For what it's worth, I thought I'd just update you on my battle with soft poop (my two 12-week-old puppies, who are still with me, and Rini, my 8-month-old bitch).  On Monday I turned in a 3-day collection of everybody's poop to my vet, who has asked the lab to check for absolutely everything possible.  We do not have the results back yet.  He said that in the meantime, I could put the pups back on a very low dosage of Metronidazole, just to try to keep things in check more or less until we know what's what.  So I did that, but unlke previously (with a much higher dosage), it wasn't having any effect at all, so I called him yesterday, and he said, OK, I could raise the dosage somewhat.  It seems that the dosage of Metronidazole is totally dependent on WHAT is being treated, so since we don't know yet, he wanted to keep the dosage to a minimum.  But he told me yesterday to raise it a bit, so I did, and I also started giving Rini and the pups the Slippery Elm, recommended here by (sorry, I've forgotten who it was who told about this, but many thanks!), and this morning there is a marked improvement.  I find dealing with any kind of diarrhea (never CAN spell that word!) extremely traumatic.

The pups and Rini are all totally fit, eat, sleep, play, do naughty stuff, no signs of feeling unwell....

Nimue, I don't get your vet... Metronidazole is an antibiotic.  If you want to make bacteria resistant to an antibiotic, you can do no better than giving a low dose over a prolonged time.  I don't see why he isn't just waiting a few more days to get the test results, it's been going on so long.

And he didn't even want to try Panacur, which is the no1 treatment to try for giardia, which your poop results from last time showed the pups had...

>Nimue, I don't get your vet... Metronidazole is an antibiotic.  If you want to make bacteria resistant to an antibiotic, you can do no better than giving a low dose over a prolonged time.  I don't see why he isn't just waiting a few more days to get the test results, it's been going on so long.

According to what he told me, Metronidazole is an antibiotic which works a little differently than we mortals suppose.  I want to check this with him further, though, to be sure I have understoood correctly.  However, if you try to find the "correct dosage" of metronidazole on the internet, you see very quickly that the dosage depends upon what one is treating for!  And in our case right now, this is what we do not yet know.  Yesterday I had a long back and forth on the phone, and I had to realise that there are things about Metronidazole which, contrary to my assumptions, I did/do not understand.

>And he didn't even want to try Panacur, which is the no1 treatment to try for giardia, which your poop results from last time showed the pups had...

No, I have never ever had poop results which showed giardia.  You must be thinking of someone else.  We will see now with this very thorough labatory examination if Giardia does show up.

assuming all tests are clear is it possible that a change of food may help ? certainly with adults this is the route people go down

>assuming all tests are clear is it possible that a change of food may help ? certainly with adults this is the route people go down

That's this vicious circle I am caught in right now, because if I change the food drastically, then diarrhea will certainly ensue.  So we wait for the lab results, and then if all is clear, I certainly WILL change the food!  But to what???  I am feeding the puppies (and all my dogs) grain-free/gluten-free, and the puppies have been on mostly chicken/rice or chicken/potatoes (canned), and for the last several weeks I have been adding some Orijen from my adult dogs (I soak it and grind it, as this is how they like it best, though I do give it to them - the adults - dry sometimes), hoping to "wean" my puppies off the canned stuff and onto the Orijen.
I'm stumped right now, I really am.

Rabid, I've just called the vet's again, and I asked about the Metronidazole in low dosage etc., and as I thought, there are many aspects to this with which I am not familiar and therefore not in a position to make any kind of judgement.  I just have to accept the fact that the vet knows more than I do, and he has - in all the years I've been with him - never given me any reason to doubt his judgement.  Naturally, as everyone can see by now, I am doing my best to find out why the poop is not as it should be, but I guess I am just going to have to be patient a little longer    At least they feel fine.

Ok, I just don't see why he's treating at the same time as running tests... instead of waiting for the test results.  Metronidazole is also a really strong med.  My dog has had pancreatitis twice when coming off it (very yellow poos, slightly soft but not runny as before treatment), and has then needed a low fat diet for a few months, to help her pancreas recover from the onslaught of metronidazole and lots of probiotics to get her gut working properly again. 

I really wouldn't want to give it to tiny puppies as it's not even licensed/tested to be given to dogs at all, and is used off label even in adult dogs....

I thought you'd said that you'd tested and found giardia - my mistake.

The lab results from the 3-day poop collection are back:  they found absolutely nothing:  no worms, no giardia or other parasites, no bacteria.  So, well.... 

I called this morning and had the vet explain to me about metronidazole here in Switzerland:  it IS licensed for vets to use, but there is no preparation especially for dogs, instead they are licensed to use the Flagyl which is produced for humans and dose it accordingly.  I must say that in all the many times I have had Flagyl prescribed for this or that dog (or puppy), I have never EVER seen any side effects.  All the same, I have gained far more respect for metronidazole and am glad I have learned more about it.  That is the purpose, after all, of this forum! 

certainly antibiotic use itself will cause soft poop, so giving a probiotic may be helpful.

I would stop the metronidazole as there is no bacterial infections and as brainless says get a good probiotic going asap. it might take a little while to get the ab out of the system too

Unfortunately giardia is really difficult to diagnose because it isn't shed in every poop.  But if you've taken in 3 days of poop from all pups and mum(?), then you'd have thought someone would be shedding cysts...

Is everyone just eating too much??  Too much food can cause the squits... How soft is the poo?

I'd still work on those digestive enzymes. They will have been hammered by the strong meds.

I will indeed do this.  I have a probioticum and I also have the slippery elm.

> .  I find dealing with any kind of diarrhea (never CAN spell that word!) extremely traumatic.<br />

Oh you mean dire rear.      

>Oh you mean dire rear.

Dire rear indeed, and I shall spell it this way from now on! 

Nimue, I just could not resist this and as you are a musician I'm sure you will appreciate  !

Child announcing her programme at a music competition proudly invited us to hear her rendering of a piece by 'Dire Belly'

Diabelli of course but we were all' in stitches'

Great! 

>'..value floats free of worth and settles on the most unlikely things...'

I just love this.  Where did you find it?