I wonder if someone can help me.  I have 8 puppies (two litters born three days apart) who are 10 weeks old and just going to their new homes.  Three are not yet sold, so are staying with me until I have found the right people for them.  My breed is a member of the bichon family.

Ever since the puppies started solid food (at 3+ weeks), they have been eating Orijen Puppy.  Their poops have been perfect for all these many weeks.  Until about 10 days ago.  Before that, on June 1st, we made a test for each and every kind of worms, parasites, etc. testing the poop of ALL of my dogs, puppies and adults.  The results were completely negative, nothing at all was found.  But over the past two weeks the pups have started having poop which is simply too soft.  Not too frequent, but too soft.  No blood in it.  It is not diarrhea, it is sometimes formed (but cannot be picked up), sometimes more like a cow pie.  They have been wormed regularly, and, as I said, the microscope revealed nothing whatsoever.  Then my vet felt it was worth it to try a 5-day course of metronidazol.  No improvement.  It's not that they poop too frequently, it's just that when they DO poop, it is too soft.  Nothing like the neat little sausages they used to make.  Now, just to be sure that we are not dealing with giardia (which often doesn't show up under the microscope), my vet has given me panacur for a 5-day treatment.

But.....I'm beginning to think it might be the food, unlikely though that would seem.  I mean, HOW could it be the food if they have been eating that and only that their "entire lives"?  Has anyone experienced having the puppy food which was just fine for weeks and weeks suddenly becoming a problem?  By the way, I would like to stress that the puppies feel fine, are full of pep and energy and appetite!  I soak the food in water and have never added anything but potatoes in the hopes that this might help, but it didn't.  Not really.

I'll be interested in your comments.  Many thanks!

If Panacur hasn't worked, I think it is far more likely to be coccidia.  This is very common in little puppies, and will need totrazuril or an AB to treat.  (Typically Synulox or similar.)

Well, I only just started the panacur 30 minutes ago.  First dose.  We tested for coccidia, and the result - which came back yesterday - was definitely negative.

Could it be greed.  I have often found pups at this age have fairly soft poo, often first ones of the day are firmer.

Yes, I've noticed that too.  Also in previous litters.  Sometimes it has crossed my mind that maybe they are simply eating too much! 

Did they test for Giardia?    One of my two here came to us with this (we discovered after testing!).   Panacur didn't touch it but once onto a course of metronidazol, that finally produced negative results.   And I did have a couple done just to make sure.   Unfortunately this, discovered at the 4 months he came to us, left him with a situation where he'd produce firm stools first thing, but no so later on!   I had to put him on a fish and potato died (home made at first) aftert a short course of Hills I/D and then he went onto Arden Grange Sensitive (fish and potato) and has been on that for years, until, having made a mistake in ordering, I tried him on their Salmon and Rice which has maintained good stools - and it's cheaper than  the Sensitive!

This was our first experience of Giardia so I was pretty certain he came to us with this - I had my other hound checked at the time - clear.

It is a bit strange that the vet has given you metronidazole (powerful AB with known side effects in some animals) before giving you Panacur (safe wormer, non-prescription in the UK at least, and used even during pregnancy...)...

Personally I would always try Panacur first.

Anyway, fingers crossed it works.  If not, look up coccidia.  Our last litter had it and needed a course of Synulox from the vet.  I've got in some toltrazuril this time, bought in the US, just in case.

> It is a bit strange that the vet has given you metronidazole (powerful AB with known side effects in some animals) before giving you Panacur

Quite possibly because the vet thought Giardia.   But with 'no improvement' who knows.   And I'd want a test for Giardia, Coccidia, Salmonella et al before 'treating'.

Yes, but Panacur is approved for use in giardia - so you'd have thought the vet would have started with that...

My vet feels that Metronidazol is a medication which is effective and relatively easy on the system of the puppies.  Not only does it eliminate the bugs, but it also calms the intestinal inflamation.   It is also approved for use in cases of giardia. Since giardia do not always show up under the microscope (we have tested - ALL my dogs -  for it and for coccicidia twice within the last few weeks, both times with 100% negative results), my vet felt we should try the Metronidazol.  The problem (undramatic though it is, basically) is still there, so the pups are now on a 5-day course of panacur "just in case".  If this does not clear up the problem, I am going to change the food.  There wouldn't be much point in any further medication since there is nothing to treat! I have heard (here on the forum as well as in reviews on the internet) that Orijen Puppy can simply be (or become?) too "rich".  So I will stay grain-free, but change to a product which has less fat (or something).  Any recommendations?  I would like to stress that the pups are full of energy, run, jump, play.  No signs of illness.  But the poop is basically till too soft.
Thanks for your replies!

Yes, it is true that for some dogs on Orijen, it leads to kind of sticky or tarry poos - because of the high meat content.

I would recommend that you get some good quality probiotics after all these meds and try to replenish the gut bacteria.  That by itself could help...

You could try Acana - which is Orijen's 'sister' food, which is lower in meat content and tends to see less probs as a result.... it's made by the same manufacturer.

Thanks!  I've just ordered the Acana "puppy".  I'll get some probiotics from the vet tomorrow.  I hate giving all those meds,.

Probiotics - try NATURAL YOGURT .... goats yog. if you can source it.   This is a probiotic, and comparatively cheap!!   It usually works with 'uncomplicated' tummy upsets.

I'd recommend using Purina FortiFlora as a probiotic when you have tummy upsets.  There is some research behind this one, unlike most brands of probiotic on the market.

Allegedly, the dog's stomach acid is too strong for yoghurt to be effective - by the time the yoghurt gets to the gut, it has been nuked.  And some dogs also can't tolerate the lactose in cow's milk.

Thanks very much for your comments and advice.  I went to my vet yesterday and got some probiotic stuff in dispensers (the kind where you scroll back the thingy, measuring the dosage by counting the little lines.   Duh.  If you know what I mean.).  I have just given the pups their last dose of panacur, which they seem to have tolerated very well.  And:  I have changed the food.  I almost dare to believe that I see a change for the better, but I wouldn't swear to it yet.  They seem to feel just fine.  The Acana Puppy I ordered has just arrived by post.  And I've started the probiotics.  So we're now off the meds, onto the probiotics and a change of food.

Update:  The problem seems to have been resolved.  My puppies are eating Acana Puppy Small Breed, and they are eating it dry because it is formed in such tiny little pellets.  I gave them a treatment of a good probiotic (from my vet), and it is wonderful to see the little sausages again instead of little piles of yuck.

Next time I have these symptoms, I am going to try a change of food first and the meds second!  My vet agreed that that might be the best way to go.