Hi,
Can anyone tell me how successful a mating is, without actually having a tie. (is it called a slip mating)
Thats whats happened with my bitch, the breeder seems to think it will be ok.

Michelle

You only need one drop of fertile semen :)

Of course I'm taking the breeders word for it, but thought I'd try to find out a bit about it.
I've just read that during the tie, the dog is pumping a clear substance inside, therefor pushing the fertile semen further up towards the eggs. Without the tie most is lost, resulting in no pregnancy, or a smaller litter. Wouldn't like to think she ended up pregnant, with only one large pup.
Has anyone had a reasonable sized litter without a tie.

Michelle.

I bred a litter of staffs a few years ago & we mated the bitch twice, they did not tie either time & she has a litter of 6 very healthy puppies, 3 of each

Hi Michelle
I think most breeders have had varying experiances with slip matings personally ive had to slip matings with my stud and neither resulted in a litter. the same bitches were both mated again on their next seasons and produced healthy litters. :)

My on staff bitch had one slip mating and had 7 beautiful pups! :D

mitchs reply is correct, the purpose of the tie is to pump 3 distinct phases of fluid into the bitch, the tie is not essential as the bitch can still be impregnated after a brief entry by the dog  but a tie is preferable as it (usually) ensures a higher probability of pregnancy.

is it a staffy thing .seems everyone who has bred a few litters has had a slip mating along the way.i used a champion stafford a few years back and had a slip mating which lasted all of 30 seconds.result 8 healthy pups.

weve had lots of staffie litters and no slip mating as yet, mind you, our dogs are irish dogs, so they tend to be more virile and up to the "task in hand" than short, squat KC types :-)

I know plenty of the KC type dogs that can perform perfectly with excellent ties, oh and they produce KC reg pups too :D

thats good, I just prefer irish dogs, they are closer to my idea of what a staff should be :-)

bearing in mind they are two different breeds .....
so there are bound to be differences .
Just one question- which is the original breed????

Hi everyone,
Thanks for all the replies.
We decided to have another try after all, but only had another slip mating. I suppose two is better than one. Doubles the chances I presume.

Michelle

lel they are not different breeds.the irish dogs (certain lines) go back to english show dogs of the 60's that were exported to be used in the trials over there.other lines have been crosseed with some ebt and god knows what other blood but as i said some are imo the same breed, just never been bred to measure upto a breed standard so vary much more in size and weight.i also believe the original sbt has more in common with the apbt than either kc or irish staffords.just my opinion mind you.

the irish stafford has never been made to "conform" to a breed standard and has been bred to do a job, rather than to look nice, (CH psycho for example, not the nicest looking dog, but a good 'un and a lot of todays dogs descend from him) so, again IMO, the irish stafford is usually a more athletic and muscular dog, which is my personal prefernce.

Cooper
I probably phrased that wrong . I know the Irish is bred from the Staffy but I meant there are differences and so are NOT the same animal when you come to compare them

lel, do you own irish staffords? :-)

ch psycho (hagler) was 1/16 ebt so was not strictly speaking a stafford.

i think we have all come to accept that the loose term "irish stafford" can sometimes mean dogs carrying EBT and APBT blood, although this is not the case with all strains of irish staff.  the point is they, like lurchers and working terriers, were bred for a purpose, not to a set standard with looks as prime importance.

I own what you refer to a short squat type who actually isnt short or squat :)

well IMO they are short and squat in comparison to an irish. we have a stud dog who is around 20" at the shoulder, would probably make most KC staffs look squat. his son is 17" and still very big compared to KC types. its all personal preference, your type suits you, my type suits me, I just asked coz you seemed to be talking as though you owned one.:-)

didnt realise that I had done so but never mind... :rolleyes:
Liking both types I have to say that not ALL staffys are short and squat . As I mentioned mine isnt and I always get comments regarding he looks too tall / too thin from owners of the big fat barrelled, fat headed monsters out there .
Not all staffys have conformed to this standard (thankfully)which they seem to have adopted from no where -other than that is what some judges prefer .
I dont- and looking back on pictures from the 30s this isnt what the original staffy looked like either :(
Some could never perform the role they were bred to do .
And of course they will look different from the Irish because they were bred more for gaming
But I think we are going off on a tangent and hijacking Mitch's thread ;)

