I have managed to get myself in a bit of bother again and this time am not going to let this breeder get away with it. I do however need some moral support that what I am doing is right. I am such a soft touch , I tend to feel guilty just defending myself, it's sad really.
Anyway sorry about the long story but this is what has happened.
The breeder in question I have known for about 3 years, I bought a bitch puppy from her. She phoned me early september time in a real state saying that her own bitch had just had her litter (they were just a few days old) and that the housing association had been round and said she was not allowed to rear them at that house. I offered to collect the mum and puppies and rear them here as a favour. All went very well and the puppies all went off to lovely homes, from here.  I did not charge anything for any of this and sent all the puppy money straight onto the breeder. I was however asked if I would like to purchase the mum for a reduced price in return for the work I had put in and as she was now very settled with us (when she arrived she was a nervous wreck) , I agreed.  She said that the Kennel Club registration would be posted to me once the puppies registrations had all been sorted. We had many conversations after that about the papers , mainly that they were taking so long to arrive etc.
Anyway last week out of the blue she sends an email saying that we had never discussed papers and I am not intitled to them as I forced her to sell the mum to me and only paid a pet price for her!!! I am so shocked by it all, how can anyone be so two-faced and plain evil It works out that she is trying to get the mum back so she can breed from her again. Money, money, money!!!
I am not going to let her get away with this and intend to go to the solicitors, KC and the breed club to get it sorted. The papers aren't really that important to be honest, it's just that I don't see why she should be allowed to get away with this.
I am doing the right thing aren't I??

Any advice would be greatly appreciated
Debbie

IMO yes, you are totally doing the right thing. She's pulling a fast one.

I think I would also notify the Tax Office that she has income from breeding puppies - 10:1 she isn't declaring this income!!!

IMO opinion you are doing the right thing - I can't unfortunately offer you any practical advice but I'd say go for it!!  This woman has tried to take you for a ride by the sounds of it and if I were you I'd fight it all the way too!!

Good Luck!!

Hmm debbie you might not like what I'm about to say but it needs to be said ------- you may find yourself on a sticky wicket if the previous owner has the dog still registered in her name as the registration cert shows Ownership of the dog named below etc etc.  This and DNA testing were used against Hillbrea rescue Kennels locally to us with a chinese crested, the DNA proved the dog was sired by x dog and whelped by Y dog which the breeder still had possession of ergo despite all other aspects of the case the dog was returned to the breeder with TV camera's present and costs were awarded against the kennels too I think.  With the registration doc she can claim you have refused to return the dog if she so felt and use them to take you to court to regain possession of this dog as the breeder did in that case and won.

I too reared a litter for a friend last yr, I was paid for my time and services for whelping and rearing the litter and they left from my home not the new owners, the bitch had been rehomed to them in whelp just non of us knew it at the time, even if I'd have wanted to bitch I certainly wouldn't have done the work and then paid them again for the opportunity of owning the bitch, I'd have expected to get the bitch for nothing if they hadn't paid me for the time, food, work etc involved in rearing their bitch. 

I would suggest you contact the puppy buyers if you have their details to get written statements showing the pups left from your house and I'd try to contact the housing ass to get a statement supporting the claim of her not being allowed to rear the pups in their property, present her with that and if she insists on challenging it advise her that you will be happy to counter sue her for the work you've already done and the return of all monies you've also paid for the bitch, small claims court will cover this case with the amount of money it would generate in compensation I just can't remember the cut off amount anymore lol. 

The other option is to write to the KC Development and customer relations people explaining the situation to see if they will transfer the dogs ownership to you without the registration documents, a breeder friend of mine may have to go this way with a bitch that was returned to her along with 2 other dogs but previous owner is refusing to sign said bitch over be it on a form 6 as she claims she can't find the registration docs and has asked KC for replacement copies, we know she hasn't because we asked lol or via the original reg docs.

It is a difficult one as I presume there is nothing in writing. The one thing that is on your side is that you have provided her with a service on taking the bitch and puppies in and so you are entitled to charge for this.

You may have to take her to the small claims court to get this one settled as legally the bitch is still hers unless the agreement was in writing or you have any witnesses that will stand up in court to say what she had agreed. Work out a charge you think is reasonable and let her have this to see what she says. Then see if she still doesn't play ball then the next step I feel would be then to persue this in court.

