Is it my imagination, or is there a higher-than-usual number of postings about lax joints/slipping patellas/ hip dysplasia etc? I wonder if it might be a result of all this ultra high protein ( c. 33%) puppy food that some of the feed companies push at us to get the pups 'in peak condition'?

Any comments?

Jo and the Casblaidd Flatcoats

Not sure about the higher protein feed idea - solo was on 27% and came of puppy food at 6/7 months as he was so hyper... I have been adding lamb breast (on advice to put some weight on him), so maybe this high source of protein could be the culprit?

I have long stated my dislike for high protein foods be it puppy or adult. People always say they want to put “Body” on their puppies but what are they doing? They like to see plenty of bone but at what point does bone growth become excessive? Dogs are now “Mature” at six months old! Is this right? I have a dislike for the Junior Warrant and consider that this is doing more harm, particularly for the larger, naturally slower maturing dogs that it is worth!

Puppy foods are a relatively new thing. Up to a few years ago there was no such thing, or for that matter diet foods, Junior foods or foods for old dogs. We just fed the food of our choice from birth to death, adding or reducing the amount as required and our dogs did well on it!

Cleopatra, Please don’t think I’m having a go at you but why would you want to get more weight on your dog? To most people weight equals bulk. Anna is admittedly a very big Labrador and if you talk about weight she is well over 80lbs but she is not fat! I can feel every rib and she has a lovely waistline! That weight is made up of muscle! She can and has on many occasions cleared a 4ft fence with a pheasant in her mouth and has dragged a 12lbs Canada Goose nearly a quarter of a mile to me when she found that it was too big to get in her mouth! Three quarters of the dogs in the country are badly over weight anyway. Unfortunately there are so many that people now take that as the correct weight! Just stand beside the Lab ring at any champ show and tell me I’m wrong! Every animal, even the human animal has a natural weight and if a dog is getting a healthy diet and is fit then that is all that’s wanted.

Regards, John

Hi John,

No offence taken at all! Solo is very very lean, and basically too thin! He is a late physical developer anyway, and i was/am hoping to show him more consistently this year - but he hasn't got the weight on im - ie he isn't covered enoough for the breed. When i say bulk him up i do not mean make him fat, just cover him some more and then the execise that he gets will turn this into the necessary muscle. I hope that i am making myself clear! I am aware what a healthy weight is and know thatfartoo many show dogs carry too much - cleo is ideal, feeel every rib and see that rear too, with a healthy tuck up and double muscling - solo is not liek this!

Am i making sense?

Hi Cleopatra,

I don't think you need to worry about the fact that you are feeding breast of lamb to Solo. The protein levels in raw meat are much lower than one would imagine since a large percentage of it is actually water. For example, minced beef contains about 16% protein which is lower than a lot of the dried foods. One has to remember that the percentage protein on dried food packages is for dry weight. Breast of lamb in particular is a very fatty cut of meat, so I would not expect it to be high in protein in comparison. I would expect his puppy food to have contained far more, when he was on that.

Does this help at all?

Monty's Mum :)

Hi Jo,

I also think there are a large no of postings regarding bone/joint type problems at the moment. I would also hazard a guess at it being related to the designer foods on offer these days. However, I haven't enough experience to comment either way, really. Monty was on Hills Large Breed for the first 2+ years and was then changed to Arden Grange (the middle one). He has been very slow to mature, always looks the baby in whichever class we enter him in, and quite often looks skinny, despite always being fed more than the packet says! So I don't think he is very typical, judging by the many comments on here about never feeding as much as the packet suggests.

I am very interested to see the theories that may be offered as a result of your question. :)

Monty's Mum :)

PS Will you be going on Sunday?

He is definately NOT skinny Sue! I thought he looked about right!

Best wishes, John

PS I will not be there Sunday but I understand Polly will be.

Well, thank you for saying so John. :) We are quite happy with him at the moment, but he does have a tendency to feel a bit too much like a washboard at times! :rolleyes:

I'm looking forward to chatting with Polly again. I thought you'd also be there, studying the form for Anna's next playmate! Oh no, you still believe that Labradors rule, don't you?!? Doh!! :D :D

It may seem strange Sue that I've been a member of the society for around 20 years and I don’t have a Flatcoat but I've had Labs for over 30 years and have only just applied to join that society! Is it a subconscious thing do you think?

Yeah, definately! It's not too late to bite the bullet, ya know! :D

They are both such lovely breeds, it is difficult to decide which one to go for. :)

hope to see you too montys mum.if all gos well here with the oldies,

Great Terri!! I'll look out for you! :) :) Will you have Chase with you?

hope too take him,

This was exactly my thoughts several years ago. Never heard of the problems so much as when we changed over to these wonderful complete puppy foods with high protein. All of a sudden I was getting problems first time in 15 years, mine was with OCD. Never had it before, I questioned the dog food people and diet. Never really got any answers but then suddenly puppy food for large breeds appeared with a lower protein.

I think that answered the questions don't you?

Puppies were growing too fast for their joints.

Yes, I'm sure you're right, Yappy. People are getting obsessed with getting the pups into the ring as soon as they can after their 6 month birthday. How often do you hear people saying that their pup was born on such-and-such a date, so they will be just right for a champ show 6 months later? They then try to get a 'nice' rounded 6 month puppy who will stand a good chance against the 9-month old pups (or even the 12 month pups).

Then how many are finding a couple of months down the line they have problems? This is obviously compounded if they pup is allowed to hurtle round with the big dogs as well.

I have a suspicion that a certain brand may well be to blame, but daren't mention it!!!!

And I really don't think it's me getting a complex because our Gordon is still a skinny bean-pole at 10 months, and is supposed to be going to the show on Sunday!!! See you there. Monty's Mum? And Terri?

Jo and the Casblaidd Flatcoats

Hi Jo,

Yes, I'll be there. I'd like to meet your Gordon. :) And you too, of course! :D Are you taking any of the others? We'll be in PGD. Looking forward to it - I think this is my favourite show of all!

Best wishes, Monty's Mum :)