I haven't posted before but have been keeping an eye on things just wanted to wish you and your girl good luck!

If a pup is close, she needs oxytocin and calcium first. I wouldn't rush in and do a section. Chances are she doesn't need one.

>Green fluid is very very normal,between puppies!! Abnormal before any pups have been  born but completely normal after first pup

Between puppies?  Maybe I have not been observant enough in 43 litters.  Before the first pup there is no green fluid coming out (which is why photos at this point are nice), but thereafter the green and red and black come out WITH each subsequent birth.  But not in between!  I would be concerned if green fluid were running out preceeding each puppy to come or while the bitch is resting.

Well gravity makes it run out as it is the sites of the placenta staining the birthing fluids green, and I certainly get it between births as I encourage my bitches out to the garden between pups to walk around to bring on the next.

I always have a towel over my shoulder to catch a pup born enroute.

No absolutely. I have had 15 so nowhere near your 43 but yes my bitches have always trickled out green fluid between pups, but as I said never before the first pup has been born. Never lost a pup or needed vet intervention :)

Well, that's good to know.  I don't walk my bitch around in the garden between births, so maybe that's why I have not seen this.

Keeping everything crossed for your girl and her pups.

Good luck.

Well we have been sent home.

I called my usual practice to let them know she had started and that we might need them to pass her history to the out of hours teams as she was taking her merry time. The vet insisted she be seen as the straining to pass the fluid was unusual. As we were going to take her in the car anyway, I arranged for her to be seen out back. When we got there they took their time in seeing her, she did a little straining but nothing massive.Thankfully I had taken a couple of old sheets and my entire whelping kit with me as we were just left to our own devices as they wandered in and out.

The two vets - who I can only decribe as 12 year old school girls - thought that a puppy seemed lined up ready but they weren't happy to administer oxytocin as the risks were too high. Conferred between themselves and decided she needed a scan and then section but we would need to go to the out of hours. They took an hour and half to decide this between themselves.

Drove across town to the other clinic. Saw the nice vet who said he wasn't going to do anything except administer some calcium as she was fine in herself, the green fluid was normal and not foul smelling and although a puppy was lined up it wasn't quite ready. We need to call back in an hour.

Since coming home she has settled back in her bed, had a drink of water and has strained a couple of times. Will keep you posted...

Will be thinking of you with fingers crossed.  Good Luck.

Gosh, I can't just be quiet anymore - good luck gsdowner, might be a long night ahead!

I am so relieved for you and thank god you have now seen a decent vet. I know it will be nearly impossible but try to relax everything right down and let her go at her pace... The stress may cause her to hold up for a while but a vet panicking about green fluid?? Really?? They haven't seen a whelping box in the middle of whelping then!

Thanks everyone - I'd be going mental without your support. My head is absolutely pounding...It's gonna be a long night.

If you can settle her and get the two pups suckling this will get her contractions going. Puppies feeding move things along

They have been feeding non stop apart from the time at the 1st vet's. She's straining at the moment. Everything crossed x

Good luck x

Oh my word, keep checking and checking the forum for updates. Do hope everything goes to plan and she has all her pups soon. Keep strong gsdowner.

Drove across town to the other clinic. Saw the nice vet who said he wasn't going to do anything except administer some calcium as she was fine in herself, the green fluid was normal and not foul smelling and although a puppy was lined up it wasn't quite ready.

Excellent. I have one bitch who is a really slow whelper. For the first litter I panicked and took her to Vets Now, where they gave her oxytocin and calcium and sent us home -I had been prepared for a c-section. The second time I just waited her out.

Good luck!

3rd pup born 9.18. Little boy, right bruiser and biggest at 401g.  Same as second, hind legs first, stuck hanging there for a good 6 minutes, had to use lubricant and push fingers internally to ease out. Totally covered in green fluid made all the more obvious because he is white! Placenta attached this time. Needed help reviving as had taken some fluid in.

Migraine in full swing now. Hubby came home with mcChicken nuggets (other types of nuggets are available ;) ) and I have eaten theM (had nothing since 2 slices of toast this morning) but now feel like I need to throw up :(

Called the vet back and the advice is to observe and then take back in an hour for a shot of oxytocin - she is basically going to be a very slow whelper.

Question: mum hasn't eaten since last night and has been drinking lots of water - does she need something to eat?

Mine never eat until they have finished...... That's usually a good indicator that they are all done:)

Mine don't eat unless it's a bit of ice cream or the placentas, really hoping for all good news from now on

Yes, as Mixedpack says they fill up pretty much on the placentas so you may no see much of an appetite for a couple of days after whelping. Even though the placentas can make the bitch loose I let them eat them all as they are a great source of nutrition and I believe keeping stools soft is easier for mum to pass when she's feeling sore after whelping.... Natures  gentle laxative :)

Puppy no 4 (girl) born in the car in the car park. Little girl 10.46pm. Shot out like a greased pig. Shot of calcium and oxytocin administered.

