Hi all,
Just a general question that has been puzzling me!
How many caesarians can or should a female dog be allowed to go through?

The lady I bought my Chihuahua from, was selling her on as she'd needed a caesarian and didn't want to mate her again. The breeder I bought my second Chihuahua from mentioned that one of her Chi's had had three caesarians! Poor dog!
Any thoughts? Just curious, both of mine are neutered :)

My own personal view would be that if a bitch needed a section for a litter It wouldn't put me off mating hwer again, but if she needed one a second time, then that would be it, and I wuld watch her offspring carefully for5 a tendency to need one.

My reason for thinking this way are that that one of my bitches had two litters quite easily and naturally, and then 3 years later to prove a young dog I hoped to use on her Grandaughter I mated her for the third time. She had a lengthy non productive first stage labour, being overdue to the last mating (four days after first!) and had four pups (1 later died) be C section.

Now if I had the first scenarion first time round I may have put her down to a poor breeding candidate, whereas it was just bad luck, a small litter in an older bitch (6 1/2) who had not had pups for a few years.

trickey one. i think I would go along with brainless....one chance, try again but twice & thats it.

Thank you for your replies.

I was talking to a woman who shows and is soon to begin breeding, so is inexperienced. I explained about my bitch, having one caesarian and her owner not wanting to mate again etc.
The "soon to be" breeder was quite shocked at this and said "Surely it's okay to let them have up to 3 caesarians as women do."
She seemed to think this was quite acceptable?
Hopefully a compassionate and sensible breeder will guide her :(
It seemed a bit callous to me?

I to would concur with Sam and Brainless, 2 is quite enough.

On saying that it would depend on the cause of the first caesararian, if it was total inertia, then I wouldn't consider breeding from the bitch again as it could well be passed down to her bitch puppies. If there were other reasons (i.e. small litter not producing enough oxytocin for strong enoough contractions or a large puppy or a puppy presenting incorrectly) then another litter would be a possibility.

The proviso being on risking a second litter, would be that my vet would be informed of her due date and if things didn't go naturally then I would have an elective 2nd caesar.

I do know that it also depends on the breed of dog. The brac breeds are very known for c-sections do to the pups big heads and bitches narrow pelvic like the boston, frenchy, bulldogs ect. C-sections may be the only way of deliverying these types of breeds and without it the breeds would die out. I also no that chihuaha (sp) yorkshire terriers, and some other tiny breeds are known for sections.

ttfn :)

Don't know if what Dollface says is correct, but if it is fact, I find it worrying that a C Section should be the norm in some breeds.

I also agree with Brainless.

I have had one bitch who needed two ceasars. The first one was where she had a 2lb (Dobe pups are normally closer to 1lb) dead pup blocking the way, she had had five and there were another six inside. The second time was totally the opposite - she only had one pup and in my breed there is rarely enough hormone provided when there is only one to get labour started so she needed another operation. I would not choose to risk a third caesarian regardless of the reason for needing them

Christine

When I was calling around for a boston pup their bitches were all done by c-section (I called about 15 breeders) with only having 1 to 3 pups at a time (the odd would have 5). They said the most that they section them is 3 times, I asked the reason and they told me because of the big heads and narrow pelvic. Where I got Junior from they also raise english bulldogs and they always section their bullys, never had a free whelper, some of their boston's free whelped. I like the brac (bull)breeds so have talked to alot of breeders. When I was looking into the french mastiff I was told it is not uncommon for a section. It really depends on the head and the pelvic and people try to make the big heads which would be the reason for the sections. They are not an easy dog to breed or whelp, but I love them and if I could I would love to get into the englishbulldogs. But I don't have the time or money right now so that will just stay a dream, maybe I'll get one eventually. :)

This is what I have been told. I was lucky cause my bitch did free whelp but this last time I bred her was a section the pups had very big heads.

ttfn :)

Three caesarians? Some breeders are just plain heartless, or is it just plain old greed? I hope they spay their poor bitch at the third caesarian?

I had mine spayed after her C section, as I thought it would be such a shame to put her under the knife in 3 months (as I had planned to spay her after the litter anyway). As the C section had gone well, he agree4d to sdo it at the same time.

That seems the logical thing to so - spay after caesarian. As you say, condition of bitch allowing.
It's a pity the breeder I bought my Chi from didn't do the same :(
Perhaps if the puppy had turned out really well, she would have bred her again? Who knows? It would however have saved my dog another major operation.

Dollface
in my opinion, if it is the norm for a breed to require a c section then that breed has been bred too far. This is the sort of thing that gets pedigree dogs a bad reputation like those who have been bred so they cant breath properley or cant see without an operation.The showing fraturnity must be held responsible. If those who breed this sort of dog cant sort out these problems then perhaps that breed dying out is the solution.
Ted

Brachycephalic Breeds:
Affenpinscher, Boston Terrier, Boxer, Brussels griffon, Bulldogs, Japanese chin, Lhasa apso, Pekingese, Pug, French bulldog, ect. all these breeds can have breathing problems, and possible sections, now that is a lot of breeds to just let die out.

For having a section this was the only way my friend (human)was able to have her babies all delivered by a section. I truely think a dog having about 3 sections is not wrong, as long as they are spaced out. I do not believe breeding the bitch on every heat. Since there is a demand for these breeds they will always be around. It is the judge in the ring that says what is a good looking speciman of the breed, so of course evryone is going to breed to perfect the perfect look. I think if there wasn't so much on how the animal is suppose to look and more on the animal and what it is bred for would make a better choice, but since the look is what they want then the big heads, pushed in faces and square build is what people have to breed for. Pretty sad. The Boston Terrier usta be much bigger, took more after the terrier and less of the bulldog (the original had a white head and brindle body) now that is a big no no for showing.

Yes u have a right to ur opinion and so does everyone else :)

I happen to love the Brac breeds and always will, I love their pushed in faces and square build they are just adorable to me :)

ttfn :)

I dont understand why if the breed standards remain unchanged that bigger and bigger heads are encouraged, surely nature is telling us something when c sections, breathing and sight problems become the norm. I thought in fact that breed standards had been modified to eliminate elements of the standards that appeared to be damaging to health. This sort of breeding to please judges and to the detriment of animals health is just so cruel in my opinion and invites critisism of those who show dogs and lands those who want a pet with huge vet bills and lots of heart ache.
Ted

my bulldog had her first litter by c section in april, and i can honestly say i dont know if i could let her go through that again, i felt so guilty afterwards it made me cry, but she soon recovered, i have not decided yet if i will mate again, but i know for sure, two c sections is enough no more.