Hi I have not really posted on this topic before so all please bare with me! My four year old Boarder Collie Molly has yet to be spayed. She is rescued dog from Battersea Dogs home. My friend has suggested that I let Molly have pup's before she has the op? I am in two minds because I heard that it does do bitches good but don't want to be irresponsalbe and having more dogs that need rehoming. Molly is all Boarder Collie so to speak but not a ped. dog. Can anyone adivse me on whether it is good for bitches to have a litter or not?

Julieann

Did you not you sign anything, when you picked her up from Battersea to say that you would not breed from her?

Hi Leigh no not that I can remember? Molly did not have a Session while she was in Battersea. She was in shock as they called it. They did give me a voucher to help get her spayed though. I just wanted to know whether it is true that letting your bitch have one litter is good for her? Don't worry there is no way that I would let anything harm Molly.

Julieann

NOT!
Breeding is not always very easy even for the most experienced of breeders and should not be enterd into lightly, as for the bitch being better natured etc.. after having pups i also think that is nonsense! If your dog is not a full pedigree you will probably have a lot of difficulty finding homes for them. My advise would be to have her spayed now, unless YOU really, really want some puppies then read all the articles on this board and do some more research. You could just be creating a lot of heartache for yourself.

Westiworld

Yep new that was coming my way! I thought it was an old wives tale that one! Molly is in Season at the moment I am booking her in to have her op in two months time I think I was told to wait after she gets back to normal! I do not want to add to the rehoming problems of dogs. So sad that so many people do not take care of their hounds and add to all the worry's for the rehoming centres.

But thanks for the advise well and truly read and understood!!!

Julieann

hello
i always wonder why people suggest that bitches should have puppies before being spayed ??? just curious as to what you friends reasons were ???? and as other people have mentioned you should have signed to say that you are not to breed as with any rescue dog from any charity, luckily it sounds as though you know what you are doing !!!

Chloedog,
For some reason the myth that bitches should have at least one litter keeps getting perpetuated by some people in many professions. These old wives' tales just keep rolling along despite evidence to the contrary. I have heard it from vets, breeders, owners, obedience trainers, and other people who never even had pets.

Personally, I think it might have to do with "sympathy pangs" where we attribute human emotions to our dogs. Just like many men don't approve of neutering because they wouldn't want it done to them, there seems to be the idea that motherhood is neccessary for a bitch's wellbeing, just like a woman wouldn't want it removed from her life. Who knows? Just guessing here.

If there are any questions about spaying/neutering your pet...do a search on any engine for "benefits of spaying." A lot of interesting information comes up.
toodles

thanks for your reply ! the amount of dog owning men who won't have their male dogs castrated is amazing !!!! they often feel guilty !! i suppose i can understand it as men are such bad patients anyway ! i have never heard anyone give a good reason for the bitches having one litter etc other than its an old wives tale ?? yet so many people believe it is the right thing to do, and i hear a lot of it at work believe me ( i'm a vn) i would never advise anyone to keep a unnuetered male or female unless they were of show quality/breeding etc (which my girl is ) but as soon as the time comes i will have her spayed, apart from the mess the bitches cause, medical reasons have proof of mammary tumours, pyometras, phantoms,etc, and with the entire male, testicular cancer, prostrate cancer, behaviour etc. so why risk your putting your pet through such nasties if they can be avoided ?? i do agree that you should wait until they are mature before neutering.

change the subject a moment but its been bugging me for ages how do you get the smiley faces ????????

Chloe--- click on Help in the upper righthand corner & scroll down the page. The codes for the faces are all there.

cool thanks !!!! :d (hope this works!)

With the problems farmers are having border collies are one of the breeds with a major rescue problem, being working breed they are not ideal as a pet for the majority of people who tend to theink anything more than an hours need for excesrsise is hyperactivity!

It definately is an old wives tale, and with Mollies distrust of people it would be very hard on her having people lookng at her pups, and most people rightly would not want a puppy from a bitch that exhibited a poor temperament to people. they would only have your word for it that it is not an inherited character trait!

My Obedience friend who has a houseful of rescues, (some only experienced people like her and her husband can handle) says that the first test for breeding is Temperament. Not Type or Working Ability. A dog that is of poor Type, or poor working ability can at least be a good pet if it has a sound temeperament (which is what 90% of dogs are destined to be solely), but with a poor temeperament the most beautiful dog, or one with great drive for work, is USELESS!

Have her spayed and save her the stress, and her puppies the risk of ending up like she did!

That is a very interesting point re temperament Brainless (you're giving away the fact that you're not as Brainless as you make out <G>)

This is the golden rule to which my breeder always adheres to-'Breeders of quality with temperament 1st and foremost in mind'.

There was no way that I was going to put my Molly through anymore bless her. Just wanted to know why people do keep saying how much it would be good to let her have puppies? And NO I did not sign anything saying that I can not breed from her?? and I have NO intention of doing so. it just shows that some people just don't have any idea about dogs?

Julieann

Perhaps it's the same mode of thinking that I get from people, especially women, when I say that I want only one or two kids. I've been told that once I get started with babies, I won't want to stop. Uh, I think I know myself pretty well now. Having lots of kids has never been my dream, nor my husband's. :D Besides I'm too old for more than 1/2 healthy children now ;-)
toodles

hello julieann, do you mean battersea or your friend not having any idea about dogs ??? curious !!

