I was wondering if shows HAVE to put on AVNSC classes.  I origanly thought they did but have seen a few shows who don't have AVNSC classes scedualed so i thought maybe you didn't.

It has totally confused me and I was wondering if anyone here will know espeically if you run shows!

Rox

Don't think they have to but if a show does not have AVNSC then they will have a AV class for the group (AV Toy etc) and if the show is not judged on group system and you will a class in the AV set then you are entitled to enter the BIS

Yes that makes sense.  The shows that I have seen not sceduling AVNSC classes have had AV group classes and not on group system.

Can I ask you another question jackie H (or anyone else who knows they answer!

If AVNSC is not sceduald and AV group is but you want to go in say AV open will that put you though to BIS or not?  The rules are not very clear and read something along the lines of all unbeaten dogs.

Can someone please put me right as it was all brought up by someone last night and ringcraft and its now really starting to bug me and i want answers!!!!!!!

Thanks alot and sorry for being a total pain!

Rox

Unless there is a challenge at the end of the AV group classes then if you are unbeaten you are unbeaten and can go through to the BIS. If you are a puppy and are unbeaten by no other puppy you can go through to BPIS. The rules say if you have competed and are unbeaten you are able to go into BIS. Of course, if there are breed classes you have to enter them you can do the AV classes but you have to do breed if the breed is classified.

Oh this is confusing but I think I understand.  WHY oh why can't the rules be more clear for dumb people like me!!!!!!

Rox

Now i want to complicate things even more. If i enter my puppy in AVNSC open because there is no AVNSC puppy or breed specific classes and say i get placed 3rd can i go to BPIS if the dogs that are 1st and 2nd are adults. As i would be an unbeaten puppy. Would this be so in any open show or can rules be different.

Yes, you are an unbeaten puppy and that is what the rules say.

There will proberly be a best puppy AVNSC so you can have that.  If there is a puppy who does similar in say post grad then both of you will challenge for best puppy AVNSC.

Hi Beagle are we talking Whitehaven here if we are then you would then go in puppy group before best puppy in show :D Gillian

Thing to remember is you must enter all the breed or AVNSC classes you have entered and if there is a challenge that too, if you are a puppy that has not been beaten by another puppy then you can enter the Best Puppy in Show. Breed and AVNSC classes nearly always (think always) will have a challenge for Best Puppy but AV classes often dont so if you win in an AV class you are straight into Best Puppy in Show.

Note. You can do AV classes if you have breed classes but you must be declared Best Puppy in Breed. If there are no breed or AVNSC classes you can just do the AV ones.

No Satincollie i'm talking about Dumfries. I have entered AVNSC open and AV puppy. I have looked at the schedule since and realised there only seems to be a special puppy competition and BIS at the end. The special puppy can only be entered from an AV special puppy class for each group which i haven't entered for some reason. At the end of the schedule it says that BIS and Special puppy will now be judged which makes me assume that there is no normal BPIS which seems strange.

Hi its the way Dumfries do it I'm afraid so because you havent entered special puppy you wont be able to go in for BPIS.(Should be Best Special pup in show) Thought it might have been Whitehaven as they have just changed to group system.:D Gillian

Thanks for the reply Gillian. At least i know what i'm doing now. Don't know why i didn't enter the class but i'm sure i will next time.