some of you might of sean a posting about a lady that lives by me and has breed her bitch 5 times and she is only 3, well the story has gotten worse

i repoted this lady just before the bitch had her 3 litter (she was only 2)and did not get a responce from the RSPCA until about 2 weeks after the last puppy left the bitch (which was at 4 weeks old and that was a week after the others :( ) nothing was done.

4 months latter me and a few friends repoted her again because the bitch was just about to have another litter (3 year old) this time they did come out with in a week but as she was out thats all they done was put a letter throught the door. puppies were sold at 4 weeks old, she then had a litter about 15 weeks ago (she is now 3 1/2) and so i repoted her again and this time went to town on the phone i also got a few friends (about 8) to phone and to give them hell and they come out the some day. and this time they sore the puppies (they were coved in fleas and had mites and ticks), the inspector said that she must now have the bitch done and if he hears that she has had any more litters he will get the police involved and take her to court. :)

she has had 5 litters, first 7 all lived, second 6 her kids killed one, third litter 6 mother killed 2 fourth litter 6 mother killed 3, fith litter 6 mother killed 4.

this lady has now moved (to a very bad area) and she left the dog and bitch behind (she had both all the time but it is only the bitch that is in a bad way). on monday you could hear the dogs fighting and it went on for most of the day (looked throught the window and they had mated again), so yet agian i phoned the rspca and told them that she had left them but because i did not know what days she moved out they still had to gaiv her 48 hours. So i phoned on Wednesday and this time they did come out (and it was within 2 hours) but in the mean time they had still been feighting!!
the EX boyfriend went and got the dog from there on Tusday night (so the bitch had a little brake) he now has him.

when the rspca was there on wednesday they did not see the lady as she no longer lives there!!! but they left a note on her door and told me that they would be back with the police on friday if she has not got in tuch with them, well today she came up and seen the note, she had to kick the door in(she said that she had lost her keys) got the dog put her in the car and as she past me she told her new boyfriend that it looks like she is in season again and this time she "might put her with that PIT BULL from her block"

Sorry this is so long but all i want to know is what can i do??
as you can see i have told the rspca (dont think i will bother with them again)
i have gone on to her (she was a friend of mine but we fell out over her dog),
i told the police but all they said was to tell the rspca
i have phoned stafford rescua and they said they coulds not get the dog unless it was out of the house (i was going to brake in to get her but my boyfriend stoped me)
is their any thing i can do, yes she have moved but not to far, this bitch is not KC reg and so she is only selling them for £40, and i know of about 7 of her pups that are now in a shealter.

Bobby

sorry about the spelling!!

Bobby,
When we first moved to New Mexico, we lived in a trailor park waiting for housing. The next door neighbor got a puppy & for the next four months we saw it tied up under the "house." They'd feed & water it everyso often, but usually it was in a large bucket that would go rancid with the food & the water would evaporate in the heat. We called different societies & animal control, but no one would help for many of the reasons that you listed. My husband & I would go over, make sure it had food & water, plus play with him a bit. The little kids would come out to play every so often, but that's all that would happen. He just stayed tied up all of the time.

There was a time that the "family" just left --we had seen them prepare for it & heard they would be gone overnight. They threw food & water to the dog, but didn't even notice he was all tangled up. When we contacted the rescue society, we were told they couldn't legally get the dog, but if we brought it in...........

So, we parked our truck in front of the place, blocking the view, my husband grabbed the puppy (who knew us well), tucked him under his arm & slid into the passenger seat. I drove us off & headed straight to the society's president. Within hours they had the pup placed in a home with a loving & caring family who really wanted to take care of a dog.

