Pups are thriving and have all crossed the 1kg mark in their first week. However, something strange is a foot...

I left the whelping room to go to the loo having left 6 puppies suckling and 1 fast asleep. (Room temp is 26.9 degrees with fan and AC on in the lounge and conservatory to help cool things down.)

On my return, mum was laying spread out in the middle of the lounge floor with the puppy who had been sleeping (and missing her feed) suckling! She's obviously brought it with her but I have never heard or read of this behaviour before. I know mums move pups to more secure, darker, quieter dens but never out in the open. The other girls vacated the floor space and took a seat on a sofa each and my boy was sat guarding the doorway. Its like it's an extended family affair.

As soon as pup fell asleep on the teat I took her back to the box and mum was happy for me to do that. She stayed where she was and then as soon as the other awoke - went to deal with it. Lounge temp is 23 degrees.

I know she isn't enjoying the heat at all but obviously I am doing all I can to keep the room cool and apart from turning the ceiling fan on in the room itself, I have all the other fans on  and am trying to circulate cooler air. But to feel comfortable enough to spread out in the middle of a large room with a pup?

What on earth is going on? When she came to me at death's door, 3 years ago, my other girl took over the parenting of her then, 2 week old pups. All she did was the feeding - the other girl did everything else so that recovery could take place. Does she remember this? Is she feeling comfortable enough to bring out her pups at just over a week old because of this?

She isn't stressed, isn't worried, is eating and eliminating properly, is happy to sit beside the box/in the box/away from the box.

I have kept the gang away from the whelping room and thankfully, I can now leave the double doors open without them trying to go over to see what is happening in the other room. Has anyone experienced anything similar? I can't find behaviour like this mentioned anywhere...

When she came to me at death's door, 3 years ago, my other girl took over the parenting of her then, 2 week old pups

Breeding from a rescue dog ???

I have a small group of girls. Although three of them would not tolerate another dog anywhere near their precious bundles for the first two to three weeks one of my girls insisted on bringing her newborns out the whelping box to "meet the family". She is quite a show off, both in the ring and in general and I almost believe she was "showing off" her babies. She carried them all out, one at a time,allowed the other girls to have a look and then very calmly took them back. Although at the time I was really panicky about it all, she seemed really stressed when I was trying to stop her, and once introductions had been made she settled into being the most devoted mommy.

Totally bizarre...

Nope....Not a rescue dog and please don't judge before you know the facts. Actually, please do not involve yourself in this thread.

For the benefit of others - my girl is a working dog, K.C registered, Hipscored 3:4, elbow scored 0, DM tested clear, Eye tested annually.

There are numerous reason Kenny why a dog might not be in the prime of health. Don't jump to conclusions.

Thank you Darwinawards, that has made me stress less as I was wondering why she happily lay there when all literature points to a bitch wanting to keep pups secluded, safe and bond with them. Will just watch her and see how she goes..

Actually, please do not involve yourself in this thread.

When did you purchase this forum ?

Only asked a question, did you spot the question marks.

You have a tendancy to take threads off point and wind members up...

I didn't purchase this thread or this forum but as the OP, I think it fair to ask you not to get involved.

Apologies for being off topic, I'll re-phrase the question.

Breeding from a dog who was at deaths door, 3 years ago with 2 week old pups ???

I get it gsdowner and well done to you for taking in a neglected dog and making it whole, the behaviour is a bit strange and I guess it's alright if your girl is fine with it, my worry would be other bitches taking too much interest but you are obviously on the ball!

My girl came from a reputable breeder who suffered a stroke in the run up to the week before she whelped. Sadly the dogs took a back seat whilst the family took care of their mother. My girl whelped on her own to two dead pups and two live ones in an old lean-to connected to the kitchen over night. She was discovered in the morning and it was too late to save the ones that had passed. The son had no idea how to care for any dog - let alone a bitch with tiny pups. She was fed normal rations of kibble and tins when she obviously needed more and by the time the pups were 2 weeks old, had lost condition and was obviously lacking nourishment. The other 4 dogs were fine but then they weren't nursing.

Having contacted the breeder for a pup from that litter well in advance of the mating taking place, awaiting the call to say they had been born, not getting that call and then calling myself in case she had decided we weren't suitable, I found she had had a stoke, I purchased my girl and the pups outright from the son (who was desperate to be rid of all of the dogs) as the mother would be going to a care home if she survived. Sadly, she didn't make it.