Puppy no 5 (boy) 11.12pm. Now sat on the floor in consulting room while vet contemplates an X-ray to see if there are anymore  and how many.

Vet palpated abdomen and declared she is done. Another shot of oxytocin given to clear out any remaining gunk and sent home. Cost of £174 quite reasonable as own vets has charged me £84 for faffing about and a scan!

Puppy no 6 born at 12.04am (girl) as we came over the bridge on the journey home. Kinda disappointed at there only being 6 when she was so big but then that just goes to prove that size of body does not indicate size of litter. HOWEVER, just so glad we avoided a c sec and that, along with our girl's well being are the most important factors of all.

After 2 pups we were told the scan showed 3 more and one of them was dead...we are now at 6 and thankfully, all alive and kicking.

I swear this whelping has given me grey hairs! Going to sponge her down now as I think she is done and she looks like she's been dragged through a muddy hedge backwards, give her something to eat, grab a quick shower and then spend the rest of the night watching her like a hawk....

Can I have a coffee yet?

Congratulations! I hope they all settle for a good feed and maybe you can get a snooze on the sofa if your hubby will watch the brood for you.

What a stressful time you've had, well done for keeping your nerve and avoiding the csection.

It's not been very long since #6 so maybe as I write this you're drying #7 surprise!?

Hope your headache improves now she's done.

Ha! I do think she's done at 6 :)

The whelping bed has been cleared away and everyone has moved in to the box in the study. My mattress is down next to it and I am sending hubby to bed now as he has to be at work at 7. I haven't taken any insulin today and my food has been at stupid o'clock too so no doubt I'll be in trouble when my levels are checked. But I am showered and cooler so much happier and the stress seems to have overridden the migraine.

Thank you to everyone for your support and advice. Couldn't have done it without you and there's no way I would have held my nerve and questioned the need for a section if I hadn't had your backing.

If I could send you each a bottle of fizz I would....except as I don't drink it'd be 2ltr bottle of R. Whites ;)

Ok spoke too soon. There was a 7th but sadly born sleeping. I tried to resuscitate, cleared airways, swung him etc but he was born completely pale - almost ghost like. She cleaned him and is looking for him but I think she will settle soon.

So sad to lose one, but probably he'd already gone when scanned hun. I did wonder when you said they'd seen one sleeping already, as I think it's easy to miss a whole pup, especially when in the pelvis, but less likely to miss a heartbeat in a pup you've found, if you see what I mean. And a relief to know he's out in that case.

Sort your insulin/eating out tomorrow/asap! (that's me doing my mumsy wrist slap) it's like a depressurisation on an aeroplane "adults secure your own oxygen mask first", they will do great and thrive as long as you're ok to care for them

Hopefully everything is settled and peaceful now.

Looks like we are the only two awake now!  Congratulations.

I hope you realise how many of us have been following this journey.    Sorry that you lost one, but I'm sure you are pleased with what you have got.  I know after whelping, however long I've been awake, I just can't sleep because the adrenalin is racing through my veins.  By day 3 I'm looking haggard! 

So very pleased for you.  Ooops just seen poodlenoodle is with us. 

Got up a little late today (6.30h!), got my puppies taken care of and rushed to the computer.  Oh, I am so relieved!  What an ordeal, but tons of respect for how you managed it!  And this despite the veterinary "advice and care" you received, which to me sounds shockingly inept.

HUGE CONGRATUALTIONS!!!  We've all been rooting for you, as many have said!  It was great to hear from Rabid too!  Glad she is still with us in the background. 

Gosh, your experience here has been so totally different from anything I have ever encountered (with my cotons).  I have learned a lot.

And now just ENJOY!  You certainly deserve it! 

Having cleared up after the ghost puppy I finally lay down around 3am ish but madam had me up at 4 for a toilet break and then one of the wee ones looks like she's a 'talker' as she hasn't shut up unless she's sleeping! They all seem to be good eaters.

I am really grateful for everyone's help and support. Normally I keep schtum about a lot of what's gong on and had things gone better would most likely have posted this morning just to let you know that the pups had arrived and that it had been a day long ordeal. However, I understand now why so many people post at regular intervals during whelping and I also see how many of you get swept up in this tidal wave of anticipation, worry, joy and sorrow. No one can deny that it is your love of your own dogs and breeding that has you up at all hours virtually supporting complete strangers, almost standing standing shoulder to shoulder in quiet solidarity and as pillars of strength.

I really could not have done it without you. Thank you to you all x

Great news for you and us, such as shame we are not allowed pictures, now you have time hopefully to take care of yourself for a couple of weeks while mum does most of the work, thank you for sharing the highs and lows of the whelping experience

I am so pleased for you, many congratulations!!

Ermmmmm you're not going to believe this.....but no 8 just arrived :) another little girl....completely green but alive and screaming like a trooper. I am actually crying...

