My bitch has just come into season, and I have started her on Synulox.  My question is that my vet has given her 2 x 250mg tablets twice a day - a total of 4 daily.  I can't remember how many she had last time, but speaking to a friend last night we agreed that this dose seems rather large.  She weighs about 25kg.  My friend's last bitch had two 250mg tablets daily - same weight animal.  Does anyone have any thoughts on this.

It would probably depend on how bad the infection is - if there is no infection I do not see any point in giving bitches anti-biotics as dogs are now also becoming resistant to them

I absolutely agree with you.  She is the only one I have ever given antibiotics to pre-mating. 

But as a 4-month old puppy she had a really nasty discharge and was swabbed positive for BHS. Synulox cleared it up, but a year later she was swabbed again, and it had come back, so that is why she always has Synulox pre-mating.

I have noticed the my vets give different amounts depending upon the severity of the infection and/or whether it is post-op prevention - perhaps she is worse this time.  Maybe best to check with your vet just in case he has made a mistake

She hasn't been examined, it is just a precaution.  The stud dog owner is also insisting on it for visiting bitches.  I have just phoned the vet and asked what she was given last time.  It was one and a half 250mg tablets twice a day, so I am going to amend the dose to that. 

I have done a Champdogs search for folic acid, and am going to give that this time.  So with 6 folic acid tablets a day, plus antibiotics, she is going to run when she sees me coming clutching various bottles.  Several friends are shaking their heads in horror at the thought of giving a pregnant bitch the folic acid, and are going to watch the outcome with interest. 

God, I hope there are no side effects.  But she had a puppy with a cleft palette in her first litter (fairly common in my breed), and it was heartbreaking to have it put to sleep.  It seemed normal, just very small - too small to grip the mum's big teats, and I bottle fed it every hour and a half round the clock for a week, until it recognised when I was near it and would try to climb into my hands.  After a week, although she was putting on weight, she still couldn't suck properly - I just squeezed milk slowly into her mouth - so I took her to the vet, thinking perhaps she just had a short tongue, and was so upset when he said she had a cleft palette right at the back of her throat and nothing could be done.

My girl is day 8 of her season and also on a course of anti-biotics (synulox) I'm giving a 13.5kg bitch 1/2 tablet 2x daily.........oh yes and the folic acid and Wheatgerm :-)

Hi Sharon

Are you giving 6 folic acid a day?

I'm giving 3x 800 strength..........so if you're using the 400 then yes 6 x is fine, you can't overdose, anything their bodies don't need comes out in their wee! :-)

If you say so ..... (fingers well crossed!)

By the way, I do hope things go well for you this time.

Me too, I'm really worried already (this is a different girl)  I just hope it all goes to plan this time.

Good luck to you too!

Good luck Sharron,let us know how it goes.Julia

PJW ~ you say your bitch has tested positive to Beta heamalitic streptococci on two occasions~ has she been tested for this now?

We ask for any bitch who comes who has previously not held to the dog to have a course of Synulox; also any bitches who are not maidens.    Maybe we should stretch it to all bitches, I'm not sure.

We have managed to have two previously barren bitches in whelp - whether it was the antibiotic or more accurate management, I'm not sure, but something worked!

Jo and the Casblaidd Flatcoats

I've had long conversations with my vet, after my bitch lost her litter back in the summer, she has agreed to let us put the girls on anti-biotics for a week before mating, so hopefully it will help!

As BHS is sensitive to Synulox, a course of Synulox (or the cheaper generic version) will kill it if present.  As the stud dog owner is asking for her to have antibiotics anyway, swabbing as well as antibiotics would be pointless. 

Incidentally Jo, until she was swabbed positive at 4 months, I also thought maiden bitches would be OK and never asked for them to be put onto antibiotics before mating. 

Maybe they should all be on Synulox then

Jo

Jo

I always run a course of synulox through my bitches from day 5 of their season, right through for two weeks, twice daily.

all my girls were on synulos before mating plus all the bitches that came to rush were put on it, all my bitches took and had puppies and so did rush.

so no failers  in this house bye using synulos.

We would never put our bitches on anti-biotics as a routine caution before mating. If anti-biotics are used routinely when infection is not present, they become either less effective or do not work at all when the dogs system is really challenged by an infection.

