Hi I am new to this site and would value advice concerning buying a Labrador puppy from a mother who hasn't been hipscored.

I'm no expert, and I'm sure other more experienced folk will be along later; but if the mother hasn't been hip-scored, then your pup may have serious problems from an early age, heart-breaking and expensive for you, and disastorous for your new pup. You must also ask yourself, if the owners have not had their dog Hip-scored, have they bothered to get eye tests etc done, are they breeding their dog every season, with no regard for the pups future, will they be there to help you with any questions. I doubt it.

Find yourself a responsible breeder, ask lots of questions, and expect to be asked lots of questions. Then hopefully you'll enjoy a long and fullfilling relationship with your new 'best friend'

liberty :)

Thank you for the reply, the puppy in question is from a litter of 11 and the mum is 3 years old, and has been eye tested but not hipscored, the father has been apparently. According to the breeder this is the first litter and they have an excellent pedigree. I was fully expecting to be asked lots of questions about what sort of home I can provide but none were forthcoming! I have placed a deposit but am now having some reservations about this breeder.

No questions at all I expect the third degree from breeders unless we know each other well I would ask why she wasn't x rayed

Bit irresponsible of the stud dog owner to let the dog be used on an unscored bitch too

I still wouldn't buy one from them

But that is just my opinion

I agree with Moonmaiden entirely, this doesn't sound like a very responsible breeder, I'm afraid I too would be going elsewhere.

Let us know how you get on :)

liberty

There should be no "apparently" about it. If both the sire and the dam have been hipscored the breeder will have the original/copy of the dated certificate from the BVA. What is their version of an "excellent" pedigree? Please, please do not encourage this type of breeding by buying a puppy from them and save yourself possible future heartache. No puppy can be guaranteed to be perfect but if the breeder has done things like having their bitches hip scored and elbow scored etc the odds are dramatically reduced and they are demonstrating a duty of care to the breed and you the customer. There are millions of labs in the UK and thousands who have been properly screened; don't give your custom to someone who does not care enough to do the right things.

A big no no the bitch might be ok but she might not & i personally would not take the risk

I'm a little confused now, I went back to the breeder and was shown the pups KC pedigree certificate and under the Sires name it says hip= 4-7 and under the Dam hip=4-3. What the mother hasn't had done is OCD, what is OCD?

OCD is a condition called Osteochrondrosis Dessicans that I believe affects lab's.
I'm sure if you do a search on here under OCD you will find some information on it.
regards,
linda

Hip scores of 11 and 7 total are very good scores for a Labrador. The breed average is 16 total so they are well below the average. The test for OCD is the Elbow Dysplasia Screening.

The scores for that are between 0 (Perfect) and 3 (Severe elbow displasia). This test has only been available in the UK since the mid 1990's and is still not as widely carried out as we would like but after a slow start it is just beginning to be more generally used. Even so I doubt if more than 10% of Labradors are tested at this time.

Regards, John

Thanks to all for the advice and information. I'm sure I will be asking many more things after we bring our boy home :)

Pottie I don't wish to appear rude, but do you still intend to buy your pup from this breeder? After all that's been mentioned, I hope it all works out for you and your pup.

liberty

Hi Liberty, yes I do, after returning to the breeder I am now aware that it's the OCD that hasn't been undertaken, I had never heard of OCD and presumed it was the hipscore the breeder was referring to. :o

It would seem it was a case of misunderstanding, hope you find nothing else to worry you and will soon be happy training your new puppy not to wreck your home. Also seems the breeder is happy for you to make sure that the pup has been well bred, which it would appear it has. If either of the parents had bad OCD they would be a little lame on one of the front legs or would have had an operation. If you now trust the breeder I would go ahead and collect your little bundle of joy, after all, there are no sure things in this life and you have checked as far as you can and you can do no more.

Are you talking about the pedigree or the registration certificate? If the pedigree is home made then the breeder can put anything on there. Any health tests that have been done on the parents are always on the registration certificate of the pup.

The parents of my lab bitch were not hip scored however seeing as they were working gun dogs as were their parents and so on and had 17 field champions in the line - hip scoring was not worth worrying about. The dogs have proved that their hips are okay by being able to work with no problems (even met the pups grandfather who at 12 was still able to go out on a shoot with out any problems)

But if you have a choice then go for hip scored breeders

When we got our lab bitch many years ago we did it all wrong, and I shudder to think about it! The litter was advertised at the farm gate (April Fool's Day, too!) so we went "just to have a look". Mum's nature was nice, but she was small, with a very wavy coat - not what Ned's lab 'at home' looked like at all. But the pups' Dad was lovely, so we crossed our fingers that this particular bitch (the one who kept on getting stepped on in the dark because she'd climbed out of the pen again!) would take after him, and not her mum.

No KC Reg, no hipscoring, no eye tests (though it was a while ago).

She turned out to be the best dog anyone could hope to have. Her only vet bills were for stitches after going through barbed wire, and for her final journey when she was 13. She never had the slightest hint of any problem with hips etc. Her mother was still working at 12, so she can't have been too bad!

The gods must have been smiling on us that April Fool's Day. It just shows you can get lucky.
:)

I went to visit an Irish Setter breeder last week we talked for five hours!!! I want to make sure I am doing all I can to get a happy, healthy puppy with the best start in life. Not only did I make sure that health checks and tests had been carried out on the parents but I also got to know the breeders, and I was convinced that they love their dog's very much, have their best interests at heart and were breeding for the right reasons...We were asked many questions too mind you :) but I didn't mind a bit - If I bred pup's I wouldn't want to let them go to just anybody.
Sarah.

The documentation I was shown was the Kennel club registration.

Pottie, at the end of the day as long as you're happy, and the dog is fine, then good luck to you both:) Have fun :)

liberty :)

Thanks everybody, had it not been for the advice/info given here I would still be ignorant about the difference between hipscores and OCD. I have been visiting our puppy everyday and have got to know the breeder quite well and feel very confident about her care and concern for the puppies.

Hi,
As long as your satisfied then that's enough. Good luck with the pup.

Karen

It is nice to hear that you have built up a relationship with your puppie,s breeder, it will stand you in good stead as it grows up. Only wish all puppies and puppy owners could have the same. What you have found is what we advice to all owners of dogs, rapport with their dogs breeder so through out the dogs life you will have support and advice from someone who cares as much about your dog as you do.