got to thinking today about a situation that could one day arise and started to think about the legalities of it.

I have a renault laguna estate with dog cage in back - the beauty of it is that I can leave the car locked but open the big back window on the back door upwards allowing free flow of air. I leave Phoebie in it at shows and sometimes will leave both my dogs in it when visiting family for a while.

Both have brill personalities and sit in there quietly watching the world go by and if anyone walks by they just watch.

But what if someone decided to wind them up and stick their fingers in and one did bite them??? I have no reason to think they would but .........

Where would I stand? Any views?

SaraW :)

I suppose it would depend on what they did to provoke the dogs but with no other witnesses other than the persons stupid enough to do it i think you would be in trouble, it would be your word against theirs and if they decided to prosecute you might end up with a fine, the dogs wouldn't be able to do much damage through the cage i wouldn't have thought, unless they have a mouth like a tiger :). does make you think tho doesn't it?

hhmmmmmm you're thinking like I've started thinking.
It is maybe one of those arguable things that they in your property etc but with the laws how they seem to be nowadays I did wonder.

Just think how many cars are lined up at shows with dogs in cages like this and how many dogs caged on benches

I think that it would depend where the car is. If the car is on public land (the road etc) then it is itself a "public place". If it is on private land (your drive, private car park) then it is "private property" and different laws apply.

Wierd, eh?

well it could be seen in two lights. first why would the persons hand be biten? the person would have had to put it in? to try and break in? steal the dogs? why would they put there hand in ... but then the person could say they were stroking the dogs. so first i think you need to put a warning up on the back. i know it sounds daft and dosent look nice but just when you leave them alone .this way the law would see you let the person know. a bit like in a shop you would have to see cctv operating in this store type of thing.
Mabe you could try and park your car so people find it hard to put there hand in.but i think its a bit hard to do that all the time.
I dont have any other suggestion? sorry xxxxxxlady

I think in future when at my mums (quiet cul de sac) I'll leave the back shut and just have the other windows all down a bit if the dogs are with me - it's not for long usually. If I'm there scrounging motherly TLC for a while I leave the dogs at home anyway - it's just sometimes on the way home from a walk in the woods or whatever.

And at a dog show I'll just trust that people there have enough sense not to stick fingers anywhere.
Has anyone else thought about this when parked at Newark showground for instance? there are loads of cars there with the full hatch up with caged dogs in - at least mine is just the top half of the back.

My two probably wouldn't do anything anyway but I am aware a "trapped" animal can sometimes be aggressive if it feels threatened.

Would putting a sign indicate you thought or knew your dogs were aggressive and therefore be admitting guilt as such - like "beware of the dog" signs on your property? Also the argument is kids maybe can't read and that is where the problem would most likely arise.

Sara :)

sara. use on of those locks that brings the tailgate down, but not all the way [ventlock] so the dogs get air through theyre lockable too, but unless someone crawls down and sticks there head up the back the dogs wont be seeable,.

oh yeah - seen them Linda - good idea :)

Personally I think if someone sticks their fingers in your car its out of order anyway—the inside of your car is out of bounds (effectively its private property).

I won't leave my dogs in a car full stop because like tying them up outside a shop would make me worry that someone would try to steal them (my cute cockers are useless guard dogs).

Putting a sign up is dubious as well as you're practically advertising that you knew your dogs were dangerous in the first place (even if they're not—this also applies for signs on gates to your property).

I know what you mean about inside of car being out of bounds and that had been my thoughts but then got to thinking about how burglars can sue if hurt on your property and stuff it seems nowadays :rolleyes:

When I talk about leaving them in their I'm generally talking about a quiet county village and then only for 10 mins at a time without checking on them but I understand your concerns about theft - it has crossed my mind before.

At a show is diff though and Phoe may be left for 1/2 hr blocks or so. Maybe not in future now

Although it seems totally insane, the inside of your car is only (legally) private property if it is actually on private property. If it is in a public place, then the space inside it is also public space. This was brought in to prevent 'unseemly behaviour' taking place in Lover's Lanes etc. It was this interpretation of the law which meant that supposed pitbulls could be seized from their owner's car if they were unmuzzled and off the lead (very few people remember Otis). Do be aware of this.

i used to leave the rotts in my car in the cage with the back up--------but id not leave the pei, i take them in and cage them ,--theyre just so dam pretty :rolleyes: that anyone would want to steal one, :D

i hope your not leaving them locked in a car on a warm day i would report you straight away!!

OF COURSE!!!!! WHAT OTHER WAY IS THERE !!! pei are just wonderful cooked !!! ask the chinese.

Lol @ Dizzy!!! :D

dizzy-oh so shutting dogs in hot cars is something to joke about, hope someone does it to you one day!!!

tut

I would report me too but I'm not entirely stupid ;)

why, what do you do when you shut your dog in a hot car that does'nt define you as stupid!! STUPID AND CRUEL perhaps??

Shaunie, the whole point about these posts is that the cars are left open so that they aren't hot!!!

jg- ever sat in a hot car with the window open its still hot when you are driving let alone parked!!

Read the very first post, Shaunie - where it specifically states there is a free flow of air! :rolleyes: Where have you got this idea that the car is bound to be hot? I sometimes have to scrape the ice from the inside of my car windows! A bit of heat would be nice sometimes!
:)

jg- read the post where i said on a WARM day!!(sigh)

Oh Shaunie, you do make me laugh!
:)

>>>>what do you do when you shut your dog in a hot car that does'nt define you as stupid!! STUPID AND CRUEL perhaps??

Shaunie - I never mentioned HOT days - you did.

On hot days I don't leave my dogs in cars - infact I don't even take them on a journey in the car if it is warm without the air conditioning on so I freeze but they are OK and then I'd never leave them in there.

