> Yes you do as I’ve tried to edit something shortly after and been too late

Yep, I am renowned for my typos, somehow going dyslexic on pc keyboard, and hitting wrong letter or putting b instead of space on phone.

Clumsy fingers, don't know how people text with thumbs, and I can't easily see the predicive suggestions bar as I type on mobile keyboard.

Hi, I found the same with my girls re conflict between maternal duties, an attachment to me.

It is why when my children reached teens I put whelping box by my sofa, until then it was in my bedroom.

I used to find I needed to stay with her and pups most of the day to discourage her leaving them, though to be honest I rarely left them unsupervised in first few days until I knew Mum was careful.

Some breeders never leave the bitch alone with pups.

In some very heavy clumsy breeds even removing pups and only having them with Mum to feed, very extreme in my view.

Luckily my own breed is quite natural and medium size.

Sadly I did loose one puppy to crushing, after a slow long labour, both the bitch and I asleep exhausted.

Rails would not have helped, as pup was in middle.

A shock as this was a careful experienced Mum who had reared a large litter before.

Regards temperature, I too have found the temperatures often quoted as excessive.

I wonder if these are for cold facilities, where the ambient temperature is low, and for open tray whelping boxes.

May also depend on coat. Mine is a double coated Spitz breed.

I find room temperature much over 20'C hard to tolerate.

I use a heat pad around A4 size in 1 x 1m box. This box is surrounded by puppy pen panels, with a hinged panel secured over the over top. The panels are surrounded by cardboard around sides and lower part and sides of gated front panel. Then a thick blanket goes over top and sides to make a cave.

This then keeps out draughts and keeps in humidity.

I keep an oil filled electric radiator by the side with thermostat, which will kick in when temperature drops. A thermometer is on front if the pen door and I keep temperature at about 22'C.

I have found the pups rarely huddle or use the heatpad after about 4 or 5 days.

Once their eyes open, I switch the pad off in the day. At 3 weeks no longer room heating at night, but put the heatpad back on at night.

At 4 weeks no more extra heating.

Mine will be spending some time outdoors after 4 weeks even in snow, but temperatures where I live rarely go below 0'C, certainly no lower than -5'C.

Hope that helps.

Just to add I have usually opted for cool weather litters.

The few litters I have had in warm weather were more diffcult trying to keep pups cool, as air conditioning is not the norm in UK.

A useful thing is to freeze plastic bottles, and put them at the side of whelping box wrapped in a towel, shutting curtains to keep heat out. Take care with fans though, not directly on pups.

Overheated pups will be restless and cry, especially after feeding, as the effort makes them hotter. Their lips and tongues will be much redder than normal.

M’y pups are not crying at all.. only occasionally while feeding but they sleep and lie sates and content
They are on vet bed ans the room/air temp is 26.2 constant
They sleep sometimes away from eachother and sometimes next to . But hardly ever on top of eachother since 2 days ago
So I figured that means it’s all ok else they would tell me..

Sounds good, you might find you can gradually reduce the temperature to a more comfortable level for you and your bitch over next week or so.

Contented murmuring, twitching (activated sleep), and the odd cross squeak are all good signs, with steady increasing weight gain.

A BC breeder friend of mine, who is also a sheep scanner, decided to scan one of her bitches weekly throughout her pregnancy as a case study. In the last scan just before she was due to whelp one of the pups was totally in the wrong position for natural delivery. After a long discussion with her very experienced vet, they decided on an elective C section.

When the litter was delivered the puppy that would have been delivered first by a natural whelping, was not only in the wrong position but twice the size of a"normal" pup. Also the other pups were bigger than average pups. All seven were safely delivered & the bitch spayed as her ovaries was showing signs of damage by cysts(agreed before the C section)

Interestingly the pups were born with far more coat than " normal" too & their eyes opened earlier. The pups all developed in to "normal" adults & 12 years+ still going strong.

Not one for encouraging elective C sections, but in this case it prevented a very difficult birth & emergency C section

>Not one for encouraging elective C sections, but in this case it prevented a very difficult birth & emergency C section

That is verging on an emergency section because a natural whelping was planned but almost at the last minute ("In the last scan just before she was due to whelp") couldn't happen. The elective c-sections I meant were the ones where the breeder works out the litter's due date once pregnancy is confirmed and books a c-section for the day before. There is never any intention of allowing a natural whelping.

Reading through the comments I can't see any posts that could get the OP upset.
She was given advice, based on what UK members beleive is the correct information.

Just tagging on to the end of this "epic tale" (?) I know a fair few people in the US, cat and dog people, and when the discussion has come up I have often been told that ultrasound scans are so expensive that it is cheaper to x-ray, and that many vets don't even offer scans. Why this should be I have no idea, but it hasn't only been in relation to breeding. Ordinary pet owners who have enquired about having a scan to check whatever is going on inside an ill animal without the need to risk a GA have been quoted such high prices that they simply cannot afford them.

> Not one for encouraging elective C sections, but in this case it prevented a very difficult birth & emergency C section

I'd class that as an emergency/medical decision really.

I had a C section for one of mine after one pup born.

This was a third litter and bitch started acting panicked and there was a longer delay than I expected, trip to vet, and it was a malpresentation.

> Ordinary pet owners who have enquired about having a scan to check whatever is going on inside an ill animal without the need to risk a GA have been quoted such high prices that they simply cannot afford them.

That's interesting as until recently I had only had scans for pregnancy detection.

I recently changed vets in my new home town after paying Pets at home vet £960 for a dozen teeth removed in a 13 year old.

Two - three weeks after the extractions I nticed a meatball size lump under her jaw.

Took her to new vet I had been recomended, and suggested it could be infection after tooth extraction, as they had cut into her gums to get a root out.

They could not get anything conclusive from a needle aspiration, so scanned. The scan showed liquid in the lump, so vet concluded inflammatory tissue and an extended dose of antibiotics sorted it.

There's a difference between x-raying when there is a whelping problem or emergency and it's necessary to know what's going on to determine what to do - and x-raying routinely just to see how many puppies there are.

Of course in the first instance the benefits outweigh the risks. In the second, the risks outweigh the benefits.