Also, I hope that all the stud dog owners who insist on having visiting bitches on anti-biotics also take their males to the vets for swabs and anti-biotic treatment before every mating. It seems a bit pointless insisting on the bitches being treated and not the stud-dog, who is far more likely to be passing on infections to visiting bitches if he is used on a regular basis.

Years ago, we also insisted on bitches being swabbed before using our stud-dogs, but after a while could not see the point. In every bitch tested, a degree of bacterial infection was always detected. This is perfectly normal and not surprising considering the anatomy of the bitch.

snomaes

For how often a bitch should be mated, I'm sure the odd course of anti-biotics isn't going to hurt, it's not as if it's a monthly thing.  My girls are mated every 2 years so I'm sure their bodies won't get immune to the Synulox when the max I let my girls have is 3 litters.......it's just a precaution, my girl that was mated in the summer didn't have any infection at the time of mating but still went on to lose her litter at 7 weeks, vet isn't sure why, but she did think if she had been on anti-biotics at the time then there was a chance of her litter surviving.

So I will continue using the anti-biotics  :-)

To those of you that insist on a course of Synulox when a bitch comes into season/before they visit your dogs

What if any infection they may or may not have is resistant to Synulox or this is not the ideal anti-biotic to deal with it?

MRSA is now in some vet surgeries as well as hospitals (although this is not widely known or admitted) so we are storing up problems by giving anti-biotics to our dogs when they don't really need them.  It does not matter how rarely they are given as overall in the canine community it all adds up

I do prefer not to use antibiotics routinely - especially if it is a maiden bitch.  Years ago I had a champion bitch who missed twice for no apparent reason.  Before the second time she was mated I had her swabbed (nothing showed up), but she still missed.  The third time I insisted on antibiotics anyway, because she was nearly 4 years old and I began to think she wouldn't have pups at all.  This time she had 11.  (this was before Premates were widely used, but it wouldn't have mattered anyway because she would only accept the dog on 2 days)

I don't insist on antibiotics for bitches that come to my dog, but I do have him swabbed from time to time as a precaution.

I know there are arguments for and against the pre-mating administration of antibiotics, but we don't go to the expense of getting them blindly and without consideration, we do it beause we are trying to safeguard the health of our dogs and their progeny.

Well I must be doing something wrong????  ;)  

I have mated 2 bitches a total of 3 times between them ( 1 litter for 1 bitch, 2 for the other) and had 14 puppies in each litter, from only 1 mating with the dog on Day 13 of their seasons.   None have been on antibiotics either!  

You have been very lucky! :-)    I've had 4 litters without anti-biotics in the past, but after our disaster in the summer we will use them as a precaution, with full backing of our vet.

I agree, you have been lucky, but I bet if you had a bitch that kept missing for no obvious reason, you would try antibiotics (especially if the vet suggested it - as mine did). 

I don't use them routinely - only on this bitch for the reasons already stated - if BHS can occur in a healthy baby puppy and then recur for no reason I would be stupid if I took her 300 miles for a mating without taking precautions.

Through overuse of antibiotics for a skin condition one of my bitches became immune to the effects of 2 different antibiotics and I was left with no option but to have to use an expensive anti-biotic.     We always used to joke that if you saw Mr.****** in that practice you'd come away with anti-biotics no matter what the problem was, they were handed out like Smarties! 

Incidentally, since stopping the antibiotic & steroid misuse prescribed by a vet, my bitch has never had the itchy skins she suffered when on the medication in the first place.    I would be very wary of using anti-biotics for prevention rather than a cure.

We're not talking of overuse here, just once every 2 years now that's not extreme!

My vet has since said had my bitch (that lost her litter at 7 weeks) been on anti-biotics then there is a good chance she would have had a healthy litter, her cervix hadn't closed after her season and stayed slightly open during pregnancy, there was no infection, we had a PCV blood test done to check, so this is the reason we have decided to use the anti-biotics purely as a precaution.........surely in these type cases anti-biotics for prevention is better than having to use them for a cure?

It's not the dogs that become immune to the antibiotics it's the bacteria! That is how strains such as MRSA developed in the first place, antibiotics were overused, prescribed courses were not always completed thus allowing the bacteria to change and become immune to common antibiotics. The obvious consequence of this in humans is MRSA and other resistant organisms - thats why it can be a killer!