Nooo!! Not Battersea, my mate! I do have to say though when we did travel down to Battersea Dogs Home just how well we were treated and very much veted before we even meet Molly. Though did get quite heart broken looking at all the other hounds wanting to come home with me very sad place really.

Julieann

i know can't bring myself to go !!!!

I don't think I could go either- I'd end up with the ugliest, oldest, scabbiest old dog ever- just because I felt sorry for it for the fact that I knew probably no one else would take it:( My other half had a cat once from a rescue centre and it died after only 6 months- he was still young and his Dad said to him- think of it in the way that at least he had his last 6 months being happy,free and loved here rather in a cattery:(- so he agreed he'd want to take an older dog just to give it that bit of life back as he thinks they deserve it after all they've probably been through in their lives:( Can't you just tell we could never visit one of those places:( I do pay a £2 direct debit montly to the National Canine Defence League- not much but it's better than nothing.

Stacey

I do agree that Boarder Collies really are not for Pets, but I have to say that I have grown up with BC's male dogs since I was 13 years old and they are worked and kept going all day long. I still think it's not the dog but the owner? that is true that so many BC's are waiting for new homes because they may look so cute as a pup but if you don't keep them going not just walk's but jobs so to speak during the day then there you go, all of them waiting to be rehomed. Very sad.

Julieann

I love BC's like I love all dogs, but I realize that I'm not the right owner for them at the start :D They have to have a daily job, or they'll create one...possibly at the detriment to the owner :rolleyes: I do like watching them in herding competitions.

very true. If I did not know so much about them and have had the pleasure of living with BC's for many years than I would too be saying how much I love them, but I am not the right person for them. But I also think that goes for most dogs don't you think? I really do enjoy posting on this site as you do get so much information and advise given.

Julieann

Julieann,
I know exactly what you're talking about. There's a lot of breeds out there that I appreciate, but I have to be practical and realize that we would not have happy matches together. Most are med-large breeds that were bred for "purposes", such as hunting, sled, herd, and other work activities. I also know that I wouldn't live well with a dog that either needs me too much or has a heavy coat--allergies & clean-up efforts.
I also am not in the position of being able to care for more than the two I do have. So I have to be content with these two and help others out who have problems in their partnerships :D

I know what you mean about coming here. It's helped me to not be lonely with Michael gone for so long. I also can be obsessed about canines and not have others around me think I'm too much alone and getting wierd habits :D Even when there's communication difficulties going on, it's a friendly place to hang out :D
toodles

Could not agree more with you. Yep some times even I have been found guilty of it jumping up and down if I don't like a reply etc, but in the main I do very much enjoy chatting away about our dogs. I like to think we are a friendly bunch!!

Julieann

Is this a special type that likes going into kennels then??? (boarder/border)

oooh, a Sunday punner ;-)

Julieann, just wanted to say how much I like the idea of a collie called Molly ! Was she called this when you got her or did you chose the name ?
Jackie
PS like you I love the breed - my husband's family are farmers so all keep working collies. Its really a joy to watch them. First time I visited the family farm I had to pass the "Scott test". He was the old sheepdog, came at you barking and looking really agressive but wagging his tail at the same time. He liked me, so I was OK! Unfortunately I have to accept that they are not the breed for me at the moment. Probably brighter than me anyway.

hugen

Molly is the name she had a Battersea. We never wanted to change it as she suites "Molly". I am so lucky to have her, she is my best friend and the sad thing is she will only trust my husband and me no one else so then she will show her past life as she gets very upset and worried with strangers. But she knows that we will never hurt her or put her in any posistion that she feels threatend. She keeps us very busy ans she needs to do her jobs in the day tennis ball need I say more??!! then off for long walks in the evening. If I ever got my hands on those scum who hurt her I would end up doing "time"!!!! Sorry but I do get so cross.

Julieann

Julieann
I can understand why you get so cross about what Molly went through. The relationship you have with her sounds wonderful. I'm so glad you were able to win her trust. You sound as if you know her really well. When you went to Battersea how did you know she was the dog for you ?
Its great to hear that she is your best friend. That's what I miss about not having a dog - they love you for who you are, listen to all your troubles and never once say "I told you so" ! Hope you have lots of happy times together. Give Molly a hug from me.
Jackie.
PS good luck for when she has her op.

hugen

We had to go around Battersea's kennels very sad and were told not to pick one dog out as we might not be suitable for it. So we ended up almost in tears wondering around the home looking at these poor dogs and we choosed 17 dogs! Mainly all Boarder Collies and one little brown dog with wirery furr. and out of all the dogs Molly was the only dog that would be suitable. Battersea take down all your details the hours your away from home etc were you live. If you live in there caption area you will have to have a home visist before you can take you dog home. But as we lived in Milton Keynes at the time and I have so much experience with the BC's Battersea were more than happy to let us take our Molly home. We have never looked back since. I am very proud of m lass and one day we hope she will be able to be fussed by strangers without us having to worry about her nipping problem just trying to get her to trust. Why do people get such kicks out of hurting dogs or any other animal is one subject I don't think I will ever understand?

Julieann