4 days later, we saw throught the windows that the adults had finally noticed the puppy missing. They looked around for a bit, asked my husband if he had "seen" the dog...he truthfully answered "no." And that was the end of that. Oh, this was a really rough crew who were attached to one of the gangs there.
Sometimes, you just gotta do whatcha gotta do & hope it doesn't end badly when you do the 'right' thing.
toodles

Well done, My sister done a similar thing in Australia rescued from the people that owned the animal,
one was a cat that had been set on fire all the fur missing from one side
she kept that cat and it has reached 14 and still going..

hi Toodles

i was very tempted to do it as her door was never locked (evean when she was out) but as it was only me that was complaning so i decided not to as i did not need the trouble (i know that sounds bad), but i have not given up!

Bobby

I have just read this, it is appalling that people can get away with this. I know an RSPCA inspector, who told me that the RSPCA can enter a property with the police or an inviromental health inspector. Some years ago I had to report a place where dogs were being bred in appalling conditions, the RSPCA inspector in that case went in with the enviromental health people from the local council.
Other than remove the dog yourself, there are other ways. One friend went to the animal liberation front and got them to remove the dog. In another case a friend who was not known by the owner went and offered to buy the dog off the owner, and got it out that way.

Hi,

Firstly mating your bitch every season is not illegal and the RSPCA wouldn't be able to do anything about that.

As for her leaving the bitch in the house by herself - the animal has to be locked in a property without food/water and being checked on for 48hrs before they can be removed by the police. It takes 48hrs to prove abandonement.

The RSPCA have not right to enter a property and remove animals, only the police can force and entry. If the police are to busy to assist then there is nothing that can be done. We recently waited 15hrs for the police to come out when we had people shooting the front windows out.

If the RSPCA and police had not given her the 48hrs notice (the note on the door) and removed the animals without her knowledge the court case would have been thrown out of court and the Society would have been liable for all of the court costs. It would also have caused problems with any other cases they brought in front of the same magistrates.

I don't know what, if anything, you can do about this person but I do know that if it can be proved that she's breaking the law the RSPCA will prosecute. From what you've said I don't think they could prosecute unless she abandones the dogs again or fails to seek veterinary treatment, therefore causing suffering. It's more likely that she'd be encouraged to sign the puppies/bitch over but as they're earning her money she'd probably refuse to do that.

If you're not getting any joy from the Inspector talk to the Chief-Inspector for the area, if you don't know who he/she is call Headquaters and they should be able to tell you. They'll then be able to explain what if anything can be done and what info they need to act (they won't discuss the individual case but will be able to talk about non-specific cases).

Fiona
x x x

hi Fiona

yes i knew about the 48 hour thing as i phoned them 20 hours after she left, and i was told that nothing can be done yet, i then phoned after she had been left for abour 56 hours and yes they did come out and put a notice on her door saying that she has so long to get the dog before the police get involved, she then came up two days after that (the rspca had not been back) kicked the door in and tock her. she had been left five days in all one with the dog and the others on her own.
i think that 5 days is more than to long (but still the rspca have not been back)

Bobby

Unfortunately i know nothing of the way the RSPCA works but you said in your post that they had told this person that if she is bred from again they will get the police involved - if she is in fact preganant (or due to be put to that pitbull) then she has breached the law - also the fact that she is in season means that they haven't had her done and therefore the police can be got involved surely? And why isn't it illegal to breed off a bitch every season - so disgusting - that poor dog!
Good luck with this i hope they get what they truly deserve...

I imagine that the threat to get the police involced was just that, a threat. Obviously the Inspector will have seen the bitch and been able to judge her condition, so possibly he felt that it would be causing unnecessary suffering to mate her again. You can't be prosecuted because people think you might be going to do something, you have to actually have done it :(

The Society can't force you to have your bitch spayed, unless the magistrates have issued a court order to that efect. If she's been put with a pitbull with a view to breeding then yes, that is illegal if the male can be proved to be a pit bull and independent witnesses who can identify the male involved are prepared to give evidence.

I agree that it is absolutely disgusting that bitches can be mated every season, but unfortunately there is no law against it. Every Inspector I know would be champing at the bit desperate to do something, but unless they can prove she's acting illegally or she willingly signs over the bitch there's nothing they can do.

