Does anoyone know how to persuade a collie with strong chase instincts that horses are not something a dog should approach? My dog is 14 months old and despite coming across horses several times when quite young she still insists on running up behind them and almost willing them to kick. I keep her on the lead when walking through fields containing horses, but the trouble is i live in the new forest and horses roam free almost anywhere in the forest. I would like to let her off when in the forest, like most other owners as she loves to run and has boundless energy but i feel that it is too dangerous because one kick to the head would kill her. She doesn't always respond to my shouts of no. what can i do without resorting to spray collars and keeping her on the lead?

I think I would resort to the spray collar. It would be awful if your dog got kicked and badly injured.

Hi Lucy, the gas collars do not harm like electic or sound collars though they should not be used on a nervous dog. The gas collars are simply attention grabbers but they must be used with an alternative important command like come. No is not a command to use nor be reinforced by the collars. If you use the remote type you must call your dog with a come command. If the dog does not respond the gas is fired and startles the dog so you call come again. If again the dog does not come you fire the gas again and then you should get a result. You must say the come command in a over the top way and be really happy to encourage the dog. For the dog it thinks the gas came from the blue when it did no obey your command. Dogs will only do something if they get a good result. they will stop doing something if they get a bad result.

Do make sure you use a long lead at first and do not allow the dog to get too close to the horse so you startle it with the gas.

A cheaper alternative is a can of compressed air to use for close proximity work. If your dog looks too closely at a horse you say nothing but fire the compressed air accross the muzzel of the dog and instantaniousely give your dog loads of praise and comfort. Your dog knows you did it but that you are not anoyed at it. Do not use it off the the lead for training. You can sometimes use it if your dog does not come to you when you call so you fire the air can and the sound reminds your dog you wish to have it attention.

Do you have any friendly horses near by?

What i have done with my three dogs (one of whom i have SEEN chase every kind of livestock u can imagine) is to introduce them to 'dog proof' horses.
I would never say that any of mine are 100% reliable around livestock, but what animal is? But, they now show no interest in barking/chasing/sniffing at the heels of horses!

Now i can pretty much trust them around loose or tethered horses (and unfortunately for me, no i cannot keep them on a lead in case of loose/tethered horses, as they are on rough ground/council land, are not meant to be there, and are moved around every night, so i never know where they will be, and im d*mned if im keeping all my dogs on a lead cos some cheeky b*gger doesnt want to pay for grazing!).
I certainly do not trust them around ridden horses though, the temptation is too great, with the odd spectacle of a person sitting on a horse.

See if you can show your dog that horses are just big animals that want to sniff at them. If that works, it soon takes away the curiosity value.
Failing that, i would say using a remote spray collar would be a good option, with a lot of dogs, the urge is there to go behind an animal and move it on by nipping. I have seen a previous dog of mine chase a horse and get kicked, and it was the most horrible experience of my life!

Em

Your collie sounds so much like my BSD - and we walk lots in the New Forest so I had to get her sorted with the horses, too.

Being a collie, have you tried using her fav. toy to keep her with you? Most collies will as you know get to love their toys so much that it matters more than anything else.

I used a Kong on a rope, and this was used only for special occasions. It was a "what a clever girl" reward, probably got thrown 5 times maximum during the walk. If you can do this, then you will have her under control. But make sure she does't start to manipulate you and run towards horses so you are forced to chuck the toy :D as bright dogs will do this.

If that happens just walk away in disgust and ignore, she will realise that is not the way.

Also teach a good Leave it, again with the toy as a reward, then if she DOES start to chase, you can give a command she will respond to. General obedience will also help.

If you want to do agility with her at all, I know a superb trainer who would be ideal.

Have fun

Lindsay

Obviously you are concerned for your dog, in case it should get kicked, however you should also consider the other consequenses of a dog chasing a horse.
I was out hacking and a spaniel leapt over the garden wall, chased my horse who bolted in fear, fell on the road & was badly injured. I had fractured shin. On another occassion, the horse (which by now was afraid of strange dogs!) was chased by a collie out for a walk with its owner, fell over trying to escape the dog, I ended up with a broken collar bone, horse skinned its legs badly. So your responsibility is greater than just protecting your dog!

Re forest ponies, they are unshod and damage would be much less than a shod one.
I suggest you find a local horse owner with a very safe horse (probably one that is used to hounds- why not try your hunt kennels) and just take your dog there continually until he is not in the least interested by horses.
I had a hound returned to me some years ago that had been allowed to chase horses. I soon broke him of it by putting him in the stable with my old hunter, and staying there with him all day until he was sick of the horse! Then progressed into the yard for a further day and then started walking him out with the horse the 3rd day. By this time he was so used to it he took no notice.

I understand your sentiments exactly as i hack out my friends horse (fairly dog proof) twice a week and i always get a bit apprehensive if i see a dog not on a lead. as a result I always put her on a lead if i see riders when out on a walk as i realise the damage she could do if she chased these horses - definately not good! I could probably use my friends horse for socialisation but was unsure what i should do once i got them together, should i take her close up or would that encourage her to get closer? I don't really want to use a spray collar as she is a very nervous dog by nature and i wouldn't want to scare her away from horses completely - this could have the opposite effect and she might get defensive anyway.

i think it depends on what you want your end product to be! I want my dogs to be able to follow the horses when I am out riding, and mooch around the yard without paying any attention to them.
Therefor I let pups meet horses from about 8 weeks old & as they see them every day they just accept them. However if I actually wanted to stop one becoming (or being) a horse chaser, then I would use the same methods I use for stock (ie sheep) training the hounds....make them afraid!
When my hounds are hunting I want them to avoid going through sheep and make every effort to cast as far away from them as possible, there fore they are taught that sheep are nasty scary things & mum gets very cross when you even look at them!!! If thats what you want with your dog/horse then that is what you will need to do.

just out of interest how do you train a dog to follow you when riding? I don't think it will ever be an option with megan but in the future i hope to get another dog - not a collie - and would love it to come out with me when riding.

well most of mine dont really start individually from scratch because each new youngster gets to come out on hound excercise (with 30 or so hounds!) and so follows the others! However, my deerhound was trained from day 1 on her own and I just walked her (loose), leading the horse up & down the lane for a few days, then got on and she still followed and that was that. She got a bit over excited on the 1st canter, but I showed her the whip & there were no further problems.