I have just confirmed my removal date for next Wednesday, up to Scotland from Kent.

This is where the problem/stress begins The drive will be roughly 8 hours, 500 miles, obviously there will be stops.

Callia who will be nearly 16 weeks, still hates the car with a vengence :( We have progressed to short journeys in her car crate in the estate part of the car, but we still have the odd accident, anything from a small wee to full scale waste from every orifice. Obviously, she will have to travel up there with us and the other dogs by car and this will include an overnight stop as the removal firm, because of their tachograph/mileage restriction in one day, wont be able to move us in, until the following day at lunchtime.

This presents 2 problems. The first is, how do I get her up there without too much stress to her, us and the other dogs. I plan to not give her dinner of breakfast before we leave to lessen the mess factor. She understandably gets upset when she messes in her car crate and has to lay in it before we can stop and clean her up. I'm also thinking of giving her some sort of calming medication to lessen her stress factor, I don't know whether to get something from the vets or buy a herbal remedy. I already give Bach flower remedy but it doesn't seem to have much impact on her at all.

The second problem, we will have to stay overnight somewhere whilst waiting for the removal people to arrive, I can stay with my dad but his dog hates other dogs and is a fighter so it would mean my dogs would have to say outside, or in the car and I don't want to do this because after such a long journey they deserve time, attention and love. A hotel is another option but cash is in short supply at the moment and I don't think I would find anywhere that will allow 3 dogs.

Obviously I want to make this transition as painless and as stress free as possible for the dogs, but Callia in particular. I'm not happy about withholding food from her but can't think of any other way to do it.

I know it's a lot to cover and I cant see the wood for the trees at the moment but has anybody got any suggestions as to how I can make the whole process as easy as possible on my pup? :)

if youve got a bioflow collar knocking about they can make dogs "chill" abit when travelling. otherwise theres pros to both other methods.
a,get something to knock her out from the vet. scotland is along way & it may just be easier
b. get some RR & other flower remedy to help & as shes still "with it" its a nice long way to get her used to travelling.

I think knocking her out is the best method, yes she needs to get used to travelling but I don't think this is the journey to experiment with :)

But won't it have to be horse sedative strength to knock her out for the duration of the journey? I'll have to ask the vet and make a decision on it.......

nellie used to get travel sick & she had tablets from vet thay just made her  really sleepy & she just slept, & got over her travel sickness!
are you thinking of ACP to knock her out? it comes in tab;lets so when she starts waking up you can give her abit more. then you could even let her come oiut of it abit & take in some of the journey

I intended to stay out of this but in conscience can't.  ACP is a very powerful, potentially dangerous medication and one which the average lay person should *never* decide when to *top-up*.  Normally used as a pre-med sedative, it is IMO totally inappropriate to give a young puppy for travel purposes.  Adult pets are killed regularly every year by well meaning owners dabbling with this drug - particularly around Guy Fawkes :(

Try vallerian compound from Dorwest - a liquid which not only calms but causes a slightly sleepy affect - Give approx. 1 hour before travelling.  Put RR on the nose leather, not down the throat - the less put into the tummy the less likely to cause vomit/nausea etc.  A few Chamomilla 30C granules can be sprinkled on the tongue (dissolve instantly) as often as required which have a soothing effect on the nervous system without the bulk/distress of forcing down tablets.  Top these up at every "wee" stop.
Stay overnight at a Holiday Inn Express - most allow dogs happily and are inexpensive - she can then be fed an hour or so after the first day's travel.  Starve in the morning and give homeopathic remedies again as above.  Teri

blimey!!!! my vet just gives out a bottle & says use it when you need too!!!

