Hi,

My 6mth old GSD was eating a big chew yesterday and when my partner went to stroke him he growled. I know he thought my partner was going to take it off him but he didnt like the fact that the dog growled at him.

Is there anyway to let the dog know that you should be able to take it from him at any time or is this perfectly normal and we should just let him get on with it?

Hi

You will find many different view on here on this...I'm afraid I am firmly in the camp that a dog should never be possessive over food and should put up with their food being messed about with by their owners, and taken away at the owners choosing...therefore my dogs are taught to "give" really early, and also to "leave" before they get their food, and "leave" over chews etc.

I would cut out any treats for a while, take away all chews, toys etc...and only let him have them once he has learned to leave. Being a GSD he will learn fast...but you must get him to a position where you can take anything you like off him.

HTH a bit
Chloe

I'd work on getting my dog used to my hands being around food if I were you (and your partner). The best way of doing this is to put half his normal diet in the bowl, and add the rest a little at a time by hand (or spoon if you don't feed dry and can't face handling tinned food, I know some people can't ;-)) Using this method means your dog learns that hands near food are not threatening. The same approach when he has treats - only offer a small piece of food which has a higher value to the dog (hot dog sausage is cheap and usually goes down well :-)) Make sure your movements are slow and deliberate, and watch out for any signs of 'freezing' from your dog as he brings his head down over the food - these are the body language signals he's giving out that he's finding what you are doing threatening, and are the precursors to the growl, and then the snap. ON NO ACCOUNT ever punish your dog for growling - or you may end up with a dog who goes straight from the 'freeze' to the attack - and that is not nice :(

HTH

I work on the same basis as you Chloe, I firmly beleive that my dogs should give up anything when asked, you never know when they might get hold of something dangerous.
As I usually have older rescues, one thing I start with is holding large chews etc. while they eat them, so they get used to idea of me being close.

Ingrid

I have always taught him to leave thing when i say which he normally does, we have always been able to take the food away when we wanted with out any trouble.
I will do what you suggest, but is it a good idea to try and take the chew away from him even if he is growling or would this make things worse?

Hi Zoe

I too have a GSD and can understand what it is like to have to get them through these learning curves! At 6 months he is starting into his adolescent phase - good luck :-) - so you will need to be firm with him. I am not saying that you should hit him or anything like that but I totally agree with everyone who says that you should be able to take food from your dog without any problems. I think that everyone has given good advice and what I would also do is that next time that you give a treat or a chew make your dog work for it. Even if it's only a sit. When you give him the chew keep hold of one end yourself and that way he realises that you touching his treats / chews is okay. Don't let him have it to himself until he has chewed quietly and happily for a while with you holding it. When you do give it to him for himself make him lay down first.

In terms of taking the chew away even when he is growling I would say yes as that is what we have done with Os and he learns that if he growls he loses what he wants anyway. BUT, and this is a big BUT! you know your dog best. If you think that the growl was only a warning and that you could take it away without any agression or anything then do take it. If you think that it could make the problem worse (ie. your dog was very agressive which I doubt at 6 months) then don't take it but start with the other suggestions first.

If you really think that this is a major issue and that you are very worried then it may be an idea to try some NILIF but I really don't think that that would be necessary with a pup yet!

Let me know how it goes as I can definitely empathise with you!!!
Jayne

Hi Zoe

Have you tried "swapsies" - offer something even better than his chew (the hot dog sausage is a good example) in exchange. This means they will happily release any food in the hope of something even better. Then also give the original item back if he's been good, with lots of praise of course. I have a nearly 8 month old GSD pup, so I can empathise!

Also I agree with the last poster. NILIF - making him work for every treat or behaviour is a good low key way of reinforcing your positions.

Good luck.

Katrina

With my boy who was 3 when I got him I did the swapsies thing, I gave him a pigs ear then when he was tucking in, I threw in some cheese cubes and bits of dried food, I then took his chew away and rewarded him, with his main meal, he had three bowls, as soon as he began eating I would throw something more tasty into one of the other bolws, then while he was distracted I would add something into the next bowl etc,
One thing i DETEST is people who take their dogs bowls away without giving them a treat or rewarding them in some way, If we were quite happily eating and someone took our food away, we would shout at them wouldnt we?
Vikki

I think there has been some good advice above, I have one girl who is very food orientated = will even walk backwards on her hind legs (including around corners) if I hold food up for her and she hates giving anything up once she has got it. I occasionally give her her dinner, say a chicken carcass, then ask for it back she never gives to hand when I do this but takes a step back and her look almost says "take it if you dare" - I do, pretend to eat some of it and then return it to her with lots of praise at which point she goes all silly.

The only reason I insist on being able to take food from my lot is in case they get hold of something I don't want them to have at which point it could be urgent that they release it immediately

Christine

So what happens if you are out in the field and your dog has something desirable? And you don't have a treat to swap it with?

