Hi All

I've been researching lots about dog breeds recently as I am considering a puppy. We need to choose the breed carefully as there are a number factors that must be taken into consideration. Whilst researching I have (now unsurprisingly) found that people are looking for 'types of dog' that are not currently available. Like myself for example, the type of dog we are looking for should meet this kind of criteria...

Height-wise must be no taller than a Boxer, should be smooth/short haired, mustn't be too bulky (such as a mastiff), must also be trustable with children (4yrs plus) and other pets such as cats and kittens. However, we would prefer if the dog would also have a natural guarding instinct for our home (as a visual deterrent and an actual protector). (We ruled out the Boxer because of it's apparent short-life and predisposition to illness).

In my search I thought that the ISBT (Irish Staffordshire Bull Terrier) came closest to this match, however looking at some recent pix they still seem to be a bit too similar to the normal Staffs, which (for me) are a bit too short/bulky (i.e. height and weight doesn't seem to be in proportion - aesthetically).

Anyways the crux of this post? Is that people seem to be crossing breeds to try and create a dog that suits their own personal tastes and requirements (I know this has been done b4, it's exactly how we got our breeds today..).

So I was wondering what would 'you' suggest crossing to find a dog that meets my requirements? (or can you think of a breed that's out there now perhaps? - btw below I've pasted a link to a pic of a dog that I like very much). I am also curious as to whether, perhaps, 'you' have thought about crossing dogs to create a dog that matches your own needs? (please share the details with us!!). Also, (now this is jumping the gun a bit..) what if a 'new breed' was created like this - would we have much of a chance to get it recognised as a breed at the big ol KC?

Here's a pic of a dog that I like very much - ideally it would be a little taller!
http://www.edreid.co.uk/Bob-Woodharts-Blue-Boy.jpg

Thanks for reading this long post and I look forward to your comments!

i think the general opinion you will find and for once i actually agree with is that blind crossing of dogs to create something that is just more asthetically pleasing is wrong.

yes, most of todays breeds were bred to look certain requirements but they were to fulfil a role not look right on a lead.

if you want a cross-breed go to your local rescue centre - there are dogs of all shapes and sizes in there already that need homes! pls dont think of making more to add to them.

Andy

Have to agree with you on that one Andy.

I think Andy and Mali have missed the point slightly... It isn't just about how they look...

what else is it the azz? you could get a number of breeds that fit the personality/temprement side of things but the wont all be boxer size with short hair and not to stocky!

p.s dont wanna seem like im havin a go or anything because that isnt my intention. is just one of those subjects!

Andy

(Lol Andy I know your not having a 'dig'..)

'Boxer size'
'not too stocky'
and 'short hair' ?

The size and stockiness is because I don't want children to get 'too' easily knocked down accidently whilst playing - plus I think people get easily frightend by dogs that are 'large' (I am considerate to my friends and family!).
And hair being short? easy to groom...

Plus offcourse it's what I like aesthetically (now would anyone get a dog they didn't like the look of?!)

from what youve said azz id have had you down as a gsd or a kinda person

Nope, when looking for a new breed I look for the dog that might fit us closest, not perfectly, and then look for a good, established breeder within that breed. I'm sorry, but I would never ever dream of encouraging a crossbreeding to produce a puppy that fit too tight a criteria in the first place. Nothing in life is perfect, you just have to get the closest match I'd afraid :)

Why don't you go to a rescue centre and get a cross? Even if you did cross two breeds, you don't know what it will look like when it is older. I have seen x-breeds and people have known the parentage and they don't look anything like what you would have expected them to look like. These crosses haven't been purposefully bred and I don't agree with it.
Gina

(Andy wos a GSD? A German Sheperd? if so no-ta!)

Gina - rescue centre? Getting a 'puppy' from there would be a bit like the lotto - you don't know what you're gonna get! At least with cross-purpose-breeding you have an idea.

Offcourse creating the breed won't happen overnight from one single cross! I'm not saying that - it would take some time to perfect a breed - just like people have done before us. (And some forward thinking people are doing right now, all over the world, and not just in the dog world - just take a look at fairly recent Bengal cat breed for instance).

I'm sorry but you just can't go round thinking you can have one characteristic from one breed another from another breed, put them together - your perfect dog, it doesn't work like that. And you don't have to have a puppy from the rescue centre I meant something 6 upward months, that way you know the temperament and kind of size the dog is going to be. At a rescue centre you can pick and choose which one you want.
Gina

why don't you get a whippet? short coat...not stocky and nearly boxer size :D

Hi Jacki - I like the whippets, but they're too far the other way (a bit too slim/skinny :-)
thanks for the suggestion! (any more?)

Ginauk84...

I'd prefer a puppy because I have a cat and would want to socialise it from an early age (6months is too old for me).

Regarding taking bits from different dogs to create a new dog breed - it's how it's always been done, how do you think many of the dog breeds today were created? The creator of the Doberman had a vision and took attributes from different dogs to create the breed . Bulldogs and Mastiffs were crossed to create many of the dogs around today (Boxers, Staffs etc). Selective breeding/isolating genes etc.