So yes my girl was suffering when she came to me, yes she needed feeding and building up to bring her back to peak condition and yes she is happy, contented, healthy and in prime condition now. I have waited 3 years before breeding her and have had the support of my vet and the stud dog owner. She is fully health tested and of good working stock.

Now that I have justified my actions...may we get back to the original question please?

Apologies I'll jog on now.

2 pups and 2 weeks of normal/low rations = deaths door. That does surprise me as we clearly aren't talking about a toy / mini breed (1kg first week).

You are confusing her last litter with her recent one. The new pups have put on a kilo in a week. Her last litter was 3 years ago.

> 2 pups and 2 weeks of normal/low rations = deaths door. That does surprise me as we clearly aren't talking about a toy / mini breed (1kg first week).

My bitches are straight onto 4 times their normal rations after whelping.

My most recent bitch that whelped in April wasn't eating well in the last week two weeks of pregnancy (probably only normal rations) and looked like a hat rack at whelping, so lord knows how she would have looked after two weeks, and that's just a medium breed.

She is now in lovely bodyweight, but it took a few weeks to get her weight back up, even though now with pusp nearly 12 weeks she is as bald as a coot (post partum moult).

You are confusing her last litter with her recent one. The new pups have put on a kilo in a week. Her last litter was 3 years ago.

Sorry I'm confused, top of the page current litter.

Pups are thriving and have all crossed the 1kg mark in their first week. However, something strange is a foot...

I just assumed that  survival/ starvation vs maternal instincts would result in no milk/ litter abandoned.

What part of  "When she came to me at death's door, 3 years ago, my other girl took over the parenting of her then, 2 week old pups" don't you understand ?

Kenny, please stop trying to disrupt this thread.  There is no reason for you to be so waspish and it most certainly isn't anyone elses business what the history of anybody elses dogs is.

Have you not got a story of your own to tell?

With my girls current litter (toy breed). She moved her puppies from my specially adapted utility room, with heat lamp, heat pad and covered whelping box, into the kitchen and my then 5 month old puppies bed. I took them back and she just brought them through again. No accounting for taste. She never went back to her special place. Just shows, they have a mind of their own.

I also have a toy breed.  I had a girl in the living room with my normal set up.  4ft crate with double thickness box inside 24" x 18" x 18" and box covered with a blanket.  Crate left opened so mum can come and go as she pleases.  I only allow pups out to meet other dogs when they are able to get over the lip of the crate.  With such a tiny breed they literally stand on back legs, look over the lip, and throw their heads over to tumble out!  It's a sight to watch.

However, I had let my bitch out to go up the garden, and on return a dog forced her way in to the puppy room.  It was a bitch from this girls' first litter.  She got in with the pups.  Mum followed her and gave her a kiss.  These 2 bitches stayed together throughout the pups time.  One wanted to be with mum.  And mum didn't mind!  I was gobsmacked, but believe in only interfering when necessary.  So I agree Lynne, they have a mind of their own. 

Well we had a thunder storm today and my lot don't bat an eyelid but mum came tearing through the lounge growling and barking at the conservatory doors when the first clap went. Then she calmly went to check on the pups, saw they were all asleep and went back to snooze on my bed.

I am literally the only numpty who sits with the pups all day. she comes in, feeds, cleans, checks and goes off to do her own thing and each time she looks at me like I'm loopy.

Even now, pups fed and off she goes again...

Well we had a thunder storm today and my lot don't bat an eyelid but mum came tearing through the lounge growling and barking at the conservatory doors when the first clap went. Then she calmly went to check on the pups, saw they were all asleep and went back to snooze on my bed.

I am literally the only numpty who sits with the pups all day. she comes in, feeds, cleans, checks and goes off to do her own thing and each time she looks at me like I'm loopy.

Even now, pups fed and off she goes again...

Your the ideal babysitter in her eyes

Haha that sounds just like my Hetty. By the time they were 2 or 3 weeks old, even if they cried she would look hopefully at me as if to say 'isn't it your turn to deal with them?' before getting up from her comfy nap and getting back in.

It's true you know - she looks at me and I bet she thinks...'you did this to me..I popped 'em, now you deal with them!'

My girl was with the pups 24/7 the first week, but from the start of week 2, she is happy to sit outside the box on her bed and hop in to feed and clean.  She does this by herself though, I don't need to tell her.

she looks at me and I bet she thinks...'you did this to me..I popped 'em, now you deal with them!' Re the temperature, I'd not say where you have them is unduly high - newborn puppies can't regulate their own temperature so we had ours at around 80F in old money, with a brood lamp.   After a week, some mums didn't want to be with the litter 24/7 but they couldn't get out into another room, just out of the box itself.   And none offered to take a puppy out of the box!!   This would bother me.   Not only because of the puppy or those left behind with what could be insufficient warmth, but being amongst the others - you were lucky!!

