Hi.
After reading many past posts and hopefully doing all my homework...I am looking to breed from my Boxer dog. Yesterday he scored a zero on his heart test...which I'm over joyed about (for my own peace of mind, not only breeding purposes) He has a fantastic pedigree and temprement (spelling?) He fits the breed standard very well... although I wouldn't describe his paws as cat like!! He's fit, healthy, big boned, muscular and absolutely gorgeous.
When I bought him, he was for pet purposes only. It was the breeder I got him from who asked if I would mind if she used him as stud. Although I've e-mailed her on many occasions, she doesn't want to seem to give me any more information regarding other health checks we should have done before commensing. Please help x

A good way to see how is fits the breed standard is to watch a breed show
and see how he compares, or to get him trained and show him.
As judges should be judging dogs against the breed standard, so the ones
that fit it best are the ones that win or do well (well thats the theory anyhow) :D

Other health tests that can be done are hips, eyes, thyroid.
You can also get your dog temperament tested at the parent clubs working day in Sept 04.
Make sure that you keep all the certificates as people will want to see them.

Have you got his KC certificate? What does it say on there?
If it's says endorsements = Progeny not eligible for registration then it's only the
breeder that can lift these, if you were made aware of them at time of purchase.
This endorsement means basically any pups that your dogs sires would not be eligible
to be KC registered. So not many people would use him as stud if this was the case.

Congratulations though on the heart score :)

Thanks Boxacrazy for replying to my post. A few more questions for you if you don't mind....
My boy...Robbie is 23 months old now. Would it be too late to start trying to train him for the show ring? I've never done anything like this with him up to press.
Are the other health test you've mentioned 'essential' or just 'desired'? (Hips, eyes, thyroid) Although I'll definately look into having them done...again, for my own peace of mind.
There are no endorsements on his KC certificate...so all clear there. Although, when I got him heart tested yesterday, all the vet gave me was a slip of printed paper with a tick in the relevant box (0/6) and his signature at the bottom. I expected a certificate of some description!! Is this correct? Is that all we get?
Also, where is the 'Parents clubs working day' held in September? And how do I go about registering him for it?
Thank you for your Congratulations regarding Robbies heart test result....I am over the moon!
Thanks again for your help, and I look forward to hearing from you again soon x

Hi
I can't answer your boxer specific replies but hope I can help on the showing questions.
No it is not too late to start showing...but be warned its addictive!! Find a local ring craft class and go along.Enter some shows..I would start with open shows and progress to champ.To be honest just watching a show will not really help you to assess your boy since you are (like myself) a novice at showing.It will however help you to understand what is going on.
If you don't instantly win in the ring don't give up..all judges are different and you should show under a variety of judges to get an idea of what your boy is like.Champ shows are a much better indication of quality than open shows IMO since the judges are more often breed specialists and you tend to get more competition...winning when theres only one in the class doesn't tell you anything!!
Good luck,Archer 

Thanks for the reply Archer. I've been busy looking in to the possibility of showing Rob. It all sounds so nerve racking!! Going to contact my local Boxer Club and take it from there. Thanks for the vote of confidence...I was sure I'd left it too late. But I guess as they say..better late than never.
Hope we'll speak again x

Hi fat lass (what a user name!!)
try going along to some exemption shows its unlikely you will meet a boxer judge but it will give you a informal way to start showing and get the bug! it worked for me i was terrified at the thought of doing it all wrong in the ring!! im still pretty new to the showing but im enjoying it and it good to meet the top dogs!! :)

Thanks Kao Kate.
All this advice is wonderful. Thanks for your reply...hopefully all will go well. I'll keep you posted x

Congratulations on a good heart score. Out of interest, was he holter monitored or tested by a cardiologist?

I am sure you are aware that using your dog as a stud may just possibly alter his temperament.

Hi.
Thanks for the reply. We had Robbie heart tested by a Cardiologist. His name was Antonio Moneva-Jordan (DVM Cert VC MRSVS) A vet based in Dewsberry, West Yorkshire, near where I live. Has anyone heard of him?

As for Robbies temperament changing, I have done a little reading up on this. Apart from the possibility of him wetting in the house, there doesn't seem to be much else that would change about him. He already has the aggression towards most other male dogs...and a strong liking for the ladies!! He won't get the chance to roam as we are very well fenced in. Are there other personality changes I should be aware of?

Thanks for all this help.

It's never to late to learn..however you'll need some patience to train as Boxers can
be quite willfull :D Speaking from experience here!

