablets regularly four times a day so that the smell given off was being continuously masked. 

When I have had girls in season I have given double dose in the middle week.  I have noticed a big difference in my freinds males reactions to me when the girls have had the tabs and when they haven't. 

I have also noticed that dogs on the other side of the road don't even acknowledge our passing, whereas without they definately have their noses twitching.

Hi Brainless,

Thanks for replying again.  Where do I get those chlorophyll tablets from, I will try them.

Thanks

Anna

I would do an online search for them for UK suppliers.  I was able to get the capsules at a health food shop, and the pet shop can order the sherleys ones, but I would get a bulk order as the sherlesy ones are about £2.50 for only 50 tablets and you would probably be wanting to use 4 a day.

tye capsules are stronger and I just opened them up and gave a bit of the powder on the end of a teespoon handle, that way one cap would probably last you two days.

Thanks Brainless :-)

You can also get liquid chlorophyll that you add to their drinking water.I add a teaspoon to my dogs water bowl every second day.

Anna i have had all of my males(and females) neutered in the past and have never experienced the problems you are describing,is this a common thing??