Hi Michelle,

I'm not surprised you're surprised ;)  I could tell by your earlier suggestion that you were unaware of what this drug is about - and please, there is no offence intended, beause it is the responsibility of our vets to ensure that if they send a client away with this drug they fully explain why and how it should be used :(

It can cause anaphylactic shock, seizures, as Isabel has highlighted extreme changes in personality, dogs lapsing in and out of consciousness, bring on epilepsy in breeds or lines which have a low threshhold for that condition, I could go on and on (but I won't - don't worry ;) )  Suffice to say it is a drug that I not only would not keep at home, but one that I have written onto each of my dogs' med charts must NEVER be used on them - there are safer prescription alternatives and in any event (for outwith my vet's supervision) I prefer to stick firmly with homeopathic or herbal remedies for stress relief. 

Regards, Teri

S**T.  :(
ok dont use this hairypooch!!!!!!!! :(

I agree Teri, every dog reacts differently to sedatives, very easy to overdo it and there is no reversal.  They can also have the effect of releasing the dogs inhibitions causing it to behave in a way it normally never would.  My friend has had to use them for grooming purposes on her Newfoundland and the vet advised her always to keep herself between the dog and door so she can dive straight out if need be!

Thanks for another important example of problems Isabel - I think that this drug is one grossly over used/abused by some people who quite simply don't appreciate just what it can do.  Sure, it has it's uses but more awareness is needed by a lot of owners as to the possible dreadful consequences.

regards, Teri

im sure its quite a common thing down here to ACP everything! :(

Thank you for your words of wisdom Teri and I'm pleased you didn't stay out of this as your advice is always sensible and happily accepted.

I have never heard of ACP but it sounds horrendous. Never having had to sedate any of my dogs before, I am naive when it comes to conventional calming/sedative drugs. I still hadn't made a decision as to what method I would use to calm her, But having a deep distrust of Vets I wouldn't have treated her with anything the Vet suggested without thoroughly researching it first. One good point on moving, I hope that I may find a broader minded Vet.

As we'll be travelling around lunchtime, after removal men have gone (not ideal for timing, I know) I presume that I should not feed her that day until we reach out destination at silly hour.

Holiday Inn Express is one that I hadn't thought of.

Don't worry michelle, now that we've established the harm that can be done with it, I'll steer well clear ;)
Thanks for your advice though, you were only going on what you thought was best :) :)

Woooa :) There is a time and place for sedatives,  I doubt any vet would prescribe for such a young puppy anyway but for an older dog where all other means had failed a small dose may help relax the animal sufficiently to make a difference it's only the idea of unsupervised doses that is questionable.  My friend does use it successfully with her Newfoundland always mindful of the possible effects, I doubt very much she would achieve the same result with this particular animal with anything herbal :)

Not disputing that at all Isabel, just saying that I don't trust vets and have never had experience of conventional sedatives that I have had to administer. :) Hopefully, I never will.

I vaguely discussed my options with the Vet yesterday by phone regarding Callia and she was more than prepared to prescibe something that would in her words "knock her out". Perhaps I should have made this clear in my first post. So it seems that some Vets would prescribe for a young pup.

Now that we've discussed the merits or negative effects of sedatives I'll speak to my H/pathic vet to make sure that all precautions are taken for the good of my pup :)

I think it is a shame not to trust vets it's like saying you don't trust people :)  I have had dogs, as an adult, for 25 years and consequently come across several over the years :) so can reassure you that the majority, in fact all that I have dealt with, are well informed and very caring professionals.  Unfortunately on the internet one often hears stories that quite frankly make me think I would have liked to to have been there and found out exactly what the vet said!  In a consultation an awful lot of information exchanges hands and it is so easy for people not to take on board information or advise that, at the time, they did not appreciate the importance of, we have all done it, we do it at the doctors too :) consequently [b/]sometimes when people say "my vet didn't tell me that" it's not strictly true they were just concentrating on remembering that other thing they meant to ask :) so the proportion of these events seem a lot higher than they actually are.  I'm not talking about the events on this thread by the way just a general observation about why people seem to lose faith with vets these days.

I don't trust a lot of people Isabel and with good cause :( Nobody will convince me to trust Vets or the medical profession per say.

