Am I right in thinking that, for correct heel work for working trials, the dog should focus on your chest? If so, could anyone tell me how this differs to other points of focus (ie direct eye contact) for other disciplines (ie competitive obedience, schutzhund).

Thanks

Jo

Never heard of that one although I only dabbled with WT with my first BC. The heel work position is the same as Obedience but does not have to be so"tight"or close. My BC used to watch my feet :) in WT as well as Obedience

Katrina Griffiths had dual champions(Ob & WT)& they worked in the same position for heelwork in both disciplines

But things might have changed

I agree with Moonmaiden, the Working Trials heelwork is basically a "working" exercise. For example, if you can imagine being out with the dog in a rough field with cowpats, bracken, brambles etc it may well actually be impossible to do "velcro" heelwork and as far as i know that is not expected. It could also be detrimental to movement of both dog and handler.

The handler is supposed to walk naturally (I gently swing my arms) so you don't for example hold the one arm on the hip/waist as a cue as many obedience competitors do; in fact i believe you get penalised for doing so.

Having said that, :D, i have taught my girl to heel fairly tight, as i know that on the day she will work more loosely.

I'm no expert but have concentrated on the dog paying close attention, as the judge may walk behind or next to you and be chatting as you are doing the exercise ! Also, varying speeds as you are required to run and slow walk too.

Lindsay

There is no difference between the attention and focus required for obedience, schutzhund or Working Trials. The way it is marked may be different! It is a requirement in schutzhund to have free swinging arms. In working trials many judges will dock for an obedience "hernia" (LOL) as the rules say that heelwork should be carried out in as natural manner as possible and some penalise it as a continuous command.

Thanks. I was asking because my trainer said the dog should look at your chest, as opposed to your eyes, in working trials which struck me as a bit odd?

Strikes me as a bit odd too! (LOL). I would be interested to know how you would train for this and, how a judge would know what the dog was actually looking at :).

Allyson

That's a relief. The thought of holding treats dangling from bits of string in my mouth was not a prospect I relished. :D Basically then, as long as the dog is looking in your general direction, you're pretty much ok?

Jo :)

You just don't have the right level of dedication do you :) (In a schutzhund recall your arms have to be down by your side and so you cannot use your hands as you would in Obedience and WT and so many people train their dogs by spitting out a sausage at the appropriate moment; as my dog's favourite titbit is dried tripe I avoided that (LOL).

You may even be penalised by a few judges (not many) for having heelwork that is too tight! the argument being that the dog could fall down a hole while it is looking at you!

In my experience very few triallists have this level of heelwork; it is, after all, only worth 5 points in all the stakes bar CD where you have to do HOL and HF for 15 marks (I think; I can never remember the marks in CD).

Good luck with the training.

Allyson

Thanks Allyson. I must admit the idea of holding a sausage in my mouth while training Cam in my local park might get me a bit of a reputation. It's bad enough coping with the odd looks people give me when I hide from Cam behind bushes. I'm sure they think I'm indulging in some 007 fantasy.

So that I get this right - in schutzhund, you're not allowed to use hand signals during heelwork (or recall??)?

Out of interest, which exercise carries the most points in wt?

Many thanks

Jo

Schutzhund marking is very strict; the exercises are very simple but the marking is hard; so for example on a recall you must stand with your legs no wider apart than your hips, hands by your side and just say "come" or name of dog; you cannot do both! With positions on the move again only one verbal command with no hand signal or turning around. Heelwork must be with completely free swinging arms (or arm when it is HOL).

Obviously working trials is made up of 3 sections, nosework which overall carries the most marks; in the control section the biggest number of points (apart from the down stay) is the sendaway and redirect = 10 points; in agility you cannot qualify if your dog cannot scale which is worth 10 points. You need 70% from each section to qualify and 80% of the overall marks to qualify "excellent". That equates to 80/100 for CD, 160/200 for UD/WD and 176/220 for TD.

Thanks Allyson. Hope I'm not distracting you from your work to answer my questions.

Right, I'm off to dangle a sausage from my mouth in my local park. :D

HI Jo

This info may be of interest, just happen to have it by the computer :)

Group 1 - Control

Heel on leash - 5 marks
Heel free - 10 marks
Recall to handler - 5 marks
Sendaway - 10 marks

Group 2 Stays

Sit 2 minutes - 10 marks
Down - 10 minutes - 10 marks

Group 3 Agility

Clear jump - 3ft - 5 marks
Long jump - 9 ft - 5 marks
Scale 6ft (3) Stay (2) Recall (5) - 10 marks altogether.

Group 4 Retrieving and Nosework

Retrieve a dumb-bell - 10 marks
Elementary search - 20 marks

There is a minimum group qualifying mark, 21 for group 1, 14 for group 2, 14 for group 3 and 21 for group 4. My info is a couple of years old but should be pretty much right :) (If not Allyson please put me right).

Lindsay

Yep. CD is the hardest stake to qualify in. All that bloody heelwork and then the two lots of stays, which is where most beginner dogs/handlers fall down. Unlike obedience or even schutzhund it is an "all or nothing" stay and so if your dog remains in the down stay for 9 minutes 50 seconds you will get a "0" and it is almost impossible to qualify without a stay in any of the stakes (although I came pretty close with my first dog with quite a few 24 1/2 marks out of 35 without a stay (qualifying mark 25)!

Fortunately as CD is an optional stake (at the moment) you can elect to bypass it.

The Stays are really hard aren't they - out of sight for 10 minutes in a completely strange place with probably strange dogs is a real challenge.

I never thought about bypassing the CD - hmmmmmm - :D

Lindsay

I just think a sit and a down is irrelevant; why do both? what does it prove and how useful is it? ( I have by the way qualified 2 dogs CDex so it is not sour grapes!) (LOL)

Because this is all completely new to me, would some kind soul please explain the meaning of CD, UD/WD and TD?

I'm hoping TD means "top dog". :D

CD = Companion Dog
UD = Utility Dog
WD = Working Dog
TD = Tracking Dog
PD = Patrol Dog

If you get 2 x CC in PD or TD this makes up your dog to WT Ch