HI, early next year or late this year we want to get a small dog (15"or under) an anyone recommend a breed, thats fats and quick to learn. Thnak-you

I think liking the dog is more important than how good it may be at agility. If it can't/won't do agility you will still have to enjoy it as a pet. Don't mean that to sound harsh just what came to my mind when I read your post
                                      Anne

You will have to do basic obedence first and I don't think you can start agility until the pup is a year old, most dogs can be trained with enough time and effort as to speed, sorry I don't know but would think perhaps a whippet.

border collies are excellent at agility.  they are extremely fast and can move around the courses well.  also incredibly smart and quick to train.  really a great breed.

Are BC's under 15"? you know I have always thought of them as larger than that but yes they are ideal for agility but can be hard work.

pm me i may be able to help

Shetland Sheepdogs are really good at agility or for something even smaller try a Papillon - very bright and great at mini agility. But as someone has mentioned you can't start training untill 18 months due to the risk of damaging growing bones etc.

Yvonne

I have to agree with Anne that the dog is far more important than the agility. Choose the breed you like rather than the sport. Remember, you are living with this dog for possibly up to 16 years so it is important that you like and are compatable with the breed. The thoughts of buying a dog purely for the sport appears almost as if you are putting the cart before the horse and that Agility is the important thing, not the dog.

Regards, John

well, naturally, the dog, as an individual creature, should be more important.  the great thing about all the different breeds is that a person can decide what they want in a dog and then go find the breed that fits those qualities.  if someone likes a good utilitarian hunting dog, a lab would be a good choice.  amoung many other good triats, they are great hunting dogs.  so, i think it is okay to ask what kind of dog would be good at agility.  if that is what a person is interested in doing, it is good for them to ask what breeds excell at that.  just like a person who wants a bird dog, chooses a dog that is good at those qualities which make up a good bird dog.

I would wish to know that the DOG was wanted before I would concidder selling a puppy rather than the person wanted to get involved with a particular sport, and that would apply to any person and any sport. The rescues are full of dogs which their owners have got tired of or who have not performed up to the owners desires. If this person had watched plenty of agility they would have formed their own likes and dislikes. No one can chose a breed for another person, it is just too personal.

John

poodle or a sheltie?

papiolln (sorry guys having a v.bad spelling day!!!)

I've heard parson russels are very good at agility and they are a smart looking dogs in my eyes but they are not suited for everyone, they are toally different from a sheltie or poodles are different again, and so are paps again totally different!

john,
this poster isn't asking anyone here to pick out a breed for her!  she is looking for ideas and opinions.  what is wrong with that?

when a person gets a purebred dog, they are basically guilty of what you are condemning here.  with a purebred dog you can make a pretty good guess what it's traits are going to be.  so you pick one that meets your standards and desires.  you say "i want a dog with short hair, that is protective, that is good with kids."  then you go find a dog that has those qualities.  i would think that lots of times a person ends up with a dog that is "supposed to be protective"  but ends up being a little wimp.  i am sure the person still loves the dog, or i would hope they do.  so this poster is looking for a small dog that will be good at agility.  those are the qualities that she is looking for.  she is asking which breeds we think would meet her desires.  if she ends up with a dog that is "suposed to be good at agility" but sucks at it, i would hope she would still love it!  of course if the breeder thinks that the person doesn't "want" the dog, they shouldn't sell the puppy to that person!  but a person can very much want a dog and want certain qualities in the dog at the same time!!! 

what kind of dogs do you have john?  did you get them for hunting or for any particular reason?  or did you just pick a random breed, pay lots of money for it, and then hope for the best?  i imagine you picked out a breed that you guessed would work well for you.  because you chose a breed for particular reasons, did that mean you didnt' really love the DOG?

i got a shelter pup because i didn't want to do the $1000 purebred thing.  the risk with the shelter pup is that you really don't know what you are getting.  i got so lucky!!!!  my dog is the perfect size, look, and temperment for me, in my opinion.  i would have loved him no matter what if he had turned out differently, but instead he turned out just right.

anyhow, this is the beauty of the many breeds of dogs.  for most people they are looking for something specific.  with all the different breeds, they are sure to find what they are looking for.