Not a nice situation to be in especially as you were doing her a favour ! :(

Lucy
xx

Thank-you everyone for your replies,

I am lucky enough to have the backing of several other breeders, some of which she had told about our agreement herself and others which know all too well of her 'dealings'.
I know what I have to do but I just feel so bad having to finish it like this. I'm just not that sort of person, which is the reason I suppose that people think they can take advantage of me. In my 'fluffy little world' (as my husband calls it) people are nice and honest and help each other, whenever possible.
I do have all her microhchip paperwork, signed by the previous owner to change into my name and her heart certificate and pedigree so I really don't think she has a leg to stand on getting the bitch back. There is no way that would ever happen anyway!!
I have just spoken to he Kc and I have to write them a letter stating that the bitch is in my possession, so at least I know she isn't registering more pups from her.
Am I right in thinking that a verbal agreement is legally binding??

Thanks again
Debbie

cant help with much advice or knowledge on this subject but good luck.:)
incidently the KC was really good when a friend of mine had trouble with the breeders of her dog. the breeders had sold to another party ,who couldnt cope & then sold to my friend. the breeders went mad cos they wanted control of who the dogs went to,& werent very helpful when it came to registring the dog,however the KC were brill & sorted it all out for her.

hi jewel i too live in a fluffy little world

i have got two sibes and my younges timber i am still waiting for the papers from.
even though she has reg litters before from this dam she still hasnt reg mine.
i have been on the phone to the kennel club and the breeder several times but still no luck
She still insists she has sent the paper work off and they still insist she hasnt i doubt they are lyin to me.
Every time i speak to her she says  "i wish i didnt answer the phone as its always the people with one of the pups wantin to know whats going on!  Well my q is why not do wat u agreed and sort it out.

i spoke to tradin standards and they said i have rights as she knew i wanted him to race with my other boy. and this is much more diff if i have no papers.

i just dont understand why people do this and are so dishonest.
i say good on ya and i hope it works out

cheryl

Actually I can see the breeders point here. Most reputable breeders would prefer to take pups back and rehome themselves, rather than having them sold on to third parties :( What if the people they sold the dog to were not ideal for that type of dog, ie they had very little background knowledge? Maybe the breeder would prefer to do thorough checks of the homes each of their pups were going to?

ice cosmos, have i misunderstood something?....i didnt think the poster sold the pups without the permission of the breeder.

I wasn't replying to the OP, I was replying to michelles post :)

hi ice cosmos

in my friends case she was on a waiting list for this litter anyway & had there had been more puppies then she would have had one of those.

Oh right - well then I can't see the reason for the breeder to cause trouble, not if she had accepted them onto her list anyway

:)

yes it was odd & unfortunatly caused quite abit of trouble & bad feeling.
the dog is doing really well with his owner,so for her it was a great move,however he dosent carry the breeder affix or chosen name

My friend took in a stray afghan who had been neglected and she nursed it back to health. 6 months later its true owners came forward with papers demanding its return. My friend went to her solicitor for advice. He said the owners had the right to have the dog back, BUT that my friend had the legal right to charge for boarding the dog. Teh owners almost had heart failure on seeing the bill and decided not to pursue their claim on the dog.

In this case too, If this lady has proof of ownership of the bitch, you may not be able to legally contest this. However you have a right to charge fair board for bitch and pups.

Ask this woman to request  the return of the bitch IN WRITING, preferably via a solicitor. When this arrives i suggest agree to co operate with returning the bitch  ON RECEIPT OF THE FOLLOWING...........
£100 per week for boarding the bitch until the last pup was homed. (£800)
£100 per week for boarding each pup                                         (£800 x e.g. 6 = £4,800)
£100 handling fee for your involvement int he financial side             (£100)

TOTAL FEE.............................................................................(£5,700)  

Then you will see how much she wants the bitch back . 

Hi All,

I think there has been some confusion, The puppies went to their new homes from here with full permmission from the former owner, in fact she wanted nothing to do with them!!  They went to lovely family homes and the former owner had all the money from that. I also paid a sum in cash for the mum and was  told that I could have her at the reduced amount for the work I had put in etc. I don't think they is any real arguement as to whether I now own the bitch , it's just the papers that she is holding onto. I have however stopped them from being used through the kennel club which was my main concern.

Debbie