Fiona
x x x

Surely this must be a test case for the government to have laws on.
what about the tax man unclaimed income. Sorry I have no faith in the r.s.p.c.a. or for the police in this case they already find it difficult keeping up with burglaries and muggings.

Pat

Hard Facts: The laws of this country do little to help the RSPCA prosicute owners (I know they don't help ... but the laws allow dogs to be put through hell before anyone can do anything.

Taxmen would hardly be interested in an income of £40 per pup. She could offset this against expenses. There simply isn't enough income to worry anyone.

If this dog is taken away she will get another.

I have seen it all before. But there are some issues you could consider if you are keen!! Is the dog ever left alone in the garden, even if someone is there? Could anyone get hold of the dog? I have taken dogs with whole streets of neighbours watching and nobody has challenged (most of them are glad for the dog I hope others just can't be bothered). Sometimes a neighbour will help.

Don't know where the dog is but if I were near I would try to help. Sometimes offering a free spaying will help the dog at least not have puppies.

Sorry I can't offer any more advice/help.

Caitlin,
I've never regretted what I did for that puppy. I was indirectly telling Bobby that might be what has to be done if he/she wants to really do anything about it.

It's tough to do. Lord knows, I was terrified of one of their "friendly" neighbors seeing us. If he hadn't been so wrapped up in the moorings, we would have waited until dark. Only time I ever took a dog from someone else. Still rather nerve racking to think of it. I'm not really a brave person :(

It amazes me how people get away with it. Those poors dogs..and those pupps to be covered in fleas and ticks at such an early age. I know nothing about breeding, but surely the fact that the mum had killed some of her pups (that was what was said right?) doesn't that mean something, she's probably had enough...when you say kids killed one are you talking about the owners kids??

To put all those animals through that it diabolical...

The RSPCA seem to portray that they are concerned regarding all animals whether it be a minor complaint or not. But reading some of the posts, seems that half the time they have got better things to do whilst the poor animals are suffering.

I know they all have their guideline, but taking it seriously would be the first step wouldn't it??

Yes it was the ladies kids that killed one of the puppies they were playing catch with it!!! and droped it a lot as they are only young(2,3) and was not that good at the game!

What amazes me is that people bye dogs of people like this, do they just think that they are getting a cheap puppy, cos they are so wrong.

first litter all the puppies lived and are now still alive but there is only 2 with the person that bought it the others have been sold on or given away(poor Examples of the breed, and that is the first litter)
Last litter 6 born 4 killed(by mother) 2 sold, one was in the vets within days cost new owner £200, they went back to her and she said tuff i still want my monye the other one died at 8 weeks old.

so it new looks like the puppies are just to bad incondition after leaving it mother, it can only get worse

Bobby

What sort of a person lets their kids (of any age) throw a newborn puppy araound as a game...does she have no soul??? Obvioulsy no consience... It makes me feel sick what those poor dogs are having to go through, past and present...

As I've said before I'm not into breeding at the moment, but I was always told that pup's do not leave their mother until they are at least 8-10wks old...no wonder they were in poor condition if they were going at 4wks, they probably weren't even weened properly.

I hope this woman gets her just deserts and that she gets some of the same treatment in her next life!!

Maybe she could be had up for breaking the law in selling pups so young. I understood that it was ilegal to sell a puppy or kitten under 6 weeks of age!

I know that pups have to be 8 weeks before they are sold from anyone who needs a breeders license.

Wouldn't one of the buyers whose pup died make a statement?

hi catlin and toodles

i wish i had done it as i said the door was never locked, i was just weighting for the right time as i dont drive and i also have dogs and i know that they dont like each other (as we were friends ones) so it was hard to find somewhere for her to go until i could get her to Sbt recues,
she has now moved about 3 miles away and at the moment has a good door! but i dont think that will take long before it is broken!
i see this lady all the time and so will know what happens to the bitch, and i think if i could get her this time i will. She has now moved to a flat so i dont think it will be long before she is left out on her own, and i will be their