<<this poster isn't asking anyone here to pick out a breed for her!>>

That's exactly how the original post reads to me! It could be the poster's way with words, but it appears that all that is important is agility. Nothing else.

people are going to shout at me now, but i cut down the numbers of breeds that i wanted by thinking to myself what do i want the dog for, is it going to be a companion, working or otherwise? i want to do competition obedience as well as agility, and i have got my self a german shorthaired pointer.
for the last year i have been training a jack russell (probably the smallest one any one has seen!)to do obedience and then agility, i have througholy enjoyed it and so has she. her owner was extremly shocked when she saw her dog doing agility tho!!
hope you get a breed that you love and have fun doing agility with it and spending the 12-14 years of your life with it

you could be right, this poster might only care about agility, in which case they have no business getting a dog.  but they could also just have writen out a quick post asking for ideas and that isn't bad at all. 

my gut feeling is that this person was kind of like keisha85, and probably most of you, in that she is looking for a breed that works for her and her particular interests.  no crime in that, is there?  don't most people pick out a breed in this manner?

we can't be so quick to judge others here, that isn't our job.

Don't worry Keisha. I have a sneaking suspicion you are getting caught up in someone else's argument. My recommendation would be to go along to watch agility and you will soon see a breed which takes your eye. That would be far better way to go about it.

Regards, John

Just think about all the old timers and new timers who have had sheep or cattle ranches. They need dogs to work. They choose a herding type dog usually for that. I have a sneaky suspicion that they like their dogs too.

There are people who love going out into the wilderness to hunt. They may also like dogs. So they choose a dog who was bred to hunt.

People that train seeing eye dogs choose breeds that are compatible with that job. Blind people who are lucky enough to get a seeing eye dog get one to help them get around. I think they usually end up liking the dog and being good to it too.

I'm sure there are some people who get dogs for the wrong reasons. But for the most part, I believe that people get dogs because they like them in spite of their various working aptitudes.

When I got my Chihuahuas, I wanted a dog who could sit on my lap without breaking my legs. LOL. I wanted short hair because I hate the mess of a lot of hair. So, I thought about different toy breeds and read about their temperament and other things and decided that was the breed to suit my desires. I love all kinds of animals and especially dogs, but I do think about what I want the dog for or what I want it to be like.

The same with my Lab. The same with my most recent, the Doberman. I got him because I liked the description and the ones I met.....their personality, very perky, alert, playful goof balls, cute, humorous and smart. I love their atheleticism and the fact that they're pretty good at agility. I never did that sport before and saw it and thought, "what fun!" Here's a dog that could even do that. The protection aspect is a bonus, not my biggest concern. I love the velcro aspect, the stick around close thing that he does. And their looks I was really impressed with. What a pleasure to watch him move, so sleek and atheletic. Even if he wasn't good at agility or protecting, he's my dumpling doberboy and I love him dearly.

Carrie

This is the whole point Carrie. I love to work my Labradors but if for some reason I cannot work them then thats fine too. I was never able to work my Bethany during the whole of her life because of her medical condition. I trained her and used her for demo's in class but that was all. For all the years that I had her she never worked in the field but that was fine by me because she was my friend and companion. A dog is  there 24 hours a day, not just at competition time.

Best wishes, John

I have just re-read the original post to see what was wrong with it. I think, personally, that these people want to do agility and are asking what breed is good for that. After all, they wouldn't really want something like a Basset, would they. (No offence meant to Bassets, or they owners). I applaud them for asking. I do think, on the other hand, that they should go and watch the dogs doing agility and speak to the people who do it. That's the best way to find out. Everyone has to start somewhere and if you don't mix with the people involved mistakes can and do happen. At least they are asking so they can make a shortlist.

I really don't understand why some people are trying to bring them down. After all, if you want a working gundog you wouldn't look at a hound, or a terrier, would you? JMHO

Guest, have a look on http://www.agilitynet.co.uk/ and click on schedules.  This will give you a list of agility shows so you can pick the one nearest to you.  Have a quick look at the schedule and check they have mini classes.

You will see a variety of small breeds there and can ask the owners what they are like to live with.

Sandra

I'm not sure who is "Trying to bring them down" LindyLou? But for the record I was into Labradors many years before I started working them at gundog work. It's a cart and horse thing. As I have said before on this thread, choosing a breed of dog to live with for possibly the next 15 to 16 years id very important and should not be undertaken without going to see the different breeds. The decision should be made with more than the working ability of the breed considered. Which was the reason why I said that the poster should go and see the dogs. 16 years is a long time to have a dog if they make a mistake and get some breed which the later find they do not like.

Regards, John

well, hopefully the original poster will also love her dog very much as well as getting it involved in agility.  however, we cannot assume anything one way or the other about them.  all we can do is answer his/her original question.  agility is a really fun thing to do with a dog, if dog and gaurdian both enjoy it.  i think that is a great aspiration to have in your relationship with your dog.