Where abouts in the Country are you? As there are regional Boxer club matches held during
week nights and some are held on Sundays. Normally these happen once a month.
Here they should help you to train your dog and it's all Boxers so you'll get a good idea of how
he compares to others.
Also try and find a local ringcraft club, these normally meet once a week, every week.
They will also help you to train you and the dog! :D

Other tests, well to some they are essential others desired, it's really up to the individual breeder.
But ask your vet and he should be able to explain what each test would involve and also the costs.
Being perfectly honest there's not many that do test for hips, eyes and thyroid. Butit doesn't mean
to say that it's the correct way to be.

In Boxers the parent club is normally the reference to the British Boxer Club, they do have a website.
The secretary is Mrs Marion Seeney. The working day is held in September. It's up North, off the M1
nearish to Derby if I remember correctly...
I'll find out more for you, its a great day out, they do KCGC's tests, obedience, agility, Boxer racing and
have a exemption (companion) dog show.

The new style heart 'certificates' are A4 sheet (multipart, 3-4 sheets), the owner normally gets the top white sheet
and then is also given another sheet to hand to their vet. Then one normally goes off to the breed genetics advisor to update
the database. It is completed by yourself (your details, your dogs details etc) and signed by the cardiologist that does the
testing. There are various things that he/she fill in.
There is another heart problem that is now affecting some Boxers, this is called Cardiomyopathy. Currently the breed council
is trying to get tests, breeding reccommendations etc agreed. Breed publications such as Boxer Quarterly or getting the
dog papers (Dog World and Our Dogs) and reading the breed notes should keep you informed as to the progress of this situation.

Thanks Boxacrazy for your reply.
I live near Bradford, West Yorkshire. I'm going to give my local Boxer club a ring this afternoon and seek their advice on how to proceed.

The certificate you have described is nothing like the slip of paper I have recieved. Not sure if I'll get the real thing via the post. I didn't have the Shire and Dam's name with me at the time of testing and had to phone them through to the vet when I got home. Could this be the reason I didn't seem to get the correct paperage?

I will certainly be looking in to having these other tests you've mentioned done for Robbie. I'd like to know the outcome for myself, never mind prospective breeders.

As for Boxers being hard to train, obviously I haven't attempted showcraft yet, but so far, Robbie has been very easy to train. He seems to pick things up very quickly and actually enjoys the experience. He's very placid, and, although he is the first Boxer I've owned, he seems much more intelligent than the Labs and Springers I have been brought up with. But then again, maybe I'm being a little bias there as Rob is my baby boy!!

Thanks for all your help. I've taken it all on board and won't be rushing into anything until I feel this is the correct path for both me and Robbie.

If I didn't show him, would that put other breeders off using Robbie as stud? Also, could you possibily advice me, is a zero heart score uncommon in Reds?

The Northern Boxer Club, would be your most local club then!
It has a champ show in April 4th I think normally at Cleakheaton the sports centre there.
They do have match nights. So worth checking out with the club's secretary which I believe
is still Anne Simpson. They may also be able to give you names of local ringcraft clubs which
are going to be good for the novice/beginner handler.

It sounds a little like the old style certificates that were used at the beginning, they are roughly A5 sized
pieces that the owner keeps. These were commonly used upto 1998, if I remember correctly.
I'd have to have a look at my current oldest Boxer's certificate to see, but I'm sure hers was one of the
'old' type. My veteran's definately was.

Boxers ARE incredibly intelligent :) But they are also incredibly stubborn when they want to be.
I regularly am shown up by my girl who looks as if 'the lights are on but no-one's home' attitude
when asked to do the obedience exercises for the Kennel Club Good Citizens training (I go once a week).
However she seems to pull it all together at test nights and has got the Bronze and Silver awards now.
We are currently training for Gold award.
The really annoying thing is she does it perfectly at home!! ARRGGHH don't you just love 'em!! :D

If you don't show him that may put some people off using him, as they would want to measure up his
'excelling' virtues against others. This is what *I* do when looking for a stud to use.
I look at what is being shown in the show ring, what faults my bitch has and if there is a good dog out there
that has the virtues that I need to correct on  my bitch, hopefully that can produce quality offspring in their pups
(it takes both the bitch and dog to do this tho) to all lines, has a fantastic temperament and has all relevant
health testing done and is clear. I wouldn't necessarily look at just using champion studs. But to be honest I know
that there are some champion Boxers not getting that much stud use. There are alot of show studs to choose from.

A zero heart score is the best heart score you can get.
I don't know to be honest *if* it is uncommon for reds to have zero scores.
My red bitch has a grade 1, my brindle a grade 0. This is a mother and daughter, the sire was a grade 1.
But then my benefit was that the grade 0's pedigree was 3/4's heart-tested and all scored either 0 or 1.
So chances were higher that she should score 'clear'.
You can get to see the complete listing of all heart-tested clear dogs on
www.boxerunderground.com/uk
They are listed by their KC registered name and under their respective sex (dog or bitch)