Congratulations, you have had a tough whelping to deal with!  Sorry about the one you lost.  Remember your girl needs you so get your blood sugars under control and enjoy your babies x

Oh my goodness! What a crazy wild time you've had! Congratulations on your now 7 (8) little bundles!

Definitely get some food into you and check your levels today, and lots of little naps when you can get them.

It's a shame we're all scattered about, if you were nearby I'd be on your step with a box of bacon butties and a 2l flask of coffee!

OMG Gsdowner what a time you had congratulations on the pups and much respect to you for holding it all together X

Congratulations on your litter. I have been following all your posts.
Surely your vet has something to answer for. I once had a puppy arrive, alive, 24 hours after the last one BUT, that was my first litter and before the days when I took my girls to the vet after the event to make sure they had finished.
I was lucky with that pup but it taught me never to assume anything. But surely the vet should have know more last night.

I think that the only way to know if there are no more puppies is to have an x-ray, I had to do this with 2 of my GSD's as they were very lazy whelpers with puppies arriving over a 24 hour period with long delays inbetween and I think that some would have been lost if we hadn't definitely known they were on their way.  As a slight deviation the rate of C-sections seems rather high in shepherds, I wonder if anyone else has noticed this?

To be honest the only reliable way that a vet could know if there were any puppies remaining would involve an x-ray. I had a bitch self whelp 7 pups but I just wasn't happy with her. Took her to my out of hours vet, who examined her and said she had finished. I still wasn't happy and asked for him to do a scan. he said it would have to be an x-ray. To his amazement there were 2 puppies, one in each horn, she had to have a c-section as everything had shut down. The 2 puppies were fine.

Well done gsdowner! Congrats & I hope it all is plain sailing from now on for you, as you deserve it!!

Nothing happening here yet, although she is huge...

Hope you get some sleep soon!!

Just as an add on...are you sure that all the placentas have been delivered? I found with my last litter of 12 ,which took 8 hours, there were some retained placentas. It might be worth getting the vet in to examine her and give an injection to help clear her out.

I rang the out of hours vet when puppy no 8 arrived. He has basically said I should wait it out a little longer, call my regular vet and then take her in this evening with the idea of either getting her x-rayed or another shot to clear her out. The other option is to call my scanner and see if she will come and scan her.

Out of hours vet is very old school and openly admitted not having the foggiest about scanning.

Soooo tired now but too scared to even go to the toilet in case I miss anything.

Those bacon butties and that coffee sound so good and so far away....

Just to say, I'd have expected an x-ray to be done when I first went into the vet with her.   I also never wanted around if there was any kind of delay.  Much as recovery comes into the situation, for me having a C.Section means way less risk and if the vet recommended this was best, then I'd have gone with that before the bitch became exhausted, needing a C.Section anyway.   Green coming out would have suggested the placenta with that puppy had separated meaning surgical intervention was the best option.    Palpating, and giving oxytocin doesn't always tell the whole story - mine have had oxytocin which nothing and the vet went in.    I have also come home after being told the bitch was empty (no x-ray) and one was born at home - clearly out of reach from the outside, and moved too far forward to be felt via palpation.    But each situatiion is different.   So I hope all is well with this whelping now.

>If it were my dog, I would opt for the C-section, simply because I wouldn't know what else to do.  I bet Mamabas would agree.

I wrote the above a couple of days ago.

>I also never waited around if there was any kind of delay.  Much as recovery comes into the situation, for me having a C.Section means way less risk and if the vet recommended this was best, then I'd have gone with that

Guess I was right! 

So glad that it all went well in the end for gsdowner.  All's well that ends well....(they say)

Wow GSD owner what a journey for you and your girl. Congratulations on the arrival of 7 puppies  and sad for the sleeping puppy :(    onwards and upwards for you all from now on.... lots of tlc and best wishes hugs for you both. Enjoy the bacon sarnie

Good to see you rabid. Hope your girl is well?

Under normal circumstances I would agree with you Mamabas but when faced with 2 inexperienced vets and a senior vet who can't come out (for what ever reason) you do wonder about the competence of the decision being made - especially if they are wandering in and out of the room for an hour and a half, finally bring out the scanner, tell you their probe isn't big enough, that their fingers aren't long enough to determine anything from an internal and then have each of them decide a different plan of action from each other. The x ray was also suggested but at the emergency vet as 'they would know what they were doing'...

Emergency vet, although old school was authoritative, calm and knew what he was talking about and with a breed known to whelp large litters well, a girl who had done this before without help and plenty of reassurance, We were happy to see what a single shot would do. Thankfully it worked and she had 2 shots afterwards but the last 3 pups have arrived without help.

We are booked in for an xray later today and then we shall see what they have to say. I think she will need another shot to clear out regardless.

Phew. Just caught up with this. What a night you have had, you must be worn out and with your sugar levels out of skew, you must feel like putting your head down and having the longest sleep.

Deep breaths, relaxation techniques and a blood test sound like the order of the day now.

Hope the new babies continue to thrive and the little one that is sleeping now runs free at the bridge.