I'm not questioning their training, it's their personal attitudes and opinions that I have had cause to have a problem with over the years. In all of my years of owning dogs, my first dog that I was personally responsible for was 20 yrs ago, I have only ever had 1 vet that I trusted implicitely. The others that I have had the misfortune to meet and deal with are just doing a job and caring is certainly not how I would describe them :(

I always go on my own experiences of Vets and don't form an opinion from what I read on the internet. As we all know, everybodies experiences, good or bad, are down to personal interpretation. But I agree, when I was green, I used to get bombarded with information from the vet and probably forgot half of it before I got home, then I would irritate them by ringing them up and asking them to confirm what they had said or remind me of something that I had forgotten. I no longer forget what is said as I take a notebook and write the salient points down, eg, diagnosis, prescribed treatment, length of treatment, possible side effects and source of desease/cause of illness. I also do the same with the Dr when I am unfortunate and desperate enough to have to see them.

But that is me personally, I have now learnt, to my detriment in the past, to be very observant and alert as it's amazing how even Vets and Doctors can have selective memories when they need to. Afterall, they are only human, it's just a shame that some of them like to be treated as if they are god. I am one of these people where trust has to be earnt, not taken for granted. I'm certainly not a "know it all" but I do like to question things in every walk of life. :)

   

I think you may have been exceptionally unlucky with both these professions but on the other hand there may be other factors other than luck ;).  Isn't it possible that if you approach them with a cynical attitude, that may be more transparent than you think :), that the lack of trust between you could well lead to a rather poor consultation.  They are human after all, as you pointed out, so the whole thing ends up as a self fulfilling prophesy :)

Yes, I would say that I have probably been unlucky with both these professions in general but I have had the odd good Doctor and Vet along the way and as far as I'm aware, regardless of my personal opinion of them, my, or their attitude, hasn't affected their treatment or diagnosis of any situation, whether it be good or bad :)

I am cynical by nature and nobody could have been more cynical than me when I first started using Homeopathy several years ago for my dogs and myself. Maybe I was lucky with the specialists that I saw and the treatment that was successful......I don't know ;) Not that I am saying H/pathy/herbal is successful in every case, obviously conventional does has a very important place in society but then, thank god for freedom of choice.

A close family member is dying of Cancer and literally has weeks to live, all because of misdiagnosis and apathy on the part of the medical profession and she followed their advice to the letter, even when they admitted that had they correctly diagnosed sooner, she wouldn't be facing death at 42 and leaving her 2 very young boys and husband. She may have been exceptionally unlucky as well but it doesn't change the fact that there will be NO second chance for her or them to get it right :(

Add this to my personal experiences, you may now see why I'm am so cynical and distrusting :)

Hi HP,

I wouldn't feed her - I know it's hard with a puppy but she's that little bit older now and it won't do her any long term harm to miss 2 or 3 meals as a one-off.  If you feel better about her getting something, you could add some glucose and/or honey to her drinking water but as she's such a poor traveller anyway and likely to throw it up it she'll most probably get little benefit from it.  The homeopathic remedies suggested have worked well for one of mine who is a horrendous traveller - she'll be fine.

Re Holiday Inn Express, there are several on the way North - check up by phone before you travel which ones accept dogs as although the Group site often says they do it is in fact a franchise and a few don't take them.   Pre-booking on-line usually saves a bit of cash and of course ensures they're not full when you get there ;)

Regards, Teri

Thanks for the advice Teri :)

You've just confirmed what I thought was right regarding feeding. I'll just have to make up for it when we are in situ ;)

I'll book online later tonight, if I leave it to OH he'll forget :rolleyes:  and then I can see us spending the night in the car, 2 adults, 1 child & 3 dogs..........Oh I really don't think so :P

You could also try DAP - it comes in in an aerosol now which can be used in the car.

Thank you Fillis, I tried the DAP when it was recommended to me on here before, but unfortunately it doesn't seem to make much difference to her :)

i have used a herbal tincture from herbal and health green and cream box, about £15.00 that does seem to work, it certainly stopped my parson russell hollering at night because she wanted to be in the bed with us!