I was informed to buy tripe for my dogs as their food did not contain enough nutrients (Skinners). I have bought some but I have now been told that tripe should not be given to younger dogs as it reduces the phosphates needed for growth. Does anybody know any more about this?

I've fed my dogs Tripe from the day they all came home....it definately hasn't affected their growth!
Archer

Thanks for that I think I just needed reassuring that I was doing the right thing. It seems that everytime I ask someone about feeding they give me advise and then someone else says it is wrong and tell me to do something else! I cant win. Is it true that tripe depleats the level of phosphates??? Do you know.

I've never heard anything to that effect but hopefully someone a bit more knowledgeable will come along.Whatever you feed you will always find some people disagree....
I was recommended the BARF diet by my dogs breeder...a lady who has been breeding and showing dogs sucessfully for more than 25 years.All I can say is my  youngest boy who has been on RAW food since birth is now top size for our breed and has super bone and coat ...so it obviously hasn't had a negative affect on him.
Archer

My pup was raised on BARF and this included tripe, and he is fit and healthy. :-)

We give Skinners to our 8 month old Staff as her breeder has fed all of hers on Skinners muesli mix for 14+ years. What is the problem with the nutrient content? I'd be interested in knowing. .We also give her chicken most days, beef once a week and fish two or three times a week, also she still loves her scrambled egg for beakfast that she has had since a pup and sometimes veggies and fruit . Her coat is wonderful, she is full of beans and bright as a button, does this all sound ok!?

I've been checking this on Google and I'm finding dozens of BARFy web sites saying that green tripe "has an exceptional balance of calcium to phosphorus". It doesn't although it's a lot better then red meat. It is also low in protein for a puppy or youngster.

I do feed green tripe to adults that are not being worked hard every 3rd night but I stick to a good quality complete food for pups, youngsters and hard working dogs. Hate them or not, pet food companies have resources to produce a properly balanced diet that no 'home cooker' does.

jas how often do you give your tripe to your dog I have two, one is 16 months the other is 6 months old both are a large breed.i read you said you dont give your younger one tripe so should i stop giving mine tripe he has not had that much yet anyway.how do you give it to them mix it with there food or on its own.They are on skinners complete but the only thing is I haver been told there is not enough nutrients in sknners alone so if i shouldnt be giving the pup tripe what should I give???

Most of my dogs are giant breeds. I have no experience with Skinners at all, but I wouldn't mix anything extra with a complete food. At 6 months I'd still have a youngster on a good quality complete food (I'm using James Wellbeloved at present but I've tried most of them and have seen no difference between the various 'premium' foods). A couple of years ago I'd have said that by 6 months I'd have changed from the Junior variety to Adult because we all worried about forcing pups with protein levels that are too high. But the latest research shows that excess protein is excreted as long as the food is balanced, so now I keep pups on Junior until ~10 months when the very fast growth begins to flatten out.

At  ~18 months youngsters go on to the typical adult diet which is a a good quality Adult complete food on two nights and green tripe with hound biscuit mixer on the third night. I used to feed red meat and hound meal one night in three when good quality analysed bone meal was easy to get, but since the BSE regulations came in I've stopped. Bone flour or worse plain old bones are too hit and miss for my liking. It was hard going in any case, as I worked very hard to make sure that meal was balanced.

Mine is a working breed so dogs in their prime that are working hard go onto a high energy good quality working dog complete food and don't get the tripe meal. The only supplement my lot get is some suet as they are known to have a higher fat requirement than average.

Skinners only comes in puppy and adult. I am at the moment giving the pup a mix that is predominantly puppy with a small amount of adult. I aws planning to feed him adult on its own when he is approx 9 - 10 months as this is what I did with the older one and he is a good standard of the great dane, So it doesnt seem to have affected his development.
Do you think I should give just the adult tripe every three days?
   Both dogs do have sardines twice a week.

Hi, I had a look at the Skinners web site - http://www.skinnerspetfoods.co.uk/field.htm - and they do a good range of foods in the Field & Trial section. Without knowing the breed and how much exercise your dogs get I couldn't advise, especially as I've never used Skinners, but I reckon a good rule of thumb is not to add anything to complete foods. The best person to talk this over with is your breeder.

Hi

I didn't get your mail - can you resend?

Happy to give Dane dietry advice but I am not going to do it on here. As your dogs came from Jo and she recommends Tripe to feed them I really wouldn't worry :) I can show you pics of 2 very healthy danes :)

:)

chloe could you give me your e.mail again as i have sent you 2?or mine is stewarrior2004@yahoo.co.uk thanks

mailed you :)

Ok here's the spanner in the works.   I would not feed tripe to any puppy I owned again.    When I bought Asti I thought I would feed a similar diet to the one my Munster male had been fed on - by his breeder - as a puppy, this diet included raw minced tripe.    Around the same time a friend of mine got a Ridgeback puppy and followed the diet of this puppies breeder - again a diet with tripe in it.

Within a month, the Ridgie was screaming in pain, he wouldn't move and was taken straight to the vets.   Diagnosis was made after an x-ray that his growth plates had been affected and the probable cause was tripe.   He was put straight onto a complete puppy kibble and it helped him greatly.

