Hi,

My hubby may have to go to the United Arab Emirates to work and we (the rest of the family including Alfie, 18 month old Rott) would follow in 18 months after our youngest son has done his GCSE's.  The UAE doesn't participate in the Pets scheme and has no plans to do so at the moment.  If we go there and if I keep Alfie up to date with all vaccinations, does anyone know if its possible, when we leave the UAE, to go to a European country for 6 months and then get Alf a Pet passport from that European country??  Hope I've explained myself ok?  I'd do anything to avoid him being in quarantine for 6 months and was just thinking that we could all have a 6 month holiday :-) get the passport and then come home.  I know this is far into the future approx 5 years and perhaps the UAE may have joined the scheme by then.  I just want to feel happier about taking him because I certainly couldn't do anything else.  Any advise would be really appreciated.

Thanks all.

My reply to you is "Don't do it!" I'm not even happy about dogs coming into the country under the pet passport scheme. I know of two who have and have later fallen ill, one died a painful death!

I'm sorry the pet passport scheme ever came into being and truly believe it is only a matter of time before we have rather more nasties here than ever before. There has already been one case at least of Ehrlichiosis in the UK. A Rabies epidemic could break out at any time. (Remember, the last person to die of Rabies contracted here in the UK was only in 2002)

If you take your dog with you then do the right thing. Put him in quarantine when you bring him back.

Regards, John 

`I don't like the PP either but if you leave a non participating country the dog can do it's quarantine in France say if it lives there for six months it is quite legal but you apply for the PP at the beginning of the 6 months not the end

<A Rabies epidemic could break out at any time. (Remember, the last person to die of Rabies contracted here in the UK was only in 2002)>

Providing an animal has been vaccinated against rabies and has been bloodtested to check the antibody level before travel to the UK (which is mandatory with the pet passport scheme), there is almost no chance of rabies entering the country with that animal. In my opinion, we were much more at risk of rabies in the days before the PP scheme, when hundreds, if not thousands, of animals were smuggled into the country rather than facing 6-months of quarantine. The last death in the UK from rabies was contracted by a conservation worker bitten by a wild Bat and this has always been, and will continue to be, a risk when working with or near Bats.

The Pet Passport scheme should help increase the gene pool of of our breeds, which in many cases are becoming too inbred for sustainable health in the future (The COI of many popular breeds is becoming too high).
I for one have taken advantage of the scheme and imported a bitch who will open up our choice of stud dogs and offer the breed a wider gene pool. We will also use continental stud dogs in the future and could not have done so without the PP scheme.

Common sense must be used when travelling and areas where parasites and insects are a problem should be avoided. Broadly speaking, most of Northern Europe is safe for travel, Southern Europe and the tropics is where the problems occur.

snomaes

Do you disagree that the last person to die of Rabies contracted in England died in 2002 then smomaes?

I agree that the last documented person to contract rabies in the UK (actually in Scotland) died from it in 2002. This was a tragic case but had nothing to do with the pet passport travel scheme. It was an extremely rare case of a form of rabies carried by bats.

snomaes

South coast actually

Angus is in Scotland, which is where David McRae lived and worked as a volunteer Bat conservation worker.
All references to the tragic incident that I have read refer to the Bat colony being in Scotland.

snomaes

In that case make that two cases then. I'm talking about the woman who was on holiday on the south coast and was bitten by a bat alleged to have flown over from France. I cant remember her name but I guess others on here will remember it.

Either way, I personally cannot condone people looking for loopholes in the quarantine laws.

<Either way, I personally cannot condone people looking for loopholes in the quarantine laws.>

There are no loopholes, the suggestions on this thread are all perfectly legal, any dog that is brought in from a country that is currently not a member of the pet passport scheme must spend six months in a country that is a member, go through all the required procedures in order to qualify for a pet passport and then gain legal entry to the UK.
If this procedure is not adopted, it is not a loophole but an illegal act with very stringent penalties for anyone caught breaking the law.

If I said a thing was white you would argue it was black Snomaes. You just seem to look for arguments. I am not interested in arguing with you. I'll just accept that you know best.

John,

I'm most certainly NOT trying to find loopholes in the laws but just trying to get a clear picture of what I could or could'nt do should the travelling situation arise.

My reason for saying this Lucytia is that I personally know the dog which entered the country and died very painfully of Ehrlichiosis. Before it died the flesh rotted on its leg and it lost several toes. Finally it got into the respiratory system and she was put to sleep on the 2nd of January this year. These loopholes may be legal but I am still opposed. There are so many nasties just waiting to come into the country.

Regards, John

Hi J, as you know I`ve nursed a dog thru Babesia & you also know one of my own dogs has Leishmania & still alive living a very full life indeed(3yrs after diagnosed) with her human & doggy family. Also nursed a pup thru sterile Idiopathic Nodular Panniculitis & while in no way I`m an expert on these dreadful diseases I`m at least qualified to have a say about them. The majority of most animals/humans don`t have the luxury of living on an island isolated from these diseases or the vectors that cause them. I think climatic changes will bring these ticks/parasites to UK without the pet passport scheme. And it`s not a loophole to have an animal spend 6mths in an accepted counrty for the scheme in a household acting as a holding pen before entering UK. Perfectly legal! I`d like to know who`s got their eye on the mossies & ticks carrying these diseases because rest assured they most certainly do not spend their entire life on the dog/cat/fox/bird/deer/hedgehog/chickens etc etc etc!!!!! All of those animals & many more I haven`t named, least being us humans, can carry ticks/lice & are susceptible to bites from them & mosquitoes & sand flies etc etc. Humans can also be the vectors for diseases.