I'm sorry, but I regularly removed my dogs food when they were pupsd away, they don't see food as something to guard - they know they are going to get it back? They are DOGS, I couldn't care less if they don't like it that I take their food away...tough!! :)

Edited to say that I do not believe a dog should be allowed to growl at their owner for any reason at all... only under extreme provocation, ie illness. And I don't have to enforce that by punishment, its they way my dogs have all been raised

well hopefully if you dont have a treat, your dog would know well enough that he has to give things up when you tell him,
After all they are DOGS and although I wouldnt tolerate any of mine biting growling etc is their way of communicating!
Vikki

i think if youve gone about bringing them up to have no doubt that your the one in charge then its unlikely theyd ever try t on with you, you are after all higher in the ranking, i agree with chloe on this one, i handle them when i want- i remove from them whatever i want, and god help any that growled !!!!!

Ok what I ment was that as mine are all older, and I didnt have them as pups, then it wouldve been dangerous to bulldoze straight in their and take their treat then punish them for growling at me, so I did it the slow way, now all of mine know I can take whatever I want away from them and I dont need to treat them, so if by chance they did pick up something that I didnt wnat them to have, I would just say "Drop" and I know they would!
Its a bit dangerous to advise people who have a potentially nasty dog just to take something away when they dont know how the dog will react.
Vikki

Vikki - I don't think anyone was advising that....but if I had a puppy aged 6 months that was growling at me (that I had had since a tiny pup), I would assume I had done something wrong in raising him...i.e not spent enough time ensuring that the dog doesn't put too much emphasis on food. And, at 6 months, I would expect to know my dog well enough to know whether i could take the chew and ignore the growl ;)

Ok see your point, however unfortunatly people dont think about preventing the problem before it happens :-( now if this goes on, there just might be ANOTHER 6month old GSD needing a new home

I agree with you 100%. I would not expect to bribe my dogs to take something away from them. They have all learn't as pups, if I want it, I get it, no argument. That's not to say I treat them roughly, they know it is what I expect from them and I have never had a problem.

You never know when you might have to take something dangerous out of their mouth, you would not want a fight on your hands then to get it.

But this isn't helping someone with a developed problem. I would sit on the floor with him and his bowl, put a little food in the bowl, as he finishes take it away, add a little more, put it back. Keep going like this until you reach a stage where you can take it from him while he is eating and replace it. If at anytime he growls, no more food, walk away and ignore him. Don't be confontational at this age. No chews or treats until he is happily letting you do this.
When you do try with chews, make sure you don't snatch, just gently take them away, good boy, give it back. I assume you can do this with toys, if not try with a toy first.

He is at the age where he is testing you, they come out of it, but you need to make sure you come out on top.

Sandra

I agree that you should be able to take food away from the dog, but if you use treats for training, you don't have to keep using them forever.
Ideally the dog will have been taught properly as a pup, but this dog has a problem now, and to step it up into a confrontation is not a good idea, the dog has sharp teeth, and will win!

I would teach a good 'leave' first of all, but you need the dog to understand that it's not the end of the world. Making him sit for every morsel is going to make food much more important to him, and make him want to protect it even more. My dogs don't guard things from me, because they have no need to. They have enough to eat, enough toys and enough of everything they need.

I think we need to get growling into perspective here, it's just communication, and only happens if we've missed the other signals. My rescue dog used to growl if we touched him when he was sleeping, or if we moved our legs towards him (hard to explain what I mean there!)
I didn't have a problem with it at all, he was afraid (with good reason) and he had snapped on occasion because he'd always been told off for growling. Whenever he growled, I'd just say 'oh don't be so stupid' in a cheery voice, and made a mental note of what was making him growl and then taught him to accept that at a later date using treats and praise.
He stopped snapping within a week, and the growling gradually faded away. Mind you, that was a different type of growling because he growled and ran away, if he was challenging me I would have dealt with that differently.

You asked whether you should still take the chew away when he's growling. I think it depends very much on the dog. If you think he's just being silly, then just be cheerful, take it away, make him sit and give it back. If he's being very serious and you are worried about him biting, then try to avoid making him growl in the first place until you've taught him that you being around his treasures is a good thing, that it doens't mean he loses what he wants, and that sometimes he even gets something extra special as well.

At 6 months old he's probably just seeing how far he can push things. I do agree with others that you need to be firm with him, but be sensible as well. Don't get into any confrontations, and always bear in mind how he is feeling, you don't want to bully him into being a nervous wreck of a dog, you just want a partnership with your dog, where you work together for the best interests of both of you.

I know it's very confusing with lots of differing opinions, you just have to decide which method suits you the best and use that one,

Jo

Thx so much for the advice guys and gals,

Well, I Did as you said and started off by holding the chew while he ate it and then eventually let go, after that I went up a coulpe of times and told him to leave as I took it away, no growling at all :D Ever since then he has been fine.

Thx again Zoe