J/Genie I was just wondering have you read C. O`Driscolls letter or any of the papers/articles written by Drs. Shcultz or Dodds at all?

Christine, Spain.

Yes, I've read a lot of Catherine O'Driscoll's articles in various magazines and on websites. Unfortunately she never seems to be writing from an unbiased point of view - she always comes across as having an axe to grind. I'm afraid I've reached the stage where I find her very difficult to believe as what some things she has written in the past (I'm afraid I can't find the articles at the moment but I'll look them out when I have time) have been totally untrue.

I'm sure she is sincere, but I can't be doing with evangelism. Sorry.

Yes but she`s one of the very few who`s getting the facts out there. I`m talking about the artcles/studies & experts she quoting from, not just her experiences. You don`t have to read her personal experiences if you don`t want to but you can`t argue with the experts who`ve done the studies & she`s getting them out there. Dodds/Schultz/Carmichael & some others I can`t remember at the mo & they are the people she gets the facts & figures from, . Have you read anything the others have written?

Christine, Spain.

well, I'm glad I read this posting.
My beloved Tess, was vaccinated as a pup, but that was all. And she was as fit as a lop until old age finally got the better of her. Was going to have her vaccinated but parents advised against. Rightly or wrongly I never had her done, and she was NEVER ill.
Now, I've been notified from my Vets that Rocky is due his yearly booster. He's 13 months. Was all ready to make an appt for the booster, but after reading this posting, I am not quite so sure now. But then again, the kennel's won't take him without it...and aparently, his insurance could be affected.
I do remember the parvo outbreak in the late seveties......I was 9 when my Jack Russel, Tiny got it. He was the runt of the litter, (I felt soo sorry for his little sad face, still remember it now), and can you believe he survived the parvo??? Yaayyyy!! :)
Thanks for an interesting read.

Hi Steph

Would your kennels accept a dog using homeopathic nosodes (alternative medicine)?

I checked my pet insurance and if I don't vaccinate the only things they will not cover me for are illnesses related to not having the vaccinations. I suppose all insurance companies may have different rules, so would be worth checking

Hayley

Hi Hayley,

We used to use a homeopathic alternative to boosters, they were packets of white powder that you initially gave every day for a week, then once a week for a month and finally monthly for life. Is this what you use? If so, could you e-mail me the details of the company you get the from, as we have moved and lost the details!

Many thanks, Erin

Try this link

Thank you!

Erin

Hi Erin

I haven't tried the nosodes (yet) as we have only just decided to stop having the annual boosters, so I will definitely be looking into them

Hayley

Hi all
Regarding vaccinations and kennelling under the new guide lines for kennels, vaccination is required for all pets, however those kennels that don't insist on pets being vaccinated during boarding have a higher risk of spreading the diseases mentioned. remember that dogs can be carriers, but not infected themselves.
Also due to insurance companies requiring pets being boarded to be vaccinated as well as the new regulation guide lines kennels now insist on all pets being vaccinated. This does not necessarly reflect the kennel owners own views on the subject and sometimes homeopathic remedies are very good, but as in all things rules have to be followed.
Bazza

No you`re not on your own, theres quite a few of us out here :) & we`re more than wary of it :)
Theres some groups about dogs/animals & not vaccinating you can join & find loads of info if you want.

Christine, Spain.

OK, so if titre levels are good, how do we know when they aren't? How often should dogs have to be subjected to blood tests? We could be doing it every few weeks! Truth is nobody really knows how long they last do they.
Dawn.

OK just to throw something else in I read a report somewhere (can't find where at the moment lol) that dogs that have been exported from Britain to Greenland or Iceland (can't remember which) where distemper and parvo virus do not occur naturally and are therefore not vaccinated for nor exposed to still had sufficient immunity to these diseases 10 years later. Hence why I don't vaccinate every year.

Jesse

If there are very few anibodies circulating then the reading will be low with minimum protection, just as if they are high it shows protection, thats how you can tell. What can`t be tested is memory cells & they play a big part in protection.
Truth is they do know that antibodies circulate for a lot longer than a yr & that is a known fact. What is not a scientific fact is animals need yearly boosters, there has never been any evidence for this being done.
Schultz/Dodds/Carmichael, all well know experts have done studies & tests. It`s out there on the net & also published in vet medical journals & books.

Christine, Spain.

I remember the parvo outbreak of the 70's :(

It's difficult and i have never been quite satisfied with the whole question and answer scenario on vaccination.....

My previous dogs were given maybe 2 boosters in their lives and lived very healthily indeed. I was very worried about vaccine reaction so chose not to boost any more. My breeder never vaccinates but uses homeopathic nosodes.

I had my pup vaccinated and boostered, but strangely she is sensitive to pollen and has the occasional bout of conjunctivits.....i did read somewhere that this can be a reaction to the vaccine, although there was some months in between her being vaccinated and showing an allergic/intolerant response. If anyone has any info on this I would be grateful. If she is showing some kind of bad response I will be very wary..... :(

She is due again (she's 2 and a half now) and i am having titre tests done, i have a lovely vet and hopefully she will co-operate. It will be very interestign to see what happens.

