Just had a visit from a new to area RSPKA inspector. They had received a complaint about some of my sheep being in a disgustingly dirty condition, nasty grey fleeces. Lolololololol er they are award winning Herdwicks, which have er..... grey wool. His reply was What are Herdwicks ?? Really ??

He is an ex squaddie & obviously his RSPKA training is very lacking. He tried to call me a liar, told me all fleeces should be white, then I pointed out my brown/white, black/ white Jacobs, plus my Dorpers(warned him about them as they shed their fleeces in spring)

He actually doesn't know any different sheep breeds & thinks all sheep are white (especially the black ones I added). Told him he was not welcome on my land & have already complained about him to his organisation. He wanted to get close up & handle my lambing ewes, which I refused, but did take him into my "Tup" pasture & he beat a very hasty retreat, when my'lads' approached him. I dont thing will be very successful here in sheep country if he's frightened of a few laid back tups. Now if it had been my ewes they would have instinctive protect mode & given him a real reason to leg it.

I know who made the report, some dog walkers who ambled across my land(no rights of way exist), who a neighbour saw with their dogs running around out of control in one of my fields next to my field with my Herdwicks in. Thank goodness for thick hawthorne hedges that kept the dogs away from the sheep & prevented the walkers getting into the field. They screamed abuse at him & told him they would be reporting the dirty sheep. Interesting he got them & their dogs on his phone on video-he might be nearer 90 than 70 but he a canny fella

Fgs I am townie but sounds like I have more knowledgde than him . So glad those dog weren't able to.get to your sheep . What a terrible thought. Great neighbours though
Hope someone sensible takes over ,maybe some more.training needs to be sorted :)

Reminds me of a story told to me by a friend who's sister in law had the SPCA at her door about her matted and non groomed dirty dogs, she owns shows and breeds Komodors they look like old fashioned clippy mats she had to show the inspector her the KCS brewed standards to get her to go away but she made a not of the house having this breed to stop more calls

Seriously thinking of getting a couple of flock guards for my sheep for protection from Pet dogs. Have a friend in Dorset who has had to use them, especially during the tourist season.. He has no rights of way or paths over his land like me, so there should be no one walking with or without dogs in the fields. He has Turkish Akbash from working stock in Turkey. They successfully saw off several sets of pet dogs last year & he has some youngsters just ready to start bonding with their flocks/herds.

He also supplies them to charity that operates in Africa protecting endangered big cats(like cheetahs). They use the dogs to protect the goats etc from big cat attacks & stop the farmers hunting down the big cats. Win win all around, the goats live, the big cats live & the dogs do what they are mean to do chase off predators usually without any damage to either animal.

Will only need a couple of them as I only have a small flock, one for ewes & one for tups. Now is a good time to introduce them so they can bond with the lambs & then then the flock. I bet the Labs that were in the field this weekend wouldnt have stopped around for long. An Akbash in full flight is very impressive !

Off to make a phone call

The RSPKA or similar have no right of enter to any property & need to get the police to get a warrant to get into properties with the police. Good job the local bobbies are all from farmer/shepherd families, they keep them inline, had a bit of craic with local bobby a few minutes ago, he had a big laugh & will be having a word in the appropriate ear.

Don't think he'll be around for long, if he's frightened of sheep, think the Belgian Blues up the road would cause him to have a heart attack they are huge

It’s awesome that they send someone out to investigate reports (they can’t tell if there’s genuine neglect or cruelty just from a report) but you’d think they’d send someone who knows a bit about the animal(s) in question!

I know next to nothing about sheep but it took me all of 30 seconds with Wikipedia to confirm that yep, Herdwicks are grey. (Not that I doubted you for a second Tommee, but I was curious about them and wanted to find out more.)

> Will only need a couple of them as I only have a small flock, one for ewes & one for tups. Now is a good time to introduce them so they can bond with the lambs & then then the flock.

Would this dog require fencing - i.e. once let out to do its job of guarding the sheep, will there be a need to secure the area where the sheep are to prevent the dog from running away/chasing a predator beyond the boundaries of your field?

I'm curious because I've not seen dogs guarding sheep in the UK.

Have had a number of flocks here attacked by dogs this past few months. Sickens me, realise dogs can be shot 'understandably' for sheep worrying or running loose, but how would you stand legally for dog aggression or chasing someone walking through your fields?

No one has the right to be in my fields without my permission, before I purchased the land I had done extensive searches as did my solicitor & the land agents, because you can only access my land via a private unadopted road which has no public right of way on it, even to drive up the road unless invited or the police is not legal. There is a very visible notice at the gate to this effect.

My post box is at the end of the road,  bin collection the same & as I live off grid don't have mains utilities(electricity & water)so no meter readings either. The property was derelict-literally no roof, windows, not even full walls-when acquired it was rebuilt adding green energy windmill, photovoltaic panels etc, water from spring & reed bed sewerage.