Where has the passion gone? Are we happy to be stuck in the past/happy with our lot? Can we not move forward? Innovate? Create? Above all do we feel we're not capable or worthy? Break the mould and believe in yourself. You can. I can.

We are losing enough of our old breeds so creating new breeds will make things worse. You are contemplating "designer dogs" which are not bred for a particular working purpose.
Get a dobe.

Edited to say It was only 2 days ago that youd decided on an ISBT

Hi Fillis - I grew up with a dobe, and I remb how lots of family and friends were scared of him (he was so soft tho!). Plus I feel for 'my own family' he's a bit on the big size (my partner doesn't like big dogs either!). But I love Dobes and if I were not to consider anyone one else, I'd get one like a shot!

I was enquiring about the ISBTs and yes I feel they are the closest to what I want - I am however, just contemplating the thought (re this post...)

Regarding losing old breeds - I guess that'll be down to their popularity (or the efforts of some to preserve them)

how about an Austrian Short Haired Pinscher? :)

Hi Jacki - Austrian Short Haired Pinscher, can you get them in the UK? I've not heard of them before - I'll have a look on the web...

look here

Hi Jacki - thanks for the link (btw there's an 's' in the link that shouldn't be)

It sounds great - the only bit that I didn't like the sound of was "This breed may not get along well with other dogs. It takes its guarding duty seriously and may have a tendency to bite."

I have to consier the kids and cats!

:-)

ok azz, i've sent you an e,mail with a link to breeds, hope it helps :) good luck in your search

thanks jacki

Then the German Pincher would be a good bet. Sadly this breed is very low in numbers???

My Honey fits your description perfectly! She is a beautiful brindle crossbreed from the Blue Cross, you could well find your perfect dog at a rescue centre. The only downside is that you can only have one, but this only makes Honey more special (although my other half keeps talking about cloning! )

Hayley

Why don't you go to your local Toys r us and get your self a teddy. They come in all different shapes and size and you can bet your life the temprement will be good for your cats.

Cordelia

Cordelia - Now why does something tell me that Toys R Us is your kind of shop? (LOL)

Now there's an idea Hayley - cloning!

I have 2 rescues both who we got a 6 months, we have 2 cats and the dogs had never seen a cat in their life, the cats and the dog did and do get on fine. It was only when we introduced the pup that one cat ran off for a while, the puppy is a lot more unruly than the older pups so the cat was frightened. My first dog is perfect in every way she is a X and from a rescue (6 months), she gets on with everyone, all dogs etc. You can spend time with them at the rescue centre when you get there, if it didn't get on well with your cat or your family, you can always take it back, I know it isn't a nice thing but if the dog didn't fit in. There's the option there.
Gina

My dog fits what you are after - I have never known such a loyal and trustworthy animal who I know would gladly defend us with her life. She's great with my kids - often letting the baby take food from her mouth to examine! She's the right size and build too :D

What is she?... Erm I don't know! She was a rescue dog we got at a year old (and pregnant). She's been called everything from a APB, ISBT to a cross between a boxer and labradoor (She's got the lab tail). Truth is I don't care what she is, I love her.

I can send you a pic if you are really thinking about crossbreeds as a pet but you should really ring around the shelters to see what they have on offer, or better still go and look - you might just fall in love.

<<<Where has the passion gone? Are we happy to be stuck in the past/happy with our lot? Can we not move forward? Innovate? Create? Above all do we feel we're not capable or worthy?>>>

With the many crossbreeds and pedigree dogs sitting patiently waiting for new homes up and down the country, not to mention the poor souls who've gone before them, I'd say no, we are definitely not worthy!

You have a point there Jacquin!

A lot of your requirements seem to be contradictory. A boxer sized dog could easily knock a child over regardless of build. If you have children and a cat a guard dog is perhaps not the best option. I think you would be a good candidate for a rescue dog, as many are cross breeds, at least then you will know what you are getting. Also why a puppy? Both my dogs have been brought up with cats from 8 weeks of age, but i still can't trust them around the cats. Rescue centres will also be able to do a search to find a dog with at least some of the characteristics that you need, good with cats, children, size, coat type e.t.c.

When people did 'create' new breeds of dog, it's worth bearing in mind that a LOT of dogs were culled if they weren't up to scratch.

I wouldn't feel comfortable doing that now, and I certainly wouldn't feel comfortable creating generations and generations of new dogs, maybe 10 puppies at a time, when there just aren't the homes to go around. Would you?

Some dogs end up in rescue centres becuase of death of owners, marriage break ups, all sorts of things. It's not automatically a behaviour problem with the dog. Some will have been brought up with cats and children, and will be the best addition to your family you could dream of, and already house trained to boot!

Why not just go and have a look? If there's nothing suitable, then you've lost nothing but a couple of hours of your time.

Jo

Go to a rescue centre and find a cross there, there are already enough dogs homeless we don't want some silly person breeding crosses and making more dogs homeless just because they wanted the perfect dog blady blah

The perfect dog? :( well i suggest you buy a tape of a barking guard dog, get the kids a hamster that wont knock them over and go to Toys R Us for a stuffed toy dog...its the only way you are going to be truly happy. I havent looked at your link (it didnt work) but as Ed reids name is mentioned it doesnt take much imagination to work out the breed.