Not a question but thought it would be good to post this. On our usual walk tonight I spotted in the distance a man walking his GSD, Tia still on lead and called to Bailey to put his lead on.  GSD owner did not put his dog on lead. Getting closer, Tia was, as usual up on hinds legs to play, Bailey tries the same. Bailey is brill. on his own, when two together they think its playtime. Normally I would ask dog owner to pass me as I held my pups in a sit and leave command. However GSD owner saw they were pups desperate to play and asked if I wanted to do a bit of social training as his dog would tolerate them. I didnt know what to say, so tentatively said yes thank you. Let Tia off lead and bang, a tank couldnt have hit the poor GSD any harder. I couldn't believe it, Dog didnt blink let alone move.  He had been placed in a down stay, and thats what he did. Tia came back to her recall when I decided she had been outwitted. Bailey went over quietly to say hello tried to play and came back. On our way home we met our two friends the springers. Ah well what can I say, 4 dogs rolled into one. I hope to meet the GSD again and such a pleasant owner. A little touch of sanity :)

A breath of fresh air!!!!  What a lovely chap, I wish more owners were like him.

I have to say, it is lovely to meet other owners who are happy for dogs to meet up, but... :( ... if i read your post aright, did that poor GSD have to stay in a down stay whilst another dog ran up to it and barged it really hard?

If that is the case, I'm not totally sure the owner was being fair to his own dog...

Sorry to put a bit of a downer on it, of course i could be reading the situation totally wrongly :)

Lindsay
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yeah i think the same hardly fair on the gsd.surely it would have been better if they were allowed to play etc.it is nice to come across owners that are like this we met some on the park yesterday and allowed tob to say hello in the dog manner to their.for once people asked if he was ok we said yes and allowed the dogs to be dogs and his size didn't matter.when we said his age they understood he was only a pup which made them realise that he needs to learn to say hello to others.we met loads of different dogs all small ones and his approach is finally improving which is great to see.the best was a pug it ran up to him and wanted to play,but as soon has he tryed to it ran away. we don't let him off because he would bother dogs and owners alike and not every one will treat him fair and see him as a pup.so we have him on a 25ft lunge line it helps him to stay near us so others can see that he is big but still under control.as my fear is that if any  thing happened he would get the blame down to his size.we are going to take him daily to the park and avoid dogs if needed by walking away as the only way he is going to learn his manners is to mix more.then when i think he is ok and calm i will take him when more dogs are on there.
he loves it and i want to but he needs to learn not to lunge to dogs to say hello and play.

While it is nice for dogs to mix and play, some dogs do have to learn that as part of their work they will have to stay when others are bounding up to them. My own gundogs are working dogs and it is amazing how often when we are out training somebody will allow their "friendly" dog just run straight up to my dogs. If I don't keep my dogs in a down or sit stay, they then think it is ok to run around when we are out on a shoot. Equally if a dog is a guide dog or partner for indepence dog then I would assume the same thing applies, they would need to be steady when other dogs run up, and regardless of what the other dog did to it.

I'm not saying that this was what the GSD was trained for, only that I can see why the owner might want to do this. If I have my dog in a stay position, I want it to do exactly that regardless of what happens next.

Some years ago a visitor left my garden gate open. I didn't know, and the first I knew about it was when I looked out across the very busy road outside my house and saw one of my dogs raiding a bin on the other side. I knew she would see me and run straight back to me, as I went outside to my horror, several cars & the local bus were speeding up the road. I just yelled Down Stay! Thankfully she did even though she could not see me for the traffic whizzing past. When the cars and bus had gone past, I was able to cross the road and slip her lead on her and bring her back to safety, no harm done to dog or traffic. Had she not been taught to stay regardless of what happened to her, she may well have got up and tried to come to me when her line of sight to me, was obscured by the traffic.

I think the owner must have had his reasons to train his dog to accept this, and the fact he was willing to allow you to let your dogs off was really very nice of him. I would rather have that, than somebody strolling up with a loose dog while I am trying to train my puppy, then letting their dog bounce all around my puppy, distracting him and possibly making him break a sit stay or down stay.