I do have an intercom at the gates & get lots of people looking for directions contact me on it. The gates are electronically operated as well to stop people opening the gates & wandering up. Signs on all the field boundaries that the land is private with no public right of way. The stone walls are over 6 feet high with a further couple of feet of sheep mesh on top of that. All the gates are kept locked at all times. In this sad age of sheep rustling especially valuable rare & ancient breeds one has to take exceptional precautions to protect one's flock.

Flock guards are NOT trained to attack humans or animals, they are there simply to protect. & chase. Don't worry they do not fall under the guard dog laws & my premises are never left unattended. Appropriate notices will be erected & will contain english & welsh wording & graphic depiction warnings for non english/welsh speakers

The walkers had climbed over the boundary wall part way up the mountain & damaged the fencing to get their dogs over the sheep wire. They blatantly ignored the signs which are every 100 feet & climbed over within 6 feet of one ! They proceeded though my upper field climbing over locked gates(complete with warning signs). My neighbour had been out on his Welsh Cob when he saw them coming off the mountain(well it's a big hill really lol)& watched them descend to my lower fields.

My lower fields have very thick hawthorne hedges with sheep fencing both sides.

Not so much worried when the ewes have lambed & the lambs are grown & the ewes are not in lamb especially the Herdwicks & Jacobs, neither are intimidated by pet dogs & can be quite aggressive towards unknown dogs, so much so that when Herdwicks were used at the International at Kirby Lonsdale there were a record number of dogs that ran out of time because the sheep were too strong !!! Jacobs have never been used because they are extremely difficult to work(even singly !). It is the period between tupping & weaning of the lambs that most damage is done by dogs chasing sheep as at present.

The correct term is not actually flock guards but flock guardians I have just been told, not the same as a guard dog trained to attack & guard inanimate objects. I do have CCTV around the lower fields & in & around the lambing sheds. The Herdwicks don't do indoor lambing though ! Nice in the freezing cold nights, which my assistant/trainee covers. Good job I don't have 100s of ewes now

Get yourself a Kuvasz, or two!!    I worked with a girl who bred these, out in Canada.   She had one I'd not want to mix with, for sure (and didn't).  But I think he was slightly nuts in truth.

We have been having reports down here in the SW of dog's worrying Llamas (I think, could be Alpacas) which apparently don't come under the laws governing Sheep.   Why oh why do the few make having a dog a nightmare for those of us who'd not allow our dogs to get loose and cause all these ghastly injuries to animals.   I just watched idiot man up the road walking his two Labs down the road, not on a lead, while he was on his mobile.   In fact there was no sign he actually had leads for them with him!   This is the same man who drives by with both hanging out of the back windows of their car.

A past neighbour of ours who kept rare breed sheep, mainly, had a Jacob ram (tup) who I'd not want to challenge.   He got loose once, and we had to get him back into his field.    NOT easy!!

> The stone walls are over 6 feet high with a further couple of feet of sheep mesh on top of that. All the gates are kept locked at all times. ... The walkers had climbed over the boundary wall part way up the mountain & damaged the fencing to get their dogs over the sheep wire.

The walkers climbed 8 feet high walls/fence with their dogs?

> I live off grid don't have mains utilities(electricity & water)so no meter readings either. The property was derelict-literally no roof, windows, not even full walls-when acquired it was rebuilt adding green energy windmill, photovoltaic panels etc, water from spring & reed bed sewerage.

Sounds amazing, good luck.

Yes the walls are. Two feet wide drystone so can be climbed like a rock face, my neighbour was dumbstruck watching them, they broke a wooden upright off to make it easier !! The walls are that high because a previous owner used to keep goats & they can get over 4 foot walls the top sheep fencing leans inwards. It has been repaired.

They had walked over the "hill" were too lazy to go back the way they had come, complete with rucksacks & bivvie tents. Not uncommon around here

> They had received a complaint about some of my sheep being in a disgustingly dirty condition, nasty grey fleeces. Lolololololol er they are award winning Herdwicks, which have er..... grey wool.

ROFLMAO!!

Disgusting though, that an inspector wouldn't have had more knowledge.

You shouldn't have had to deal with this crap. You come across, on the forum at least, as a resourceful and strong person but I'm sure all of this has been very upsetting.

He was a "new"inspector to the area previously in a large city area. Had to laugh when he thought he could just go into the lambing area, was confused that some sheep don't lamb inside & that shetland sheep are much smaller than your average sheep, he did ask if they were "designer"sheep like designer dogs hm handbag sheep !!!