To avoid the danger of these parasites & the diseases they carry we need to be informed & attempts by isolation & chemicals is not the way it`s going to happen, bounderies & borders don`t exist in their world. These insects/parasites have been living on earth since time ... dot dot dot & mans STILL trying to eliminate them!!!!!!!
We ALL need to be fed/eat a nutritious diet & raw foods for dogs/cats are my belief to attain an optimal immune system working to it`s full to at least have a head start on any diseases, minor or major that they may be at risk from.
By all means make the most of allopathic medicine, but at the same time remember where it originated from ;)  & keep yourself & pets away from all man made toxins/chemicals/pollution in food & the enviroment as much as you can. There are natural ways to deal with things & they are just as potent as man made ones :)

Christine, Spain.

My daughter brought her two african dogs back to the UK via Spain. They spent 7 months in a quarantine kennel there. The kennel had a B & B so she could visit them whenever she liked. The kennel is run by a very experienced english couple, who have many years of dog knowledge and handling. I would suggest you contact them as they would be able to give you details of how to bring back your dog.
Contact Mrs Presdee on doghouse_358@yahoo.co.uk
John is correct to say however that there will still be risks to your dog and it's health, if you take him abroad. You will need to keep up o date on worming and flea treatments, among other things.

Thanks to everyone for your replies.

Your best bet is to get the petpassport for your dog going before you go, so that you can bring your dog back to Uk anytinme after you leave as long as it has soent six months in a Pet Passport country without going outside the area.

So if he had his Pet passport now you would just have to keep it up to date, spend 6 months in a qualifying country with him, and he could then come back in.  If you waited to do the Pet pasport until you were back in a qualifying country it would take longer than 6 months.  first the dog has to be microchipped, thennhave a Rabies Vacc, tne a month later have a blood test, and only 6 months after the blood test (if resultcame back OK) would he be able to enter the UK.

My daughters dogs did not have the pet passport prior to coming here as they were bred in Africa. They stayed in Spain for 7 months, they could have come sooner but my daughter still had not got her home sorted out.
I see rabies has been mentioned on this thread, I think some of the tick borne diseases are as lethal. There is a growing concern in the veterinary profession as they seeing more and more pets with with these diseases.
I suspect there are those among us on this board, John will I am sure, remember when a dog did come here many years ago and then died of rabies. The authorities at that time then went on alert, and as a recautionary measure, all the local wildlife such as foxes, badgers, rabbits etc... were cleared from the area, by use of trapping, shooting and poison gas in warrens and dens. Any cat found out was also trapped and disposed of. All dogs in contact with the affected dog, I think were taken to kennels and monitored, (I can't remember all of these details, I was a young teenager at the time). All dogs in nearby areas were not allowed out and had to be muzzled at all times.
After the farce of the foot & mouth epidemic I dread to think what the government would dream up for a rabies "outbreak" these days.

Hi Lucytia. Glad to see you are trying to be as prepared as possible.  Staying in a Pet Passport country for the 6 months is a good idea. 

Have you thought about the temperature differences though? Rotties don't cope very well with heat, and I can imagine it must be hot in the UAE!

Also be aware of heartworm!!  Make sure you have meds that will not only cover for fleas etc but also heartworm,   I have heard too many horror stories  about Rots that have contracted heartworm.  (or is this the same as the other poster mentioned? afraid I can't remember the latin name!)

As for Rabies?!!   Well, this country is just a tad paranoid about this particular disease! Go on shoot me down if you like, but honestly!!! Having been brought up in a country where rabies is active, in bats, foxes, where all have to be vaccinated agianst Rabies by law and where  I have never seen a rabid dog prowling around ready to attack,  I think you just need to be sensible, take the right precautions, making sure your Rott has the right vaccinations and you will be fine!!!   Even after 6 months in quarantaine, a dog can still be released to the family and become rabid.  It is not guaranteed that 6 months free of symptoms will show the dog is okay. 

So plan every thing and I hope you have a wonderful time!!  including your Alfie!!!

MSROTTIE,

thanks for your reply.  I have thought about the problems with the heat but everywhere is aircond and I would just have to walk Alf VERY early before the sun comes up (desert countries get very cold during darkness).  I think so long as one is very sensible about these things, it will be just fine:-).  To be honest anyway, we may not have a choice in the matter and as Alfie is a huge member of our family he will come where ever we go:-).  Thanks also for the tips about heartworm. 

Thanks to those that suggested getting the Passport before leaving the UK - I'll certainly do that and keep it up to date.

I'll let you all know in due course - what our decision about going to the UAE will be.

Lots of people keep dogs in the ME, Saudi, Bahrain, UAE, Dubai etc and most adapt very well.

Oh yes, forgot to say dogs are living & thriving all over this world thankfully, they adapt very well indeeed :D

Christine, Spain.