Lel, I am surprised you have made such an insulting comment to some of the show dogs.
OK they are not your type - possibly because your dog does not meet their type you prefer your own? Either way they are someones pet and show dogs - and I dare say are the ones taking the placings ;-)

Can you tell me which Insulting comments exactly?
There is a whole range of Staffys out there both in the show ring and outside of the ring and you can get two KC registered dogs that look totally different to each other

Are you telling me you have never seen an "overly large headed and over weight " dog ?
There are plenty of articles at the moment about the way the breed standard is changing in some areas ?

<<and I dare say are the ones taking the placings>>
Thankfully not -as Casanova and Braw Wo'oer , current top dog and bitch, are not like these at all ;) ;)

Insulting comments
"from owners of the big fat barrelled, fat headed monsters out there ."
I said placings not necessarily the tickets ;-)
Both dogs you mention I think are stunning and I think Cassanova has a fantastic head but from how I imagine your ideal I thought you may consider him too strong in the head? but then you could not really argue with over 30cc's could you ;-)

<<<but from how I imagine your ideal I thought you may consider him too strong in the head? >>>

How on EARTH would you know what MY ideal is ????? As I wouldnt know yours either

No Casanova is a beauty in my eyes - not accentuated in any way and rightly deserves every CC he has ever earned .
Because I dislike dogs that are not to the breed standard does not mean you have to be sarcastic Ann Marie

i dislike dogs which ARE to the breed standard i think staffies are too small these days more like mini staffies maybe one day they will become a sepearate breed like the miniature bull terrier? i like big staffies which look like they can run all day and ive seen a lot of staffies which dont look like they can run they waddle instead. this is my opinion but a lot of people will disagree with it

Lel
I am taking your ideal from how you have described it on many other posts and in my assumptions from your posts you clearly prefer the more athletic finer dogs not the more bully - am I right.
So as someone has just said they consider Casanova to be very bully - which I agree with BUT happen to prefer that type. So if in my opinion he is bully and Cooper feels he is bully and you have in recent posts said that is not your type then I cannot understand why you are raving on about a dog - double standards maybe??
You see Lel I am like an elephant and do not forget.
You had a differing opinion on Champdogs to on a Staffie forum before and seemed to agree with what was being said on each forum even though both forums had COMPLETELY different opinions. If you cant remember what I am talking about me PM me and I will explain but to give you a clue it was a certain foster mother I have here and a good turn I was doing ;-)

I dont like OVER EXAGGERATION and OVERLY HEAVINESS. Casanova is not in my opion.
I dont like BULLDOG looking dogs . And I have made that known on my posts .But since they are called "Bull" Terriers there has to be a certain amount of Bull in them (doh)!!!

Looking for another argument Ann Marie- I seem to remember you have done this on a few occasions with posts now
( with Staffiemad and Kazzstaffs posts  also)

The other Forum that you I remember well too - wasnt that all about the puppy you thought you had a right to keep because you had helped out with fostering ? Seem to remember I disagreed with you there actually too .

Are we bored because Jackie isnt playing out ?

same here lel.  my boy is 16.5" very active, very fit and has the muscle to show for it. and YES he is KC reg.  the ISBT is just a cross breed with a name.  i know of a few people breeding them that will put an ISBT bitch to any dog that looks good (what ever it is ISBT, SBT, SBT/cross or mongrel) i have even had some1 come on to me and ask to put my boy to a ISBT

no axe to grind here but how does a dog like cassanova get 30 tickets, to my eye the dog is coarse and leaning toward being a bulldoggy type, if he can do 38lbs i will eat hay with a donkey.the dog does not measure up to the standard and indeed if the dogs carry on following this path then the breathing and whelping problems will be more pronounced than ever before.just my opinion.

Hi
  
I have a breeder friend ( with Dobies), in one of his litters the dogs didn't manage a tie. Two months later his bitch safely gave birth to 13 puppies :D. I wouldn't worry worry about not having a tie.

                              Kate