Hi

I have a question:

The other day I saw a program in the telly. The danish (I live in Denmark) consumers' advisory council (taken directly from the dictionary) had made a test of dogfood.

They had chosen cheap, middle and expensive brands. The average weight for the dog was 20 kg adult.
They had "proven" that you could just as weel buy the cheap (from the supermarket) food, because there weren't really any difference. Can this really be true? I'm a first time dogowner, as some of you may know, and I just want to do what's best for my girl.

My question is now: My choc lab Luna, 10 mths, is currently beeing fed food for large breed dogs. There were no mention of food for large breed.  I live on the 3. floor without an elevator. I just want to know, can I feed "regular" food (NOT large breed) or should I continue what I'm doing?

Please no suggestions for BARF and any brand names for dry food, because we can't really get that many different brands in Denmark. We have Eukanuba (gives her gas), Royal Canin, Hills Science Plan and Hills Natures Best (all large breed) of expensive brands. She is currently fed Hills Natures Best Large Breed adult.

I just want to know, for my dogs health and good bones and hips, do I or do I not feed her with food for large breed dogs?

My friend has a GSD, and we want to feed the same, cause they eat together almost everyday anyway.

Ups forgot to put my name on it :-)

Jeanette and Luna

I feed my Labradors a standard dog food. A "Large Breed" is un-necessary for them. At least in the UK, a feed for working dogs, working gundogs etc, is Vat Free which makes it quite a bit cheaper than the same food not sold for working dogs!! Possibly the cheapest tinned dog food in the uk is Chappie and yet so many people swear by it.

Regards, John

Hi John

But do your dogs go a lot on stairs? Or doesn't that matter? Here I'm thinking of the hips.

Luna is not a working dog. She is a family pet, but I'm very observant on her weight.

I know what you mean with Chappi. Alot of people here in Denmark feed Pedigree Pal, which I would never even let Luna sniff at.

So if I chose a food brand in the middle, it woould be okay? My friend has a cross, with labrador, boxer and something else, I can't remember. She is feeding with a food, her parents are using in their kennel of Gordon Setters. But neither my friends or her parents dogs live in places with stairs. And I think my friends dog is shedding a lot. But fishoil should/could help that right?

I've been calculating and when I take the daily prize, I can see that the food my friend uses costs half of, what I use now.

But its the stairs, that worry me. Its 56 steps up and 56 steps down at least 3 times a day.

Jeanette

Hi Jeanette,

You don't really need to feed food for large breeds, but it's find to do so.

The most important thing is not to let large breeds grow too quickly (don't overfeed) and don't exercise them too much until they are nearly mature.  56 stairs up and down three times a day is a lot of stairs.  However, the major cause of hip problems is genetics and not overexercise, in other words, a dog is born with bad hips. 

Stacey

Hi Stacey

I thought it also could have something to do with the food. But if it doesn't, then I could choose a brand in the middle. Save some money, and still have a clear conscience.

Good grief, it's not easy!

She really thrives on the food, she is getting now. She is not shedding, and have a shiny coat, not to fat - not to skinny. I give her salmon oil morning and evening. And most important no gas!! I fed Eukanuba before, and in the end I had to either change food or buy a gasmask :-)

Thanks for the advice. We walk slowly and on lead up and down the stairs. I know it would be better with no stairs or an elevator, but that is just not an option right now.

Jeanette

Jeanette

I use a cheap working dog feed as well, and I can say that my dogs have never had any problems.  I've never ever had to take them to the vets etc.  One of them is 12 years old, another 10 years, two 4 and the other one is nearly 12 months.  I do feed them chicken and other meats as well as rice etc. and eggs.

I have to admit to using cheaper brands for my Pomeranian's too and seeing that they've lived into their mid-teens yet again with no health problems I do sometimes wonder why people go on about the more expensive ones.  Maybe I'm just lucky and have always had healthy lines in my dogs, but I don't think that's the only reason.  Also how many dogs in their teens still have all their teeth?  My two old Spanish have stil got theirs.

Well, if you are feeding a cheap working dog food, but supplementing it with chicken, meats, rice and eggs then you must not be completely satisified that the cheap dog food is sufficient for your dogs.   You are, in fact, bringing the level of the cheap food up to and perhaps better than the more expensive brands.

I've had dogs in their teens, but none of them every lost teeth.  I didn't even know that was common, unless a dog has severe dental problems.

Stacey

Hi

I feed the expensive food, because my logic is: the more expensive - the better food.

Thats why I'm considering, after seeing this test, changing food. Because if the test is correct, then there is no difference in cheap or expensive food.

I'm just concerned for the joints of my dog, considering all the stairs we walk everyday.

Jeanette

Because of the increased levels of energy usage during the shooting season I change from a "Maintenance" grade of food onto a "Performance" grade. Something in the "Maintenance" range would be fine for a pet dog.

Stares worry me too Jeanette but we have to work with what's forced onto us. You have the stairs and your dog has to negotiate them, you have no choice. I would use a lead to insure she does not rush at them. Going down puts a load on the shoulders and up on the hips so neither way is better than the other.