Don't try and put words into my mouth and infer I am a stupid heartless person.

You are right to raise the dangers of leaving dogs in vehicles on hot days but there are better,and politer, ways of raising the subject than accusing people of something that isn't true.

Sara ..check out his other posts ;) I reckon it must be wonderful up there ...on the high moral ground :D :D The posts here are atypical of the sort of thing he writes .. :rolleyes: Just completely ignore him .

I read your first post to mean (as did everyone else) a warm day , when some air circulation is all that is needed to keep Sam and Phoebie cool :)

Melody

oh your all so righteous are'nt you always got an answer that makes what you do seem ok, to leave dogs shut in cars unattended with windows open is asking for trouble ,and if one of my kids stuck their hands in and got bit i'd sue the pants off you,don't you people do dog shows in the summer then??

Ok lets break this down into sections :

oh your all so righteous are'nt you always got an answer that makes what you do seem ok

Could be because 99% of what I do in my life is OK (and the 1% isn't to do with my dogs ;) )

to leave dogs shut in cars unattended with windows open is asking for trouble

Just remember they are in a CAGE in the car :D

and if one of my kids stuck their hands in and got bit i'd sue the pants off you

and I'd call you a silly whatever for allowing yr kids to get close enough to stick their fingers into another persons property, through the bars of a CAGE and into a dogs mouth - all without you noticing what they were doing
The whole point of my original post Shaunie was to find out about the legalities of something like this - how would I stand if an irresponsible parent let their kids taunt my dogs.
Just remember Shaunie it is for the fact I am NOT irresponsible I am asking these questions in the first place. I am doing all I can to ensure the safety of my dogs - what I can't account for is the stupidity of some people so incase a stupid person causes a problem I am trying to find out where I'd stand.

don't you people do dog shows in the summer then??

Yes we do and if you weren't so het up and read my post properly you'd see that I say I do not leave the dogs in the car on HOT days. I drive with air conditioning on and then keep the dogs with me in the shade at the other end.

Looking forward to reading your reply Shaunie :)

SaraW

Please show me where she said she put them in the car on a hot day?? YOU said you hoped she didn't. Do you actually have anything useful to contribute to this board as so far every post I've ever read from you has been judgemental and critical, and seems only to be written to start some sort of drama.

Give me a break. If you've something useful to contribute then do so - if you want to have a meaningful discussion then I'd love to. But so far you are critical and sarcastic and have no value for any opinions except your own. A discussion is two people listening to each other and understanding each other even if they don't agree. Every post on every thread I've ever read from you is that YOU know everything about everything and every other opinion is wrong. If that is truly the case then why would you even want to be on a board of such stupid, selfish, cruel and uncaring people (as you have labelled most of us at one time or another in your posts).

Get a life. I think most of us are tired of listening.

Wendy

I know someone who's dog is completly bomb-proof with people, dogs, everything. She's a good working dog. He put her in the back of his land rover (one of those with the canvas tops) while he went into the pub. A drunk came out and started hitting the land rover so she started barking. He then put his hand in the back and she bit him. It was a very big shock that she would do it but she obviously felt threatened. Luckily, the guy was too drunk to actually remember what happened.

Helen

SHAUNIE!!!!!! are you ready for this-take a deep breath and read on------------------- CAGE-CAGE-CAGE-CAGE-CAGE-CAGECAGE-CAGE-CAGE-CAGE-CAGE-CAGE-CAGE-CAGE-CAGE-CAGE-CAGE-CAGE-CAGE-CAGE-CAGE-CAGE-CAGE-CAGE-CAGE-CAGE-CAGE-CAGE-CAGE-CAGE-CAGE-CAGE!!!!!!!!!!!!! oh !!!!!! and not forgetting -ANOTHER CAGE!!!!!!!

depends whether it was a child. they are notorious for sticking their hands and fingers were they shouldnt.

:D @ Dizzy

lol @ dizzy.. sorry but..... :D ...... That cheered me up muchly!

lmao@Dizzy, Ive not been here long but have read his posts and that really made my day :)

all in dizzy's crew are you ,pathetic ,why are people who show dogs such losers we all know what goes on behind the scenes @ dog shows we all see the documentary on TV!! so don't preach to me !

Right - so you're an authority on everything because you've seen a few documentaries - not because you actually go out and spend time in the situations and research it for yourself. Well now of course I'll bow to your knowledge oh great master of all in the universe.

Wendy

dizzy-are you ready for this go stick your childish posts where the sun don't shine ,your not funny just another patronising know all who can't take it when someone dares to disagree with you ! you are so sad you make me weep!

dont be "CAGEY" shaunie !!!!! if youve something to say !!!!! just out with it :D :D :D

:D :D :D @ Dizzy!

:D :D :D

sad sad sad sad sad sad now your just making yourself look very silly dizzy ,why don't you do something constructive and let your sharpei out of his cage to stretch his legs or must'nt he get dirty cos you got a show coming up!

he is a she shaunie------but as you talk such boll-cks. you obviously havent got a pair!!!!!!!

lol :d

oh dear darling did i upset you ? must of hit a nerve!

not at all flowerpot!!!!!!! your amusing if nothing else.

glad to be of service sweetheart!

lmao :D At these posts, now this makes good reading!!! SHAUNIE you are sooooo funny ha ha :)

I bet you feed meat (horror ;) )to her while she's in her cage, Dizzy, to get her nice and savage??!! ;) :) :D

feed her :ROLLEYES: bog are you meant to feed them !!!!!! no-one told me that :( best not incase she ends up strong enough to escape out of her CAGE.

ROTFL!!! @ Dizzy! :D