Asti was ok on her diet until the age of 6 months when she refused to move and looked like she was in pain if I tried to get her too.    I took her to the vets and after she was x-rayed too.  Her bones were almost transparent due a lack of calcium, the cause?  Tripe.  It is imbalanced in phosporous to tripe, lower in the latter.   She was given a high dose of calcium tablets and I was advised to switch to a puppy complete (& no not Hills, my vets don't promote it).  She was x-rayed a few weeks later & her bones were almost back to their proper density.

We then heard of another puppy around the same time with growth plate problems too...and it was also being fed tripe as part of her diet.   This was a Wolfhound.  Coincidence?  I don't think so.

One thing these 3 puppies weren't getting as youngsters that my first Munster was getting in his diet was a daily calcium tablet.   

So going by firsthand experience, not hearsay, I'd say no to tripe for a puppy but yes as an adult.

phosporous to tripe

Duh.....must have had my blonde head on - phosporous to calcium!

Jas do you have any research links about tripe not being a pretty good balance of ph to calcium, thanks?
Christine, Spain.

Link below about info for raw feeding large breed dogs, includes tripe as well :)
http://www.irishwolfhounds.org/nutrition.htm#Raw%20food

Green Tripe - http://www.nutritiondata.com/facts-001-02s02or.html or http://www.greentripe.com/analysis.htm or http://www.barfworld.com/html/barf_diet/barfmates_nutrient.shtml (no figures for Ca or K)

Not terrible, as I said in the previous post, but not ideal so I prefer not to give it to pups & youngsters. The main problem with tripe as a food for puppies & fast growing youngsters is the low protein content. It does however have a high fat content. That and the fact that they love it is why I do give it to adults when they are not being exercised too hard.

I have always fed my young dogs on tripe. If I have a litter I wean them onto baby rice with goats milk etc and then onto best beef and by the time they are eight weeks they are on two milk meals a day and two meat one consisting of tripe. I also include other things such as fish, veg, cottage cheese and yoguart etc.  They grow at the normal rate for my breed and my adults are generally fed tripe, either minced or a large chunk, each day without any problems as well as their natural mixer. 

Do you'll feed just BEEF tripe? What about lamb,goat etc. are they o.k to throw into the mix aswell? Does tripe from different animals have the same fat,protein content etc.?

Rose

Yes it is generally beef tripe. I do occasionally give them a whole sheep tripe to chew on but not that often since I was told by an old breeder many years ago that lamb tripe carries more worms but not sure if that is true. They also have lamb mince and occasionally rabbit, but I have never given them goat.

I add meat to my dogs 'complete food' about 3 times per week, every day if they are in whelp or lactating. I believe this increases their iron, protein and vit levels. I have a supply of venison heart. liver and other bits. However I have wondered if this may ' unbalance a balanced proprietary food, does anybody know if this is the case.
They have always done very well on it by the way.
Amos

It all depends on your definition and expectation of "balanced"...

IMO pet food manufactuers are in business to make as much profit as possible, therefore they are going to make their pet food as balanced as possible as cheaply as possible.

Any anyway - who would want to eat a perfectly balanced food consisting of the same flavour and the same taste every day? My danes have Burns and Naturediet in the morning and Burns and Tripe in the evening and they certainly don't look unbalanced to me :D

A commercial food will be  balanced for the average dog but who owns the average dog?

Since all dogs are unique how do we know what is out of balance for a particular dog.

I think we all consider that if our dog is in good condtion etc we are feeding it a suitable diet no matter what that diet is.

At one point I had three dogs all on a different complete food as each "blossomed" on a different one but lost condition when fed one of the other ones.

Years ago a respected vet/ journalist advised feeding your dog a variety of different complete foods on a rotation basis as each supplied a different proportion of nutrients. eg one of my dogs had skin problems that cleared up when I fed Omega which had more zinc in it that other foods. 

This subject of a 'balanced meal every feedtime' never ceases to amaze me!

Most people eat what they like each day without worrying whether it is balanced or not. You may choose to eat a burger one evening, a salad the next followed by liver casserole etc. the next day.
Obviously any one meal in itself is not balanced with all the nutritional requirements necessary for good health, but providing that you eat a wide variety of food, with different vitamin and mineral components, over a period of weeks the body should be getting everything it needs.

It is exactly the same for a dog, we give ours a wide variety of meaty bones from different animals, a variety of offal and muscle meats which ensures that they get all the correct nutrients.
We may feed them lamb ribs every day for 3 or 4 days and then a few days of chicken, followed by a meal of offal or muscle meat but it does not matter because they are getting balnce over time.

A dog does not need to be fed a perfectly balanced meal everytime he is fed, don't worry, he won't  drop dead from any defficiency by missing a few complete meals.

Live dangerously, give your dog some tripe or chicken wings for a change, it may not be 100% nutritionally balanced but the look on your dog's face will tell you whether he is worried or not!

