Please can anyone help as I am so confused. We have been trying to stop our 11 week old pup from nipping, growling etc.. but now I am really confused. After attending puppy class they have said that we should "Encourage" her to bite/mouth us and only yelp, shout NO or whatever when she bites too hard...Is this right?? This method bothers me as I have a 3 year old so surely any form of biting must be stopped.

Many thanks
Deb

hmmmm
I would never encourage a dog or puppy to bite, by encouraging it, and then not wanting it to do it, you are just going to confuse the pup.
Yes, the yelping idea can work, but often the pup thinks you are just playing and goes harder.
I found that the best thing to do it when the pup begins to mouth and bite, to stop the game completely and ignor her until such time as you feel the game can carry on.
If pups are not trained out of mouthing at a young age, they can have masisve problems in later life. I have met several dogs who clearly have not been taught out of it, and they are more boistrous and some might say slightly aggressive.
Good luck ( and possibly re-think the training class you are attending..just my oppinion but I personally feel that encouraging a pup is just creating problems)

Thank you, I think you have confirmed what I already knew deep down. I have 3 children who are so confused, one minute I've said don't let her bite, walk away and ignore her, the next I'm saying let her bite gently..

One of the main problems we have with the ignoring thing is that she growls and bites your ankles (or legs in my 3 year olds case) as you try to walk away, any advice on that please.

Many thanks
Deb

You could try making her sit and stay as you walk away ( this will take a bit of training though)
Or you could get a baby gate or puppr crate. A baby gate would mean that you would walk away and shut it behind you so she cant get to you, but it would be better to train her out of it rather than to just prevent it with a gate.
She is still very very young, but razor sharp teeth!

Many people use crates for training. I did buy one, but didnt use it a great deal, however, for some people it works.
You children will have to go along with the training methos that you use, although they are young, your pup needs to respect them, and they also must be careful not to confuse the pup ( eg, sometimes its ok to play with mouthing, and others it isnt).
But, I wish you the best of luck, and have a hunt around for a better training class. They are a great idea, but as with everything, some are not as good as others.
steph
x

From the sound of it, the trainer is following /Dr Ian /Dunbar's way of teaching bite inhibition - it is just one way of teaching pups not to bite. A lot of people don't agree with it;but if you hear him and also watch his videos you understand exactly what he is doing and why. - Try a search on here on bite inhibition, there have been a few threads about it i think.

I agree though, it could be rather confusing for small children.

Lindsay

I normally agree with Dunbars training tips, but this one I do find rather odd. Surely you are creating problems for yourself by encouraging a dog to bite, even if the outcome will be for it not to bite.
To me it is a little strange, and yes, confusing for both the kids and the dog. As I said, I have always had perfect luck with the ignoring approach. Basically, no dog, especially pup, likes to be ignored, so if they realise that something they are doing is causing them to be ignored, they will stop doing it....so they will learn to stop the stimulus that is causing them to be ignored...if you know what I mean.
I just cant see the the encouraging to bite thing working very well.
Hope you manage to train your pup ok. We are probably making this all sound a lot more complicated than it actually is :)

Hi Debbie,
I was given some advice from someone on here last year ( when Douglas was a puppy).I waited till the kids had all gone to bed , then sat on the floor to play with him.I would allow him to mouth for a few minuits and then shout "OWWW" really loud.This would stop him for a short time then I would repeat again after a few min ( when he started to nip).Every night I would shorten the amount of time that I would allow him to mouth until I shouted "owww" every time he mouthed.We then got the kids to do the same .He learnt very quickly that his teeth hurt and this wasnt play to us.I have to say the first 6-8 months are really hard work especially if youve got kids as screaming,running and jumping kids + puppy= total nightmare.
Cant be that bad though coz weve started talking about another pup when Douglas is 2 :) xxxxx

Hi Debbie,
What we did with our youngest at this stage, to help with ignoring the pup when they go for the feet, is to stick a pair of wellies on her when she was walking around the house. When the pup then attacked her feet, she would not make any noise at all, stand still with her arms crossed and look straight ahead, he would soon get fed up and walk away. Obvoiusly this goes hand in hand with everything else already suggested here, but I know how difficult it is with the younger ones as it does hurt!

Thats a really good idea Gemini.
Also, just to add to that, if the pup continues to go for the wellies, get some bitter apple spray from the vet (might be able to get it from pet shops too, not sure) and spray it on the boots...the pup will hate the taste and leave your legs alone.
Good luck!

Love the wellies ideas, gemini and I've already dug them out from the back of the cupboard, haven't really needed them in this weather! Dizzy as you say it all feels a bit of a nightmare at the moment, we've just had a really bad growling, biting session so we're all banned from the kitchen, following a row with my 3 & 7 year old who think I'm being cruel making them ignore her, especially as she's crying now. There are times when this growling is quite scary although we all do our best not to show fear, thank god shes so small, a yorkie cross.

Thank you everyone for your ideas, the encouragement is really making me see that there is light at the end of the tunnell, I hope.