I had one who was a right madam.   Not only would she pee them, but have nothing to do with the other, resulting in me having to stimulate them - not very successfully so often the poor dears were quite uncomfortable, but she'd want out after feeding them which meant once we'd added the second half of the box which had a door which had to be opened for her to get out, we'd let her out and she'd sit outside the box squeeking at them which woke them all up again!     She only had the one litter!   And thankfully this happened shortly before weaning began so she only went in to clean up after a feed, and back out, and out of the room afterwards.

"she looks at me and I bet she thinks...'you did this to me..I popped 'em, now you deal with them!' "

Are you sure she's not A BASSET!!!

> even if they cried she would look hopefully at me as if to say 'isn't it your turn to deal with them?' before getting up from her comfy nap and getting back in.

Love it!

Since the storm broke yesterday, the temperature has come down and the box was at 22 degrees. they seem happy with this and mum is more comfortable too. She is sitting next to the box or in the doorway. She too, like Rabid's girl, is happy to pop in to feed, clean and check on them but doesn't want to be isolated from the others too long...sitting in the doorway seems to be the happy medium.

No more puppies lifted out and paraded thankfully.

I have turned the heat pad back on as the wee beasties were snuggling for the first time last night, so it was on and a couple migrated toward it but the rest were happier with it a little cooler. It's the only thing I really worry about as they do scream murder if the temperature goes up even a little outside...

She is defininitely not a basset but I do think these working girls like to milk the fact that they are on maternity leave - sleeping on beds in a strict no no  and so is getting on furniture but they do like to take advantage...give them an inch and they take a couple of football fields!

This is exactly what my girl has done before!  In between times, she comes to me for a pick up and snuggle!  Whenever anyone comes to see the pups, she races to the bed and turns to look at me as if to say "Are they OK to look at them Mum?"  and once I say it's OK, she's fine LOL

They aren't daft these dogs of ours, are they? xxx

My dogs mum took me gently by the wrist and led me over to see her puppies when they were five weeks old. I guess she had decided I was ok for one of her babies.

My girl is still in the box a lot - more than out of it.  I think she finds getting swollen boobs hurts, so she opts to stay in there with the little milking machines!!!

I think my girl is letting down milk but not filling up. She is happier out of the box and I am letting her get on with it. If however, I think the pups need a top up, I gently wake one up and the noise usually get her in there pronto :)

We are beginning to open eyes today and I'm not as bad as they initially thought!

What Day are you on now gsdowner?  Mine are 11 days, are yours 4 days older??  Can't remember...

mine will be 2 weeks old tomorrow, except 2 who will be 2 weeks thursday :)

all eyes open except 2.

Are you finding the characters showing yet gsdowner? Love to hear about them all as they grow.

They are now beginning to interact with mum, each other and me.

There are a couple of cuddlers, a loner, a squealer, a couple of greedy guts, a tiny sleepy head

Black Girl - calm, quiet, loner, falls asleep in your hand
Brown Girl - tiny, spends all her time sleeping, usually found under the vet bed, needs to be latched on or misses feeds and even then falls asleep suckling and needs waking up!
Green Boy - has a lot to say, enjoys cuddling his siblings - me not so much, usually burrows under the vet bed
Pink Girl - squealer, Greedy guts, already using hind legs, self assured, has to talk when drinking/being cleaned/getting wedged behind mum/lolloping on siblings...
Blue Boy - easy going, likes a cuddle with me, falls asleep feeding then wakes and sucks furiously (repeatedly), Squeals when stuck behind mum - which is at least twice a day
Purple Girl - another greedy guts, enjoys cuddles - especially with Pink Girl or Green Boy, feeds upside down
Red Girl - another one who falls asleep when feeding, really enjoys cuddles with mum and can usually be found asleep with her head against mum's nose or between her forelegs.

After phenomenal weight gain during the first week - they are now only gaining around 10-15 grams a day (last night brown girl only gained 2g since the day before). I am not obsessed with it and as long as they gain something I am happy but would like to see them gaining a bit more to be honest.

We are only 3 days behind you then, and no eyes open here yet!

They all sound lovely! Purple girl feeding upside down what a picture!