Well, I guess my whole point was that all these different breeds that were selectively bred to do a myriad of different jobs are there for our enjoyment. Most people that get dogs like them or they wouldn't get them. That's most people. I realize there are some weird examples to the contrary.

I guess I'm a trusting sort unless shown otherwise. When I read the poster's post, the idea of having a dog as a pet that she would love, train and be companionable with was just understood... or went without saying. Do you know what I mean? The asking about agility dogs was perfectly natural and normal to me...that she wanted a dog....like all of us here do as "man's best friend", but that she wanted one that was quick, agile, atheletic and suited for agility.

I didn't read anything or derive anything from her post that suggested that she was cold and uncaring about dogs or that she wanted some kind of robot to do something for her. There are, I'm sure people like that. You see them on those programs on TV like "Animal Cops" and so forth. I just didn't get any vibes like that at all.

When I thought about what breeds I wanted, I thought about what I wanted to do too. Agility...hmmmm fun. I'll be sure and get a dog that can do that. But it will have to be the type of temperament I like and have the other qualities I like too. I'll have to be willing and wanting to keep up with the energy level. Thank God....I'd be so out of shape if it weren't for my dogs. LOL.

I always recommend that before someone gets a dog, to research it fully and try to meet some dogs like that, just to make sure it sounds like a good breed for that person. That what you wrote John is so true. Someone that gets a fickle idea in their head and doesn't do the research, runs out and gets a dog that is not a compatable breed for them. That's a real shame. And it's a shame to send the dog off to a shelter when it doesn't work out.

I just didn't get any information from her post that hinted at any of that. But, I do usually give the benefit of the doubt unless someone proves me wrong.

Carrie

You would think that most people that get dogs would like them wouldnt you? But I think John's advice very sensible after all if everyone made the correct choice at the time of getting a dog it would save alot of heartache and trouble later on when it isnt a cute little puppy anymore and it gets neglected or abandoned and at best ends up in rescue at worst D**D JMHO Gillian

Guest :-) "A breed thats fast and quick to learn" this depends a lot on who trains the dog ,how they train and how experienced they are. Choose a number of breeds you would love to own then see which one is most suitable for your purpose. As  John has already said, you need to want to own a dog because you love that breed and want to share your home with a dog. The agility part is secondary after all you could get a dog (of any breed) and find it is not happy doing agility even if you pick a breed more suited ;-)

" The agility part is secondary after all you could get a dog (of any breed) and find it is not happy doing agility even if you pick a breed more suited  "

Aimee, Border Collie, fast asleep on the sofa, says "Amen to that" ;)

its horses for courses though isnt it??? if the poster is keen to do mini agility then giving her a list of suitable breeds that are good & enjoy it is going to narrow down the search & will be able to research the few breeds in detail & see which one she likes the best! whats wrong with that?
if i had an ambition to jump around badminton i wouldnt go a buy a donkey,no matter how many donkeys i had before or how much i loved them!!! there are lots of dogs out there that do not quite make the breed standard for showing but would be really siutable for some of the doggy sports.
i agree with sally that there are no gurantees with any breed being any good,but you can give youself a fighting chance by choosing from a breed that has a history of been happy doing it!

" Most people that get dogs like them or they wouldn't get them. That's most people. I realize there are some weird examples to the contrary."

"I always recommend that before someone gets a dog, to research it fully and try to meet some dogs like that, just to make sure it sounds like a good breed for that person. That what you wrote John is so true. Someone that gets a fickle idea in their head and doesn't do the research, runs out and gets a dog that is not a compatable breed for them. That's a real shame. And it's a shame to send the dog off to a shelter when it doesn't work out."

There are so many breeds out there that are lovely and would make a dog lover a good pet. And out of those dogs, chances are good that some of them will be built well for the prospect of agility. If the dog doesn't turn out to be good at that, then of course, the person should be happy to just have it for a pet. NO ONE SHOULD get a dog who doesn't love dogs. Duh...a given.

Carrie

i agree carrie! hopefully the original poster also wants a companion etc,dog to love not just a dog to compete with! i sort of took that fact as red though!!!!