Snomaes

Couldn't agree more...I try to give my dogs a balance over a couple of weeks...not every day!
Archer

Why do people compare dogs to humans??, they are completly different species and when it comes to nutrition just cant be compared. 
Our dogs dont have the luxury of deciding what they eat they have to eat what we give them, and because of this I think a balance is necessary especially if in whelp or lactating. If left to nature the dog would seek out nutrients it lacks we have removed that choice so I wouldnt be too relaxed about that responsibility.
Amos 

<Why do people compare dogs to humans??, they are completly different species and when it comes to nutrition just cant be compared.>

Of course dogs are different to humans, it's a shame that more people do not realise this. Although their nutritional needs differ from ours,  we still have the common requirement for certain nutritional essentials in our diets.
These are available in a variety of food sources and providing a variety of food is given, all the essentials will be available.

I also realise that many humans have a problem feeding themselves nowadays and many exist on a human equivalent of commercial complete foods. This is probably why many people only feel comfortable feeding a dog  if they use complete foods.

<Our dogs dont have the luxury of deciding what they eat they have to eat what we give them, and because of this I think a balance is necessary especially if in whelp or lactating.>

Exactly! That is why we give our dogs meat, bone & offal from a selection of different species. This ensures that the nutrients are balanced over time. Our bitches certainly do have a choice of what they will eat, when they are in whelp or lactating, their regular diet is rejected and they choose only to eat high-protein, lower bone content food. This seems to be an instinct in them which we of course encourage during this important time.

Snomaes

Snomaes, which human food do you consider an equivalent to a canine complete food, as far as I am aware there are no foods marketed as such (not even Potnoodle, all you students out there :D) human convenience foods are something completely different, full of fats, sugars and salt intented to tempt but never marketed as the correct way to eat on a permanent basis, I would never feel comfortable feeding my dogs something in that category.

<Snomaes, which human food do you consider an equivalent to a canine complete food, as far as I am aware there are no foods marketed as such>

Sorry, I meant convenience foods which I consider take as much time and forethought and are as nutritionally beneficial as feeding a dog complete food.

<human convenience foods are something completely different, full of fats, sugars and salt intented to tempt>

Not so different then, this sounds like an accurate description of a commercial complete food!

Sorry but its not an accurate description of a complete dog food to me, none that I know anyway, which one would you say was high in fat, sugar and salt.

Agree with you 100% snomaes! When cooking dinner for our families we dont give .1% veg  6%meat .5% gravy,so we dont need to do it with our dogs,As long as they get a bit of EVERYTHING over the course of a week or two,you cant go much wrong :)

Sadly, Rose, humans can go very wrong with their nutrition :) hence the physical condtion of the average person in the western world

And so can dogs - even those fed on a complete balanced diet...but thats a lack of exercise more than anything else!

I'm sure thats half of it Chloe!  But I sometimes think it would be rather good if someone did produce a complete food for humans and the lazy ones could be put on the Lite version :D

Tripe is an excellent food to feed dogs however not as the SOLE diet.  Feeding anything on its own will not provide the varied nutrients a dogs needs.  There is no one raw, cooked or commercial food that contains the perfect balance for all dogs.

hi i feed my bullmastiffs and japanese spitz on barf i would say that tripe would be about 1/4 of ther diet the rest of the diet is chicken wings/backs ,minced lamb ,veg ,yogot ,cottage cheese ,heart ,liver ,never would i feed complete food as this to me would be like us eating dry cornflakes every day (how dull) have you ever seen how much water your dog drinks in a day if you feed complete. If you feed barf your dog would drink 80% less water to me that says it all.

                                                        Richard

Why should it matter whether the fluid is imbibed as part of the food or seperately?

my point is that there is more to a diet than dry food and water

                                                richard

Sorry your point is missing me :) what did this bit mean then?

>If you feed barf your dog would drink 80% less water to me that says it all.

my point is when you have cereal you do not have it dry and have a glass of milk after you have them together so why should we make our dogs ?
hope this is more understood

                                                       richard

Ah I see!!! Well if it helps I can assure you they don't seem to mind at all in fact mine have always really enjoyed the crunchy and then really enjoyed a slurp afterwards :)

I soak my dogs' dry food ...

All meat is high in phosphorous and low in calcium, that is why if feeding tripe or any other meat that either bones or bonemeal should also be fed.     Calcium, phosphorous and magnesium should be fed in correct proportions to eachother.    Magnesium is abundent in green veg/herbage and grass.   Therefore a diet of raw meaty bones and vegetables as a base will be balanced in these nutrients.

The correct proportions of these minerals to eachother is actually more important than the amounts.

A diet based on meat alone will cause bone and kidney malfunction as well as other disorders.

Wendy

I know someone on another site who only feeds muscle meat,bones and a few organs,does this sound balanced?
She feeds no supplements,veg or grains.I'm aware the last 2 arent neccarsary but they couldnt hurt,especially the veg???

There seems to be a split as to whether vegs are required or not.Grains are not needed and suppliments are fed by some and not others as well so it seems as long as proportions are goos your freinds dogs diet will be ok
Nikki