Can't wait for my Dorpers to be reported for being in poor condition, they will be starting to shed their fleeces in a few weeks & will definitely be looking a bit manky. He had no clue as to what Dorpers are lololol

Annoying more than upsetting, after a lifetime of having livestock you get used to people like these, the new council representative who does the checks on small holdings/farms like mie, tiltoldd me I should keep the sheep indoors in bad weather !  She didn't last long, been replaced by a farmer's son, who has at least been to agricultural college & does know his sheep. & farm livestock

OMG I'm a townie and although I wouldn't be able to identify a Herdwick I do know sheep come in different colours than white (perhaps the ones I see in the Lakes are Herdwicks? They look a bit like your pic with the white head and brown/grey body), and I certainly wouldn't expect to handle a ewe in lamb. How infuriating!!

Yes Herdwicks are native to  the lake district

Herdwicks are the breed that is probably the most hardy in the world, they lamb in the hills given half a chance & survive on the worst of land. Beloved of Beatrix Potter, eho probably did most to preserve the breed.

Had a half hearted reply from the RSPKA, who are looking into my complaint, they will be receiving my freedom of information  application on Tuesday, which will upset them even more.

If they send anyone else here they will be denied access, they have no right of access & will need a warrant to even set foot on my land. The public do not understand that they cannot demand to see one's animals & magistrates around here certainly don't grant warrants on "anonymous"reports to a third party to the police. So the RSPKA will have to name names & give real evidence if they want to come here. There is no "confidentiality"protection between the RSPKA & their sources.

My vet was here today for a look at my early lambs & have a free lunch, he nearly fell off his chair laughing at an Inspector being frightened of sheep. He won't be much use at the stock sales if sheep scare him.

Honestly why do they take this kind of job if their scared of animals.
I had a good laugh myself at the thought of him  comming across a Belgian Blue Bull or even better a Sow with a litter of piglets.

What does RSPKA stand for?

It should be RSPCA as it is Royal Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals.

Otherwise refered to as the R$PCA   

Er no with their track record of killing pets handed over to them & their secret continued support of hunting RSPKA as in Royal(Patron the Queen actively involved in hunting)Society for the Provision of Killing Animals is how they are known around here

He's ok with small animals like dogs, cats etc but new to rural"beat". Never met a ewe or tup before is my guess as he didn't know the difference !!!! Thought there are just "sheep"

Believe me I have no time for RSPCA but that is the abbreviation

> Never met a ewe or tup before is my guess

Unbelievably I once watched a quiz show on TV.  The contestant gave tup as his answer.  He was failed as answer wrong!!!! 

It took a farmer to phone in that ram wasn't the only correct answer to the given question.  Ignorant BBC.

Sorry if I sounded shocking daft- I obviously know what RSPCA stands for. I was wondering (knowing Tommee only though his posts on here ) what Tommee's abrieviation was.

You might refer to them by that abreviation, but the organisation as it stands today no longer fits it.

Hahaha there are rams/tups & wether rams, the second being castrated rams. The noun tup comes from the middle English tup which is the act of mating sheep.

I almost asked whether OP was using RSPKA for a reason ...... but didn't.    I'm assuming the organisation in question IS the RSPCA??

I have no time for that organisation either even if there are some good people who work for them.

Are there names for young sheep (older than lambs)? Like young cows who haven’t calved are heifers and young horses are colts and fillies?

If I had the time, land, and knowledge, I think keeping a few sheep would be rather fun. :)

Lots of names depending on the region the sheep are kept.

Common terms are

Gimmer-ewe lamb kept for breeding
Hogg/hogget-older lambs(around 12 months)usually destined for slaughter, but not always
Shearling-sheep that have had one shear, Twinter-2 shears
Thrunter-3 shears

The list is endless varies from county to county in UK & from country to country

Thanks Tommee, always good to learn new things. :)

In our area, a gimmer is an old fool, usually used to refer to a very old person who shouldn’t be on the road!!

If I had the time, land, and knowledge, I think keeping a few sheep would be rather fun. :)
Don't do it Or do do it and have some of mine! They are a damn pain in th a**e

> Don't do it <img class="fsm fsm_lol" src="/images/epx.png" title="lol" alt="" /> Or do do it and have some of mine! They are a damn pain in th a**e <img class="fsm fsm_lol" src="/images/epx.png" title="lol" alt="" />

It’s okay, I don’t have the time, land, or knowledge. ;)

I had two pet sheep for about 10 years until one of them upped and died as sheep are wont to do, so the other one (Mango) went to live with a friend and her small flock as I didn’t want to get some more pet lambs. The new owners had a tup who would visit the girls each autumn and he totally ignored the fat old ewe that had appeared in the flock until she was 13. The owners went to the field one spring morning to discover Mango with a lamb, they didn’t know who was the most surprised.
They kept the lamb and named her Mango Too.

> In our area, a gimmer is an old fool, usually used to refer to a very old person who shouldn’t be on the road!!

Come on now Rozzie!  No need to talk about Jean like that.          

Ha! I’m sure that’s not the case! And I’ll get there soon enough!