Ever the optimist, I must admit that my interpretation was the same as Polly's.
I also would of been thrilled that a fellow dog owner wanted to share elements of training that both dogs were learning from.
Jo
:)

When Fagan was a pup we met a leonburger (SP?) in the woods and poor little Fagan was petrified of this huge dog and he turned and ran with his tail between his legs   I got hold of him and put him on the lead the and leos owners put him in a down stay and let Fagan meet him (this made them the same height) Fagan was ok after that and even put his paw in the other dogs head :D :D :D  Now when we meet them Fagan is still cautious but not afraid and always greets him :)

I used to have a GSD boy just like this one. It is a lot better it there is to be any learning on the younger dogs part that running into other dogs gets no reaction, if there is no reaction then the dog will learn that there is no point in doing it.

For another example. A young do is frightened by an older bigger dog in play & then starts to go into defence mode & attack first. Bringing this dog on leasd into contact with my well trained calm dog it attacks my dog who does not react(no my dog wasn't harmed), Owner takes dog away & then brings it back & it attacks again-again my dog doesn't react. After a few sessions the dog reacts only by barking & the handler gives leave command & at the same time walks away. This is again repeated. Eventually the younger dog no longer barks & when told leave & heel goes into the heel position. Eventually the younger no longer reacts & a problem is solved

This was a good experience as not all dogs will want to play & some will.

I doubt very much that the GSD was hurt For thise people who have never owned a GSD they do play very rough & charge & hit it other & bark in normal play

Nice to here a positive experience for your dogs

Hi what a lovely experience to meet a nice dog owner willing to let your pups socialise with his dog and a very well behaved one as well.

I have a newfie and if she meets small dogs and puppies and they are running around her legs it can spook her but if she meets them and she is laying down she is not spooked at all and enjoys meeting them, so this is what we do when we meet small dogs. We only found out she got spooked by small dogs when she dragged me down a lane because 2 Shitz Zu (sp?) puppies who looked about 5 inches tall wanted to play.:) Imagine my embarrassment when I had to say to the guy "sorry I'm gonna have to go because she's frightened.:)

Nikki

I totally agree dogs need to be obedient and to down when told, but (taking it away a bit from the GSD situation and making it more hypothetical) I wouldn't expect my dog to stay whilst being actually run at and barged. "Yes" to staying whilst other dogs break from theirs, or if a dog goes up to it slowly or runs past, one can be proud of an obedient and well trained dog; but "no" IMHO to expecting a dog to stay when in "danger" :)

Lindsay
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Hi Lindsay

Well if it is a hypothetical situation then I dont think most dog owners would expect their dog to be in a down stay in a dangerous situation and I definately wouldn't, being barged by a dog that is 20 inches smaller than my girl Izzy is like being hit with cotton wool to her.:)

Nikki

Hi all, sorry I havent been back in. Pups born on Tuesday and I am shattered. Yes , I can understand how some of you feel regarding the 'poor' GSD, but in a controlled situation it was not as bad as it sounded. The GSD would himself have sensed any danger as would the owner.  My pups were whimpering on the end of their leads desperate to play, you know the scene. Even I didnt realise that Tia would 'fling' herself at him, I thought she would probably fly over the top of him. I had to wait for her to calm down and realise that the other dog was not going to entertain her, so I could do a recall. Bailey had witnessed his boredom, so when he went over he did not pay GSD as much attention and recall was instant. After that, they sniffed and did doggy things without the rough play, a very pleasant social event.  And yes, I would do the same with my dogs, Bailey is being trained as a gundog and I would expect the same from him if placed in a similar situation. But would never place him in danger.  Interesting interpretations though, It is difficult for me to try and explain it better, but it wasnt as bad as it sounded, honest :)

Kay

That's good then, the internet is never that good for communication, is it? :)

Really good to hear that they all had a pleasant social time and did doggy things together, it sounds as if  all the dogs were very happy.

Good luck with those pups!

Lindsay
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