Bobby

Natalie,
Don't give us details on who you really are, where you live or what you plan on doing. That could get the site into legal trouble & you into difficulty yourself. You might consider 'hiding' your email addy since that could also lead to your personal identification.
I am NOT telling you to break the law... just get that straight & official.
Just like you are NOT really planning on doing anything illegal.
good luck with the situation & hope THINGS work out

I could write reams about my run ins with the RSPCA, and I dont care what anyone says, most of the time they are useless, so RSPCA, IF YOU DONT LIKE THIS POSTING...............SUE ME!!!!
I personally would take any dog, cat or animal that was in this situation and bugger the consequences. What on earth is the good of pussy footing around for weeks on end, and then loseing the case if and when it eventually comes to court? Yes, I know we cant rescue every animal in distress, but at least do something about the ones we can get to.
If anyone wants to know the stories about me and the RPCA Ill tell you, but its a whole lot of typing and reading!!

Hi
I have been following this and blooming (cant swear kids around) annoying it is
I would jump in 1st and to hell with the consequenses (SP)
If i ever see a dog at a show in destress in a car i would smash the window before imforming anyone,I would hope others would do it if mine were in trouble( though i dont leave them in the car and always load the car within eye watching space.
I have heard 1 bloke kicking his puppy around cause HE had been out all day and the pup had messed while he was out.
I knock on his door,took the pup he went a bit nasty but the blood was pumping thorugh my veins so i told him we would take the argument outside,he backed down (puff)though i was releived,but i would do it again.
I watched a bloke keep tapping and slapping one of his 2 rotties,I was waiting out side the shop.
I couldnt take no more so i got out the car and told him why not give it another slap after all its only an animal,he went on to tell me it kept eyeballing another dog,soon shut up when i said i had 6 of the little monsters,but it shamed him as other people were coming into and out ofo the shop,but I so so annoys me when this goes on.
Get in there get the dog/animal out then worry about it or you could spend days worrying about it still in the house not knowing whats happened.
I guess i shouldnt say this really but Im behind you all the way. :-)

Don't get me wrong, I"m behind Bobby all of the way. I just don't want any history of premeditation or encouragement as evidence for possible legal charges. Esp. how touchy some of the laws dealing with dogs already are.

Much different than complaining about treatment by an organization...that's not illegal :D

In NM, there was a co-worker of my husband who came home one day, found his 8 month old dog had messed on the carpet, & threw the dog through the sliding glass doors. Broke the glass & I never heard if the dog lived or died of injuries. Since it was on a federal installation & he was military, he got the charged with quite a few violations. He had also been in trouble before he came home that day. --charged with destruction of government property, cruel & inhuman treatment of an animal, assault on police officers (this guy supposedly 'resisted' arrest), plus some other charges. He had also hit his wife when he came home for 'allowing' the mess to happen.

I think he was sent to Leavenworth, Kansas for 4 years --bet he met some really nasty characters there who 'taught' him a lesson or two. Funny how ethically motivated some convicts are.

Anyway, he was reduced in rank, fined, & given a dishonorable discharge after his time was served. Might not sound like much, BUT in the US, a courts martial & a d.d. will show up everytime you apply for housing, credit loans, federal or state jobs, education, etc... You cannot escape it, ever. Too bad this isn't standard practice anytime someone abuses or seriously injures an animal. It's usually a sign of how he/she also treats those that are weaker.

Three things spring to mind in this thread.

Firstly: how so many of you are condoning breaking the laws of this land and encouraging someone else to do so. Incredible!

Secondly: what do you think this woman is going to do? She will go out straight away and get another bitch and then the whole process will start again.

Thirdly: animal liberation groups are terrorist organisations.
Does this only apply, unless they can offer you a hand with something!

I agree, that what is happening to this bitch is truly awful, but there are hundreds of bitches all over the country (and world) that are in this position. You may save this bitch but you will be condemning her 'replacement' to the same life :-(

Please remember that this is a public forum.
If you are planning on breaking the law, then do so privately.

Fire Extinguisher at the ready.....