<<NO ONE SHOULD get a dog who doesn't love dogs. Duh...a given.>>

The first sentence is absolutely true. The second, unfortunately, cannot be assumed.

true enough jeangenie,but given the fact they are asking advice ,opinions & very keen to spend alot of time & effort into a sport ,which is so competitive that its really just a day out(unless you are really good!),not to mention the training ,petrol to shows etc, then i would imagine that the poster does really love dogs........but just wants a little advice on the best small breed for her!

jeez, i wouldn't be surprised if this original poster never came back here again.  some of you are so judgemental.....what gives any of us the right to assume or judge this person badly?  anyhow, im glad there are some that give the benefit of the doubt and understand about the different breeds being bred for certain things.  and that is why one picks a certain breed.  simple as that.  all of you with pure bred dogs picked your breed for certain reasons. 

shelterdog  :-) am I missing something here? Who has been judgmental? I don't see that at all   The poster gave very little information and a lot of people replied with good advice and looked at the scant details from different angles. I think sometimes people deliberatley choose to misunderstand what is said which is a shame when others do their best to give constructive advice and as always have the best interests of dogs at heart :-)

We answer a post honestly as we read it shelterdog. Because you did not like my interpretation of the post does not mean that mine was the wrong interpretation. As I said previously, the rescues are full of dogs who's original owners thought was the right dog for them. I stand by the fact that NO ONE can choose a breed for someone else. A person MUST go and see the dogs doing what they want them to do. They must talk to people who own the breed. They must study the breed and decide if it fits into their lifestyle. And only then, assuming that are still keen on the breed should they go out and get one.

More time spent deciding on the RIGHT breed would mean far less dogs in rescue.

I cannot see what part of this you cannot agree with?

John

Carrie I think you slightly misunderstood the meaning of my post .Maybe I should have said One would think etc..... It wasn't aimed at you in particular and I'm sorry if you thought it was :) Gillian

maybe you are right, perhaps i misunderstood what you all meant.  it sounded to me like you were saying that this person should not pick out a dog that is good at agility.  that because she was thinking about what she would like a dog to be good at, she was "putting the cart before the horse".  i disagree with this because i think that we all pick out breeds that we guess have traits and talents that we want.  whether it be hunting, herding, companionship, or agility.  anyhow, i just felt that no one should judge this poster either way, because her post was so short and non informational.  we really do not know anything about her from the first post.  i just wanted to answer her question and give a few ideas of breeds that fit her wants as listed in her post.  i didn't get any feeling that she would not love the dog if in fact it turend out to suck at agility. 
anyhow, that is where i have been comiing from. 

oh, and reddoor, i agree with you wholeheartedly.  i see this often on here.  people chose to acknowledge what they want to out of your post, not the whole thing.  they then present with a quote from your post and then berate it, without considering or mentioning the context from which it came.  i do not think that i have done this is this thread if that was what you were implying above. 

<<oh, and reddoor, i agree with you wholeheartedly.  i see this often on here.  people chose to acknowledge what they want to out of your post, not the whole thing. >>

This was my very first post on this thread:-

John 10.06.04 06:57 BST  [Misc] [Edit] [Reply]  

I have to agree with Anne that the dog is far more important than the agility. Choose the breed you like rather than the sport. Remember, you are living with this dog for possibly up to 16 years so it is important that you like and are compatable with the breed. The thoughts of buying a dog purely for the sport appears almost as if you are putting the cart before the horse and that Agility is the important thing, not the dog.

Regards, John 

And I still cannot see what you or the original poster could object to in this post. I feel maybe that you did not read the whole thing.

John

Hello guest,
I read your other post but couldnt reply because admin have taken it off (i think)
I dont think people are having ago at you but from the way you wrote your post they thought that you were getting a dog ONLY for agility and were worried that you didnt think about all the other care a dog needs but Im sure now that they know have dogs they will think differently. It was just an easy misunderstanding, there was no need for name calling.
To your original post I suggest a rescue dog as there are so many in shelters that would love to do agility and have a second chance in a loving home :) If its a specific breed you after you could try breed rescues as well.  
This is a website for shelters and specific breed rescues (just in case your interested) :
www.dogpages.org.uk

...sadly shelterdog  the posters who say some people 'put the cart before the horse' when choosing a dog are absolutly right and the dogs homes are full to prove it. One example, when One Man And His Dog' first came on television some people thought it would be a good idea to have a BC because they were 'clever dogs' not because they loved the breed and  then proceeded to put  very intelligent working dogs in small house, give them  little excercise then complain when the dogs had behaviour problems. They did not stop to consider that their lifestyle might be totally unsuitable or the amount of expertees required to train the dogs. No, they wanted a clever dog like the ones on television. The outcome was lots of BCs with behaviour problems in dogs homes through no fault of their own. I know at the time dogs homes cursed the programme.