I know several people whose dogs have had reactions; a friend's Cocker went through a terrible auto immune problem and was eventually put to sleep after much heartache. Her story was featured in Dogs Today a while back.

When i spoke to my vet about parvo, (as we have had the recent outbreak locally) she did say that even vaccinated dogs can get it, but not so badly.

Lindsay

Lyndsay you should read C O`Drisolls letter. It quotes the studies & the links between pollen/conjuctivitis/vaccines by Fricks & Brooks. Would you like me to send it you? Have looked but your email addy isn`t showing.

Christine, Spain.

Christine,

Could you send it over to me please to my Freeserve address? Thanks. Christine@jagerreh.fsnet.co.uk.

I only have my puppies vaccinated and nothing after that. Having had 1 dog I bred put to sleep for a severe reaction straight after a booster, another pup I bred went into a parvo type fit after receiving his 2nd puppy jab and Miranda suffering from skin problems since her 1st booster, I'm too wary to ever get them their annual vaccines again.

I`ve sent it L/M. Sorry to hear about your dog`s tho.

Christine, Spain.

HI Christine

I must have got the info about the conjunctvitis etc from that letter, as i get Dogs Today. If you could kindly remind me which month it was in....

Thanks very much
Lindsay

Hi Lindsay, I`ll track it down a it later, prob early afternoon, for you. If you`ve got back issues of dogs today you`ll also find a piece from Richard Allport. He found a study done in New Zealand that hardly got to see the light of day, so he put in there but that one was a few mths ago.

Christine, Spain.

Edit just to say it`s in the August edition. :)

Thanks Christine,

I have the August edition so will be able to read it :)

I also remember reading the article by Richard Allport.

Lindsay
X

Thanks Christine, where's the best place to start??

Julia & Hooligans

Hi Julie, I didn`t find it easy finding info at first but I joined some lists & now I get most of it from them, if something new comes out it`s on one or other pretty fast :) So I think that would be the easiest/quickest way to read up on it.
Most of the forums are on yahoo & when you join you can go to the files & between them they have a lot of documents that you can read.
justsayno2vaccs BeyondVaccination TruthAboutVaccines

Also alternative food/medicines groups have lots of good info as well & if you can see if your breed has a natural/raw feeding group & they would have info as well. I`m not saying change to alternative food/medicines you understand :) its just that those are the places that will have documents/articles etc so you don`t have to spend hrs trawling the net. If you want I`ll send you some addies a bit later.

Christine, Spain.

Thanks Christine

I already use alternative medicines for the boys where-ever possible & they have a semi-raw diet.

I'll go search Yahoo.

Rgds

Julia & hooligans

Hi Christine, I have replied to your posting, but its back on the first page - so I thought I would mention it here,please could you send me the article. Thanks.

Just emailed you W/L :)

Christine, Spain.

Thanks - got it- wow that was quick.

Just to add my 2p worth!

I was very concerned about the possible side-effects of vaccination, and did quite a bit of research before deciding what to do with my pup Cam. In the end I decided to let him have his puppy jabs *minus* lepto, but waited until 10 weeks for him to start. When it comes to annual booster time I'll get him titre tested, and will continue with titre testing every year to keep a check on him.

Interestingly, I spoke to two different vets at my practice about it. One of them thought I was being very sensible, and commented that in his opinion annual boosters were unnecessary and the older a dog gets the greater the risk to their health.

The other vet gave me a lecture on how important the lepto jab was and how dobes should only be fed Eukanuba (which coincidentally, the practice sells).

I did appraise her of the facts as I had found them, but she wasn't impressed (I suspect she was suffering from "recently graduated syndrome").

God help me if I ever have children ... it was a nightmare trying to decide what would be best for Cam. :)

Jo

Good for you Jo :) But would the vet who thought you were being sensible have said anything if you hadn`t? And if he thinks they were unnecssary why isn`t he telling people????? It makes me angry & sad because there are a lot vets who know the dangers/risks & still leave their clients in ignorance, instead of telling them & letting people look into it & decide when they know all the facts.
After I had my 2 youngsters titred I knew they had no antibodies to anything, because of the reactions that had happened to the first vacc I also knew they dangers of vaccinating them again. I made a terrible mistake 7 kept them isolated from the outside world till they were 10/11mths old & then I had them vacc for Adno/Distemper. They both had a skin reaction & I wish I`d never given it them. After that I said I/they can`t live like this any more & started taking them out, the male adapted but the bitch never has & she`s lovely but I`ll never be able to take her in the ring, she just freaks out. She`s great at home but doesn`t really like changes & going to different places. Wish I knew then what I know now......

Christine, Spain.

My dog is 1 year and 3 months old and she is due for her first booster very soon or around now. I don't know weather to get her done either. I think I am going to get her done this year and then get her done every second year from then on. I saw some where once on an animal programme on the television that no one knows how long the vaccinaations last and that was why it was so important to get them done every year but none of my relatives..(on one side anyway)...have ever got booster vaccinations and they have alll been fine, however on the other side of the family...if you suggest not having a booster they practically eat you alive!!!