Debbiexx

Hi Debbie,
It is hard with little ones , but it does get better honest.If you do a search under growling im sure youll see loads of people have been in the same boat as you and some of the answers are really helpful.I had a small issue with smacking as I dont smack the kids ..but I have had to Only once or twice had to resort to tap on his bum when he kept chasing the kids.My middle child has has learning difficulties and would end up on the floor with Douglas on top growling and the little one screaming.
I was able to rectify the problem over a course of time but it was hard work.I have to say that now he is16 months old he is the most loverble,well behaved dog and well worth the hard work.
good luck Kiz xxxxxx

Thanks Kizzy,

It really is good to hear from someone who has been through it all and come out the other side. I must admit I did tap (and it really was only a light tap) on the nose because she kept growling and biting my little ones legs as he tried to get away from her...I felt so bad afterwards though and I really don't think that will help in the long run..

A short while ago I bent down calmly to stroke her and she went into one, barking, growling and biting, I shouted NO and left the area...When I went back in again she started barking at me and whether it was right or wrong I picked her up and she snuggled into me and went to sleep...ahhhhh...But everytime I think we're getting somewhere a bad day follows sometimes..so thanks for giving me hope and something to look forward to.

Debx

don't want to put a downer on this but my sister inlaw has yorkie cross, he is crossed with a terrier, and to be quite blunt he is a little sod (won't swear) she has a 2yr old son and a 4 yr daughter they have to be watched constantly as she can not trust him, he jumps up at them goes for there faces, the little boy is covered in scratches from him. A lot of this is due to lack or no training, so i would strongly suggest what everyone else is saying. he is coming up for one now and the only person who can control him is myself, he now's that i will not stand for any nosense from him and i can also change my voice pitch which his owner does not do so he does not know the difference from bad and good. I have talked her into training classes so hopefully that will help.

Debbie, I had exactly the same in terms of kids in tears, accusing me of being cruel by making them ignore my dog, Buster, and in fact sometimes I feel like I did make their life hell, as at various stages they would forget and it would all go off again, he's 10 months old now so still young, but the training has paid off, it was just a case of letting him know who's boss in a way that he understood, i.e. food last, ignoring him when he badly behaved, making him wait while I walked through the doorway before him, etc etc, I followed more or less everything from the Gwen Bailey book, Perfect Puppy, and as I say, we are beginning to reap the rewards now, although being an adolescent we are now coping with jumping up and being off the lead, which I have bored others on this board with! Your perseverence will pay off, I'm sure, it's just bloody hard work!!

God Gemini,

I can really relate to the fact of making my kids lives hell. If it's not bad enough being school hols, I'm screaming at them every 10 minutes for not doing things by the book..ie "Ignore her", "dont look at her" ..etc at this rate they'll never enjoy their puppy..I think I need to relax...perhaps I'll have a glass of wine..Oh well it's nearly the weekend and I need it.

Thanks for encouragement

Debxx

Whilst I don't agree with encouraging a puppy to bite you in order to put in some training, I do agree with allowing biting up to a certain point.

If puppies are left with their littermates/mums they learn to inhibit (control the hardness of) their bites because if they play too rough their mates will yelp, cry, squeal whatever, and stop play. From this the pups learn what doesn't hurt, what hurts, what causes damage etc. Because we take pups from their littermates/mums at very young ages, their training in learning to inhibit their bites is incomplete. Therefore, it is up to us as their new pack to teach them to inhibit their bites. Pups that nip in play need to know they have hurt so you yelp, cry out etc like a pup would and you immediately turn away from your pup and stop play. This in itself is punishment for a pup because he's lost his playmate.

By about 14-16 weeks old everytime your pup puts teeth on flesh you yelp and withdraw whether he has hurt or not because now the pup needs to learn that teeth on human flesh is not acceptable at all.

Hopefully, by teaching the bite inhibition in the first place, if your adult dog goes to pick up a toy at the same time as you do and makes connection with flesh, he will do so with a 'soft mouth' and his grab/bite won't hurt. If he has never been taught how to control the hardness of his bite he can inadvertently do a lot of damage without even trying.

I believe this is the motive behind and basis for what Ian Dunbar has written in his Good Little Dog Book.

I would go along with that completely, "dog behaviour".
:)

I can understand where you are coming from totally, only problem is it's hard with the children differentiating between what constiutes a "hard" bite and what doesn't. Things do seem to be improving withe the biting but its the growling and barking that seems to be getting worse and the nipping at the ankles as you walk up the garden.

I'm sure we will get there eventually.

Many Thanks

Debx

I found myself in a similar position at my class this week. We have been working really hard to stop Sparky being "jumpy and bitey" with the kids over the past week, and found some brilliant advice on the forum to help. Sparky is now greeting the kids with a very waggy tail, sits, and gives his paw. He is hardly ever mouthing now (found a great entry on this, and spend lots of time fussing him when he is quiet and calm, telling him what a gentle puppy he is), and gives us "kisses" instead. I feel much happier when young children approach him in the street, and we are all much more relaxed with him at home, so of course Sparky is picking up on this and has calmed down. He is gorgeous!

So, off we went feeling very proud of ourselves to our class on Wednesday, where the trainer criticised him for NOT being jumpy enough for a puppy! Have I done the wrong thing?