I know that this question hasn't got anything to do with dogs, but has anyone got any information on the welfare of horses during fox hunting? I am doing an assignment for college that asks me to explain this issue. I would be greatful if anyone can help.

Haylez 

In what respect Haylez? During the actual ""hunt" or the keeping of them?

during the actual hunt.

haylez not really shore what you want to know but i can try and give you a litlle bit of info if it will help, only going from my own experiences
before the session will start people will start getting there horses fit by bringing them in from ther winter turnout from about end july/aug they will start doing road work.. thats hacking them out on the road to strenthen there legs to make sure they are good and strong. that way theyare less likely to injuire themselves while out hunting. when they are fit in walk you will start canter work, build this  up till a horse is doing between 1 to 2 hrs exercise a day . dy the time the session starts your horsewill be fit and ready to go. whith good strong legs and lungs.

a horses will be clipped before they go hunting( hair cut) as this helps them dry of quickly to feel more comfy,when they are sweating,makes it easyfor you to bath and get the dirt of after a days hunt, a nice hot bath and rubdown eases any stiff or cold joints. 

then you would check legs make sure no thorns in legs or cuts anywhere.
rug up your horse put to bed with a big feed lots of hay.
next day turn out for a well earned rest.

dont forget people love there horses and will do everything they can to make sure they stay fit and healthy. hope this little bit helps. you could also go to a local saddlery and look for any books on horse care and hunting. or try the pony club web site

thanx 4 this info this will help for the second part of my assignment

what do you need to know

for the 1st part of my assignment i have got to- 'identify the possible welfare issues for the animals involved in a fox hunt' what the risk are for the horses used.

I fail to see how hunting could present any more hazzards or welfare implications than any other equestrian activity....apart from "stressage" that is ;)  The basics of fittening a horse for its purpose are the same throughout all the disciplines....& actual dangers on the day would vary between the individual hunt countries.....for example I would find large wall jumping scary...worrying about my horses knees etc, but the horses in the areas where this occurs are well booted & know how to jump them correctly...in comparison,  the visitors we get here find our moorland hunting terrifying, but we have horses who are well used to the dangerous terrain & know how to cope.........who set this project out of curiosity.....and for what purpose????

my college course set this assignment as a vital step to pass my course, we have a module on animal roles and welfare, if this is not passed there will be no national diploma at the end of the year. I dont particularly agree that this assignment is nessessary but it has to be done.

OK, I have never hunted, but here are the issues I would imagine:

1. Injury. Sustained through: trotting on hard roads (concussion), slipping on wet roads (road studs can prevent this), being kicked from other horses (avoid red ribbons in tail!), cantering on roads (although this can be kinder I am led to believe than sustained trotting), ligaoment, tendon injuries in the field. You also need to be aware of rough ground, rabbit holes, tripping, falling - ending up with potential broken limbs. Jumping - knocked legs, falls etc.
2. Fatigue/fitness. Horses must be hunting fit with a long programme of fitness beforehand. It is not advisable to take a happy hacker out hunting for the day!
3. Behavioural issues. Pulling, tanking off, running at jumps, no control etc etc all ways to potentially ruin a good horse.
4. Tack. Should be well fitting, in good order and in good repair. The correct bit should be fitted and used properly.

Of course - all these apply to the average hour out hacking! :)

haylez.. ther e is always a risk, luckily it is not very often that horses get harmed, usually the rides that get most injuries. most people know there own horse and know it limitations i.e if its not a good jumper you go through a gate, if its only up to a half day because of age or fittnes. you only do a couple of hours. sadly things do happen,not often but you can get a horse that  will unjuire a tendon (leg) pull a shoe of, need stiches if it got into wire,

this usually results in at best a few weeks of at worst the rest of the seasson of

if possible could you list all the injuries/accidents that the horses endure.

Why don't you ring an equine vet - see if they can help?

I thought it would have been more helpful to ask horse owners/anybody who has been on a hunt and seen the injuries and hazards etc for their own eyes.

You might be better to try a horse board. Try H & H online and put a message on their forum :)

1   get kicked by another horse
2   pull a shoe of & get abscess in foot
3   get cut on barbed wire
4   fall over a fence& and break leg or neck
5   injuire a leg ( tendon)
6   get colic ( bad stomach ftom feeding to soon)
7    rub legs sore from boots
8   sore back from ilfitting tack
9   sore mouth from ilfitting tack
10  get stressed if notthe right temerament

hope this helps

thats brill thanx v much!!

