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Topic Dog Boards / Breeding / Would you breed from an older dog?
Poll Would you breed from an older bitch?
No - under 2yrs is best 1 6%
No - I prefer 2-4yrs 7 41%
Maybe - I think 4-6yrs is fine 7 41%
Yes - 6-8yrs is ok 2 12%
Yes - I've bred dogs 8yrs+ 0 0%
- By Jessica B Date 16.10.18 22:30 UTC Edited 16.10.18 22:34 UTC
Most breeders I know in Australia seem to think breeding younger is better than waiting until the dog is four or five, even though litters are accepted with a bitch up to eight years old. I'm curious if anyone has bred from an older dog and if you would do it again.

EDIT: Also, would you only breed from an older bitch if she has already had a litter?
- By MamaBas [gb] Date 17.10.18 06:54 UTC Edited 17.10.18 06:57 UTC Upvotes 1
I've voted on the basis of a bitch!!   I tended to use a young dog at around a year, to see what he produced, and to give him a first experience and then put him away to concentrate on a show career.

By 8 my bitches were retired and spayed.  So no, I'd not take a (second) litter from a bitch of much older than 5 max.  In fact I tended to only take one litter from my bitches.
- By Cava14Una Date 17.10.18 07:11 UTC
What Mamabas said
- By Gundogs Date 17.10.18 07:42 UTC Upvotes 3
For a bitch's first litter 2 to 4 by which time they should have had their health tests and proved themselves in the field.
For her second (and last litter) 4 to 6 would be fine.
- By JoStockbridge [gb] Date 17.10.18 16:56 UTC Edited 17.10.18 17:00 UTC Upvotes 1
My girl had her first and only litter at just after her 6th birthday. It was the last attempt we were going to try. Ideally I would have wanted her younger for a first litter, 6 would be last litter age for me (but then my breed is a long lived slower maturing breed) but we had some failed attempts, one where she just didn't get pregnant and she isn't an every 6months girl so she would have been about to turn 4 when we decided to try the first time.
In our breed club rules state bitches can't be bred under the age of two. So I'd say ideal age 2-4 for first litter, 6 for a last litter.
- By Brainless [gb] Date 17.10.18 18:14 UTC Edited 17.10.18 18:20 UTC
I'd certainly breed from an older Dog (male) but prefer to take a last litter from a bitch before 7 years of age.

The advantages for the breed from breeding from older dogs is increased intergenerational gap, and more knowledge of health.

The best combination is to use older males on bitches when still young (2 - 5), and prove young males on older girls of 5 - 6, helping reduce late onset health issues (assuming your selection is for positive health.

In the UK the Kennel Club will only allow breeding from bitches that have passed their 8th birthday in exceptional circumstances with prior approval and vet support. Also the maximum number of ,litters is 4. 

In practice in my own breed where we do not breed before 2 I have never bred more than three litters in the time available, given that I like to preferably have two seasons missed between litters, this giving 18+ months between litters.

I have had as little as little as 14 months and as much as three years between litters.  I have personally found a long gap between litters has had more negative effect than the actual age.

I could not vote as I think it is fine to breed from Dogs (male), 14 months+, and bitches of most medium to large breeds 2 - 7 years, and should have had a first litter prior to 5 years..
- By JoStockbridge [gb] Date 17.10.18 20:18 UTC
That was ment to say just after her 5th  birthday, miss counted.
- By rachelsetters Date 18.10.18 08:58 UTC
Mainly agree with Brainless - Older males yes - one of my boys sired at litter at 9 but bitches no older than 6 unless exceptional circumstances but not for a first litter (and definitely not older than 7).

Voted based on bitches!
- By JeanSW Date 18.10.18 18:43 UTC
I really believe that this is breed dependent. 

I mate my breed at the second season (if they are good enough) and all my bitches are spayed at 4 years old.  Most of my girls that have been bred from have only had one litter.  Although a couple had 2 litters, and my top bitch had 3 litters because the pups were so good.

This is a breed that carries 1-3 pups usually.
- By Lexy [gb] Date 18.10.18 18:58 UTC Upvotes 1

> I really believe that this is breed dependent.


Totally agree with that....
- By Brainless [gb] Date 19.10.18 15:36 UTC
From a purely clinical point of view breeding bitches younger is better as each season due to the long raised hormone levels, whether a bitch becomes pregnant or not (in fact they are raised longer when not pregnant)causes damage to the uterine lining, it becomes less hospitable for the implantation and forming of good sites for the placentas.

So from a maximum fertility viewpoint bitches would have their litters in fairly quick succession on reaching maturity, and then cease.
- By onetwothreefour Date 19.10.18 16:16 UTC Upvotes 1
With a stud, there is no reason for him not to be used until he is no longer physically capable.  The number of pups in his litters and his fertility may decline, but the pups that are conceived will be just as healthy - in fact, healthier due to the longer telomeres associated with age.  The other advantage is you will know that he is healthy and free from disease until a ripe old age and should pass this longevity onto his offspring.

With a bitch, fertility probably starts to decline from age 4yo onwards and the more cycles she goes through, the more stress on the uterus in terms of possible scarring or cysts developing.  So if you really want to be SURE of conceiving, having pups young (2yo) is best.  But life is seldom that simple.  Sometimes you might want to space out your litters more and perhaps you only breed to continue your lines and don't want dogs too close together in age.  In which case, many say not to have a first litter beyond the age of 4yo.  I don't think there is anything absolute about 4yo, though - it's not like until midnight before her 5th birthday she will be fertile and then suddenly from 5yo onwards it is a bad idea... It depends very much on the bitch, on her fitness.  I'd see nothing wrong with having a first litter into 5yo. 

I don't think I'd want to have a first litter at 6-8yo, although it has to be said that this happens fairly routinely in the US and there don't seem to be huge problems as a result.  And there is no maximum age for registering puppies in the US either, so bitches can be bred up to any age.

It can be hard to separate out what is scientific wisdom based on research, and what is social/cultural when it comes to these issues.
Topic Dog Boards / Breeding / Would you breed from an older dog?

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