I'm planning on showing my Staffie pup Rio when she's old enough. She's 16 weeks.
She's been to ringcraft about 3 times, and I practise at home.
She's doing quite well, she'll stand quite still when told with no attempt to sit down. We haven't managed to get legs properly yet, as she tends to move them back to where she wants them. But I'm not worried as she'll get there.
But I think I've gone and made a silly mistake, (even though I have heard it's ok to do this).
I've started training her to sit, mainly before I feed her, and when she's getting over excited. She's pretty good at sitting on command now. But It seems like I've spoilt all she's learnt with the stand. Now when I practise with her, she sits down every time. As soon as I stand her and remove my hand from her tummy she sits, I repeat it again and again, but she's having none of it. The thing is I don't really want to stop the sit command as it's important. I never taught my other Staffie Toesy to sit, as I thought it was best not to, if he's been trained to stand. now I have problems getting him to sit on command, (he's getting there). But since I heard you could do both together, I thought I'd try. but I'm not having much luck. Should I stop the sit command until she's got the stand command off to a tee.

Michelle.

Hi Mitch,

I can only tell you what I do FOR "STAND" I say "behave" and for sit it was always sit I always though Sal got the words mixed up too.
So I taught her that when I want her to sit, I will raise my hand palm facing outward and for stand I say "behave" and she stands rock steady, when I want her to sit I raise my hand palm facing outwards now only. She understands this from a distance as well now like out in the park she sits.

Rio is only a baby and will understand, or you could give my way a try and do sit on a signal.

Karen  

The key to your post is that you have STARTED training it :D  A dog cannot be said to be "trained" until and unless it obeys the command every time it is given, offers no other behaviour, and it is totally generalised eg in the ring, in the house and outside.  Suggesting that you cannot train a dog to sit and stand when required at the same time is as nonsensical as suggesting that you cannot train a sendaway and a recall simultaneously.  Just keep at it; dogs tend to take up the position that is most comfortable for them; for some this is the stand, others the sit and yet others the down.

If you clicker train this you may find it easier and quicker.

Keep the faith :D

Would agree that the clicker works well but whatever method you use, pups nearly always go through a stage of trying everything they have learned to please you. This passes (I hope) as they become reliable with each command. Don't know if it helps but I only do one exercise at each short training session.

Hi Mitch
do you use a word when you want her to stand at ringcraft - or do you just stand her?
Sitting was the very first thing that Gus learnt but luckily it hasnt affected him in the Ring . We use the word "stand" when we are setting him up and then "stay" .
When we feed him we say "wait" rather than sit and he will stay for as long as we want.
She is still only a baby though so you have plenty of time.

The main thing here is to stop worrying!!
Your puppy is a young puppy...I had similar trouble with my Boxer Abby, we did both Ringcraft and Obedience.
But she 'clicked' what I wanted her to do in a few weeks.
I just worked really hard with the trainers at obedience classes to train her to Stand  and the sit.
I found it was my fault as the common method to teach the sit is to raise food above their head.
In the show ring it is common for a judge to raise their hand as if they've got food in it, to get the dogs expression...
Which is what I was also mistakenly doing
Well bless her Abby thought we were asking for 'sit' so she did.
However with a little modification on me holding the 'bait' slightly lower and using the word stand.
Also for the first few times in obedience training we worked on me holding my arm under her belly
so she couldn't sit, till she realised what stand meant..
Voila dog that still can do both obedience and show...
She's now two and a half does very well in the showing department and has now got both Bronze and Silver
KCGC awards.
Keep perservering and she will come right I promise, just have lots of patience with her (I know its hard)
You will reap the rewards later!!
:)

She is only a baby, don't worry it will come. 

Training the stand with a young pup I always get down to their level and put the treat almost on the front of their nose.  The usual mistake is holding it too high to soon, so then the back end automatically goes down.  You might even find it easier to train the stand on a table or something of a similiar height.

Use a different tone of voice for the stand command to the sit, mine is usually a bit higher and a bit more relaxed for the stand.

Hope this helps
Sandra

Sandra has just mentioned about treats there- do you show her the treat when you are trying to stand here ?
If so, dont. Let her know she will only be rewarded after either standing or on completion of walking in the ring when you go back to your position .

Lel

As she is only 16 weeks I would show her the treat now, but only reward her once in the stand, shouldn't be a problem if you are at her level.  Then gradually lose it as she progresses and you are able to stand with her in the position. JMO

Just thought that seeing the treat may be causing her to sit as she has been taught to do?

Good point, but I have found if it kept on the end of the nose for a stand, but raised higher and back for a sit. has worked.  I suspect the treat could be the problem as in being in the same position for both ie raised high.

If she is still sitting with it on the end of the nose I would lower it further and put it towards her chest so she has to stand for it. The important point is to be at her level while training the stand as you don't want the head looking upwards at this stage.

We could never use a treat with Gus while trying to stand him :( he was too fixed on the treat to bother listening and stay still.
I suppose its trial and error as they are all different :)

By the way have you ever tried to type looking over a Staffys shoulder who is trying to sit on your knee while you type :rolleyes:

Nope, but tried it with a Dalmatian though :rolleyes: :)

Lel................How long as Sal been at your house? :) :D

Karen

I am typing out notes for revision and both Gus and Noodle are vying for my attention by both trying to be the one that sits on my knee and to cap it all Josh has been sent home from school as he is ill..... arrrgggghhhhhhh!!!! :(

Thanks all, for the help.
I know she is still very young, but I didn't have a problem with the stand, until I introduced the sit command, she's obviously just getting them mixed up, Also when I get her to sit, it's usually before she's given something, eg, food, walk or chews. So that could have something to do with it, she's probably thinking if I sit I'll get something. :D.
I don't normally treat her while I'm standing her, as like Lel says, she loses concentration and just goes mad for the treat. I tend to put them on the side, high up, but she knows they are there. When she stands well for a little while, I praise her and give her a treat. and I repeat that a few times, every day. Like I said she was doing great, but now when I try with her, When I say stand, she sits, lol. I stand her back up and say stand, but she just sits again, over and over, unless I am actually holding her up.
If it is because stand and sit sound to much alike for her, I will try and use another word for stand, as you suggested Karen, and see if if makes any difference.
But yes I no we just need to keep practising. :)

Michelle.

That was my problem I must admit I convinced myself she was getting the words mixed up because I wasn't making a clear "sound" when I said them. So I found "behave" works well at least for us.
Although she will sometimes sit when someone walks up to her thats my fault as I WANT her to sit before they greet her who wants a muddy Stafford jumping up them?......Okay I do but not many other people do. But I figure a well behaved dog with manners is worth the odd hiccup in the ring :)

Michelle have you any new pics of her? I must have a puppy fix :)
Karen

I'll get some to you as soon as possible.

Michelle.

Ta Mitch,

Would be nice to see the competition that we'll have in a year or so ;) as she'll be in bitch classes like Sal :)

Karen

I wanna see puppy pictures toooooooo ;)