It's a good idea to keep the weight off, particularly in your case. The less weight she's carrying the less weight on hip and shoulders on the stairs.

It sounds as if you are doing the best you can. :)

Best wishes, John

Hi John

Thanks - I try :-)

She was weighed the other day. She weighs 27 kg, is about 54 cm tall (over the back) and about (I think) 22 cm wide at the shoulders. She is about 10½ months old. Does that sound about right? I can feel her ribs and she still has a "waist".
She gets 2 short walks (morning and night) and a really long one, when I come home from work. In the weekends she gets extra long walks. Today f.ex. we walked for about 1 hour and 15 minutes and she played with my friends dog for aboout an hour (mostly lying on the floor biting eachother) and then a walk for about 30 minutes home.
On sundays we walk to training - a walk for about 45 minutes each way. If we take the bus, we will have to wait for an hour, which is too cold this time of year.

Do you think this is to much? And should she still "only" have maintenance food?

Jeanette

Watch the exercise levels. If you follow the "5 Minute Rule" then for 10.5 months you are looking at just under an hour. So saying, as you approach a year the chances of damage recede. The main risk is in the very early days.

I never worry too much about actual weight, preferring to go by the feel of the dog. To be able to feel the ribs blurred by a layer of flesh. A hard feel and you are under weight, hard to find and you are over weight.

Best wishes, John

Hi John

Thanks for the advice.

I think I have decided to change to a food lying in the middle of the price range.

I'll make sure that her walks doesn't get to long - easier said than done though. I don't have a license or a car for that matter. So everywhere we go is on foot..

I think she is right on the money - weightwise.

Thanks again.

Jeanette

Jeanette, nothing to add to your discussion but just have to say how much I admire your command of the English language!!  Considering it's not your natural tongue, I wish my Swedish was as good!! Well done!! :D

Hi Val

Thanks. I'll have to admit I have a dictionary in front of me.

But when I read books its in english - perhaps that helps as well.

Denmark and Sweden lies next to eachother, but I can't really understand swedish that well myself.

I'm glad I found this place, cause I'm very confused. Its not that easy having a dog :-)

jeanette

More expensive does not necessarily equate to better I am afraid.  The best thing to do if you want to know what is best for your dog is narrow down your choices to say 3 and then ring up the nutritionist at the company and ask them to explain the bio-availability of their product to your dog.  For example the label will give you the CRUDE PROTEIN percentage this reflects the total amount of protein in that food, however it does not say if it is complete or incomplete or the ACTUAL %age of this protein that can be metabolised by your dog.  Armed with this information you should be able to deduce which of the foods you are contemplating feeding is the best value.

Brand X may have 32% protein and Brand Y may have 12% protein, however if Brand X is made up of indigestible protein such as skin, fur, feathers and or be from cereal then it may contain less actual value than Brand Y if its 12% is meat based and totally usable by the dog.  The same can be appied to ASH (mineral) and fat content.

HTH

i started my gsd pup with pedigree chum puppy tins but found it gave her the runs and bad wind, i changed to the pedigree pouches which she really loves and it does not give her runs or bad wind anymore, a box of 8 costs me £2.85 at the local pet shop and the small bite mixer biscuts also pedigree chum a 2.5 kg bag costs about £2.99.
The collie also has ped chum and sometimes butchers tripe mix.
They both are looking very healthy and there weights are ok.
There coats are nice and shiny and they look good.
I was told that chappie is cheap but nasty? i cant comment as ive never tried it.

Chappie is cheap but before the veterinary profession jumped into a certain brand of complete food, Chappie was the food that was recommended by vets. My own vets still recommend it. I fed my own dogs on it for years and they all made old bones. Cheap yes, nasty not IMO

Ditto, Admin.

wasnt meaning any offence to anyone using chappie, just that i had been told that chappie was cheap and nasty with mixed bits in it like boney bits etc???
i wouldnt know as ive never tried it, the dogs i mean, durrrr

no offence taken

None taken, Sam - Chappie is cheap, but it suits my dogs well and the vets at the practice are impressed with their health and condition. And I think the tinned version is the only tinned food based on fish - which many dogs find more digestible.
:)

Hi

Thanks, I'll phone them tomorrow.

I am down to 3 different brands, one of them is what I currently feed, and the other two are cheaper.

The easiest thing would be to continue with what she gets now, but if she'll thrive on something a bit cheaper, I would have more money to spoil her and myself :-)

Thanks again.

Jeanette

a friend of mine is a vet nurse and she was saying that when a dog comes in with skin allergies the vet usually reccomends switching the dog to chappie as it doesnt contain nearly as many addatives etc as the other more expensive makes.

Was enough to make me switch :)

Andy

Our vet recommends Butchers Tripe for the same reason - No additives and dogs love it, although it smells really bad!

One vet in my practice advised the use of chappie & pasta when my Miranda was younger to get over a very bad bout of colitis.    She has never looked back.

Yup no doubt Chappie is a good brand, I fed my dog on the complete for a while but couldn't stand the stink of it when it had been "processed"   even when bagged and binned it was really pungent and to pick up and carry the bag on a walk was sheer purgatory - everyone gave me a wide berth LOL  so it's a different food for him now :D