I would be interested to hear from anyone who has experience of using this product.

I have recently had my 2.5 year old male dog injected.  The vet had only limited knowledge of this product and acknowledged that I knew more about it than her! (Thanks to previous Champdogs postings!)

It has already made a difference to his behaviour and we have noticed a decline in his male-on-male agression - a recognised breed trait.

I am curious to hear from anyone who has used this as a longer term solution.  How long can it be "safely" used for?  What side effects might I expect other than the obvious coat differences expected with prolonged use?  We have also noted increased appetite - no bad thing as he was previously a picky eater!

I always believed this product was only used as a prelude to castration but the vet seems to believe it could be used longer-term although I'm not sure I'm happy to fill a dog with chemicals unless absolutely necessary.

He is a giant breed - he weighs 46kg and is difficult (not impossible) to manage safely when he displays all the usual "teenage" male behaviour.

We have already explored and used Canine Behaviourists (£90 per hour?!!), herbal remedies, Ovarid, training classes etc.  This lad was "socialised to his eyeballs" as a babe and adored everyone. 

My aim is to continue showing him and therefore wish to avoid full castration if possible.  We have already acknowledged he does not have a suitable temperament for breeding despite having a hip score less than half the breed average.

Any advice would be gratefully received.

Hi Hilda.
I wouldn't use Tardak as a permanent solution, the permanent solution is castration.  It does miminc neutering which is why you like the effect it is having on your dog, that effect is what castration will do.  The increased appetite is common also in neutered dogs.

I used it a couple of times when my bitch was in season, it had the desired effect but I wouldn't entertain using it permanently just so I could show my dog.  Castrated dogs are perfectly acceptable in the showring, although I admit some breeds coats will alter afterwards.

I don't think its fair to your dog to pump him full of Tardak on a permanent basis, your Vet as you said has "limited" knowledge of the drug.  I would try to find a Vet who has more knowledge and can advise you of the possible side effects of long term use.
Dawn.

It does need to be pointed out that showing a neutered male other than in Veteran will mean the dog is unlikely to do as well in the ring as it otherwise might have, because if all else is equal the entire male will beat teh castrated male, who has a fault accordign to the breed standard. 

There is yet to be a castrated male champion in any breed (being shown throughout in this conditon, not neutered after), and I don't know if one has ever won a CC.

Teh other alternative, vasectomy will not address the behaviour aspect, only the ability to reproduce.

In some breeds it is just a fact that one takes care to avoid confrontations with males wehn you have a male.  The only thing I can say is that may ornery teenage males eventually calm down somewaht when mature, like with human teen males feelking less need to prove how tough they are.

Yes Brainless but the OP's dog is 2 and a half, even a giant breed is past the "teenage" stage by then.  I think it comes down to what you want most a dog you can show or a dog you can live with.
Dawn

Yes, I have used this method as a prelude to possible castration but it made no difference whatsoever in my case :( I chatted with my vet for about half an hour about the injection before I went ahead, and was given the impression it was a one-off.

Well I have to say the vet was very good - and listened!  Something of a rarity in the veterinary profession in my experience.

We discussed the use of Tardak for almost an hour and she has been quick to follow up his progress as well as keeping her promise to contact the company who produce this drug.  She attempted to ask them how long Tardak may be "safely" used for - but received only a non-commital answer stating that no research had been recorded over longer-term use of Tardak. 

She also pushed them to try and discover if Ovarid (which has a similar effect) would be a safer/simpler/improved method of managing his unwanted behaviour but as the company does not produce Ovarid it declined to comment!

The only previous post I have found on Champdogs regarding multiple use of these injections was from someone who had used it three times.  Each injection is expected to last approximately 4 - 6 weeks.

I'm curious to know how safe it would be considered to use it for a period of, say, 6 months, whilst working hard with my dog in terms of further socialisation and training.

I do appreciate all views and would like to point out that the breeder was fully aware when I purchased the pup at 8 weeks that he was intended for the showring.  I know there are no guarantees regarding show potential having bred my own dogs but it has been distressing to discover many months later that his father had been retired from the showring as he was considered unmanageable.

We live and learn and Champdogs helps us learn!

Yes, it was the non committal answer from the company that gave us the impression that it was only really safe to use the once :) I certainly wasn't willing to continue treatment with no backing of evidence from them!

I also have an excellent vet who shows dogs too, so I feel she sees things from my point of view :) I have to say that my dog IS improving with age.

I hope everything goes well for you Hilda, any info on long term use you find, I would be pleased if you would pass it on, its useful to know.

What breed is your dog?  Is his behaviour common for that breed, or do you think because his father is like it, it could be genetic that way?  I wish you the best of luck with him.
Dawn.

Making a guess here - that the dog is an Akita?? Male to male aggression is often a big problem & not something that can be solved by socialisation. If so, at 2 1/2, he is still a teenager, but his attitude isn't likely to change much as he gets older. I've no experience of Tardak but if the only way I could show my dog was by injecting him with chemicals then I'd have to stop showing. JMO. I admire you for your decision not to breed from him, especially if his father's temperament was the same. Sorry if I've got the wrong breed (2 +2 quite often makes 5!!!), but the same remarks apply for most breeds.

Sorry Anwen - he's not an Akita! <hands Anwen a new abacus!>

Everything progressing well here - I am certainly happy with the result of using this drug. 

The point was made that if a dog could only be shown after being given chemicals it maybe shouldn't be shown at all is certainly a valid point in my opinion. 

Sadly, this is not always the case, as I have found over recent months when questioning other male dog exhibitors etc. 

However, it is not my intention to malign or stand in judgement of anyone through this forum and therefore feel it is best to focus on my original posting. 

I personally felt the need to explore the effects of Tardak on my dog and how it might enable me to continue showing him.  Certainly if it had no effect, there would have been no sense in going ahead with full castration.  It is equally as important to me that my lad can live as part of the family and be considered trustworthy and sociable.

Tardak has provided some sort of answer to my immediate problem.  I am still considering how long to actually make use of it and I'm thinking that time is the only answer.....

Thanks for all your advice everyone.

We have used it twice on our dog.  Two seasons ago he got really blushy with our other male and we ended up with 2 fights in 2 days.  ( it was during peak of season, they are fine together any other time)  So we have had him have the tardak and both times has had a good effect, he is much calmer and he doesn't go so bonkers over the girls which is nice!