It seems  u are looking at the-ve aspects of hunting,for your assing. am I right? I agree with Jackbox and would include unloading from a box espec. a young horse and the experience of the rider , but I'm not sure what info u really need Love Sonja  

Good points sonja. All aspects of the horses welfare need to be included so i would have to consider these suggestions as well, any idears on these suggested??

The thing is, are you considering welfare aspects purely from the hunting scenario, or those welfare considerations that would arise if a person boxed a horse for a day's hacking (or any other outing)?

the welfare issues are needed from the actual hunt.

As has been said on another post, the only risks to the horses that are peculiar to hunting would be due to the activities of the more violent antis.

anything that referes to antis would be questioned as that may not always happen on every single hunt.

Nothing happens on every single hunt anyway. It all depends (or depended - it's now banned) whether hounds 'find' or not. If there's a blank day then it's just a quiet hack. All hunting days are different. The activities of the antis were more likely to happen than anything else.

i agree, how ever each hunt comes with risks if they find or not i just have to outline these risks.

But risks mean they may or may not happen and thats the same with antis :)

thats the problem with set assignments there are so many points to argue on what they ask you to explain you could debate for ages, as demonstrated in these posts. This makes what you put in the assignment not good enought so you have to go deeper and deeper into the subject to try and justify it, to many maybes and what ifs! :-/

None of the other maybes will happen on every single outing.
Snap :)

and don't forget getting things thrown/sprayed at him/her by antis.

I agree. The only risks (that I can think of) to a horse out hunting that are different to the risks when it's taking part in any other activity are down to the behaviour of the more violent antis.

haylez
i dont mean cantering for 2 hours , it will be mostly road work. the stronger the leg the less injuires. some people will have 2 horses, mosty masters and huntsman, and change horse midday,
sure i have left lots out.

jackie

just to let you all know that i will refere to you in my references for my assignment as you have all provided me with information, if i dont then the information would not be valid. thank-you. :-) i might be back for more!!

Its a funny old project if you can quote a bunch of women on a message board :) not exactly Oxford Referencing is it?

true, but everything that has been mentioned does happen.

The risks with the antis are as likely as any of the other risks, so all must be given equal importance. If you omit the risks caused by the antis then the whole project is meaningless.
:)

thats the problem if something is left out then everyting else is meaningless, everything has to be justified as to why it happens, all the issues pointed out may or may not happen so why is always included.

Have to agree - I have heard of anti's spraying citonella at the hounds, and putting tacks down to puncture the hooves. If thats not a genuine hunting hazard I don't know what is! :)

I would cite it as 'personal communication' and date it!

Hmmmmm, does 'welfare' not cover positive as well as negative aspects?

Horses out hunting learn a lot of positive things frmo the experience as well, being exposed to different environments, other horses, hounds, etc, its all good for the learnin'!

Plus there are the positive aspects of exercise surely.

Em

very good point em :)

and it teaches the riders a lot too! (or used to - boo hoo)

dont be sad poppy...nothing changes here....still huntin'  :)  ;)

I wish - our pack are to be retrained for drag hunting...........

POOR FOX!!!
I have hunted in my youth, but no longer as I have seen the torment and the pain suffered by the fox; controversial ,I know, but I am not in favour of this 'hobby'/sport. IMO drag hunting is a good solution for all concerned!!!!

i agree with all the above, but i was asked to outline the negative welfare issues how typical is that.:-/
i have another subject that i need to cover if anyone can help me its about reptiles..... does anyone know how much their feeding, the equipment to house them and the over all cost is to keep them? i would be happy of any suggestions.ive looked on the internet and all i can find is american websites!

We have a snake would this be what you was after?

Jo

yeh that would be fine, it would be a good example.

I will get details of hubby & PM you later today or tomorrow (waiting for pups to arrive - still!!)

Good luck with the project

Jo

I hope everyting goes smoothly with the pups Jo. :) bless!!

does anyone have any idea how many dogs and horses are destroyed as a result of fox hunting? for example if they become to old to hunt or get badly injured etc.

how are the dogs and horses normally cared for?

has anyone got a clue these have got me really stuck!!! :-(