Hi, I am new to this message board and also very new to breeding, I am not a breeder but I own a Dogue de Bordeaux that is 100% family pet. We decided that we would have just one litter from her, and I got advise from a very reputable Alaskan Malamute breeder who is a very good friend. When i asked him the best time to breed he told 18 months or the 3rd season - whatever came first! My dogue reached 18 months first and she was mated last week. Reading all the posts on here, i am now worried that i have mated my bitch too early (alot of people are saying a minimum of 2 years). Will this have any consequences on her health? I approached a few breeders about a stud dog before deciding which one i would use and even though everyone asked her age, no-one questioned it! Comments would be appreciated, as i would hate to think this could do her any harm.

As long as she is in good physical health then she shouldn't have any problems. It's just that large breeds take a lot longer to mentally mature than smaller ones (although I still wouldn't mate until over 2) and she may not be mentally mature enough to cope.
Just as a curiosity did you have her hips scored? I have heard that Dogue de Bordeauxs are around the 6th worst for hip scores!
Bec

No we didnt have her hip scored! again this didnt seem an issue for any of the breeders we approached about stud dogs, and we got the go ahead to use a stud that is a world junior champion!! As i said before this is the first mating i have ever done, now with hindsight (isnt it a wonderful thing) i wish that i had found this site beforehand and maybe draw from other peoples experience. Although, we have had a complete check on her by our vets as it turns out her sister has wobblers syndrome, and she has been given a clear bill of health, although nothing official in the way of scoring.

A world Junior Champion eh? Now what, may I ask....is that???

Such a title is won at the World Dog Show :)
Lara x

On the continent they have junior champions and if it is achieved at the "world" show (last year in Italty I think) they then would be a Welt (World) Jr Ch.

Christine

I really shouldnt have to defend myself!! If you had read the first sentence of the post you would have read that i am very new to this, and not ashamed to say i dont know very much about breeding (although i am more than willing to learn...didnt we all have to?) If you want to see what a junior world champion is i suggest you look at www.dogue-de-bordeaux.com. I would have imagined that most breeders would have been more than happy to assist in enquiries as knowledge for even the most intermediate would suggest that the dogs would get more appropriate care, as opposed to pulling people up about silly little things that isnt going to help whatsoever.

It means it was best Under 15 month old at the World Show, which last year was in Holland! :D

by the way Bec, where did you find this information for the hip scores in dogues, would be interested to read it.

I think it was in March's Dogs Today Magazine. A person decided to hip score their Dogue and the score came back quite high so had written in and asked.
Bec

Hi Doguefan,

Last published breed mean score (like an average, but not quite!) for DdB is 23, but this is based on only 30 Dogues scored with a hip score range of 9-63. For info, 0 is a 'normal' hip, highest/worst possible score is 106, so the lower the better.

Not an expect and not sure of the number of DdB in the UK, but in my humble opinion a score based on 30 scores will not be representative of the true nature of the problem, as the people scoring will have been the most careful breeders.

Think it is important to get your girl scored, and to use a stud with a good score, to improve the health of the breed, but you are where you are now so all you can do is hope for the best. Why not get your girl scored after the puppies have gone, so you know the situation? Also, if you breed again, ensure you use a scored dog. Again, a sweeping generalisation, but would be less worried on a recently imported dog, as there are far stricter rules overseas for health checks than we have here.

M.

Thanks brihow collies for your unbiased & non-judgemental reply. This has been of great help, and yes we will be getting all her checks done after she has whelped or if she is not in whelp we will have her done asap. I didnt realise that overseas checks are more thorough and with this knowledge i feel a little better as she is the result of 2 imported dogs.

thanks again, L

Sorry it's in April's Dogs Today. Apparently 66 Dogues have been scored with a range of 6 - 80 with the mean being just over 25. Hope that helps and do let us know when the babies arrive.
Bec

Hi Bec,

Was it only Dogue info? Have emailed the BVA today asking if they have an update, as they are still publishing October 2001 info on their site and it would be nice to know the new picture.

M.

Yes it was specifically the Bordeaux. Malcolm Willis wrote the repy tot he letter but can't guarantee that he got his figures right or not! :D
Bec
P.S. Page 54 if anyone else has a copy :D

Thanks Bec, will see if i can buy that issue today :)

Hi Doguefan
Have a look Hereit supports what Bec has told you about the Dogue's hip scores.

Alison
Edited, because I've just noticed your comment your new to all this, when you click on the link you will be presented with ots of figures the BMS is the average score for that breed and Dogue's is 23, there are eight other breeds with worse scores than the Dogue.

No reputable Mal breeder would ever recommend breeding from a bitch who is under two years old.

Sorry but that appeared to be an accusastion to either that i am lying about what i was told or that the person who informed me isnt reputable. He has been breeding for years, loves every single one of his dogs and takes great pride in them.

All reputable Mal breeders adhere to the Malamute Club's code of ethics which states "Bitches should not be mated before two years of age .......... "

Welcome to the forum Doguefan :-) I, personally think you have mated your bitch to young and if you haven't had any of the BVA/KC health checks done then that is not good in my opinion but what's done is done and now you need to make sure that your bitch gets all she needs to get her through this whelping (assuming she is in whelp) in one piece. Have you got a copy of the Book of the Bitch by Kay White and J.M.Evans? If not you can get a copy via amazon or pets at home, and read read read :-) Good luck and I am sure others will add their advice to this thread.