Last night I watched Animal Hospital and saw a poor pup with a very messy and infected tail as the result of an attempt to dock by an unqualified and obviously uncaring individual. It's not really the pro's and con's or rights and wrongs of tail docking that I want to ask about as I know that we all have firm beliefs on this issue one way or the other, but on the program the RSPCA vet announced that " It is illegal to dock a dog's tail now unless you can proove that the dog is going to be used to breed" Is this so?? If so since when?? I am particularly interested as I am hoping to get a Cocker spaniel to join our happy throng, with a view to doing a little showing in the future. I would be very interested to find out really what's what!!
Jackie

Hello Jackie

I didnt see the programme but it appears to give out total rubbish.
It isnt illegal to dock any pup but it must be done by a vet
you dont have to give any reason as to why you want the pups docked.

More problems will be seen as people will still dock pups themselves,most breeders can and do do it properly,but its like anything else if someone wants something done they will get it done.
If more vets docked then you wouldnt see most of the bad docking problems.

Carolyn

Thanks Carolyn, That's just as I thought! I do wonder how an organisation that is so huge and that has or should have, such a responsibility to deliver accurate information for animal care and welfare can so often get it wrong!
Thanks for your reply
Jackie

It was absolute nonsense! The law states that dogs can only be docked by a vet and does not qualify this in any way - ie it does not state that it can only be done at a certain age, or only if the dog is going to work. The vets' governing body, The RCVS, of which all practising vets must be a member, has declared that it is unethical for a vet to dock a tail unless the dog is going to work. However this is a code of ethics, it is not a law so it does not forbid a vet to dog a tail. Many vets seem to confuse illegal and unethical and state that it is illegal when it is clearly not illegal. As far as I am aware the only case that the RCVS brought against a vet for breaking the code of ethics on tail docking found in favour of the Vet and there are still vets who will dock.

As for her comment about 'unless you can prove you are going to use the dog for breeding', I can only assume that this was a slip of the tongue and she meant to say working, still inaccurate for the reasons I have already stated, but would have made more sense.

Hi Fleetgold thanks for your reply. I thought along the same lines and was amazed that the vet said only dogs used for breeding could be legally docked..............are we to believe that if we dock the tails of parent dogs their offspring will arrive with short tails automatically!!!!
Jackie

**chuckling** was half-listening to the program last night while doing some research and my head bounced up when I heard the pile of rubbish being spouted by the RSPCA vet and echoed by the presenter. My husband, being the wonderful man that he is, reached for the controls and switched channels as I growled about irresponsible reporting and misrepresentation by veternarians. I have little respect for reporters who cannot bother to verify facts and even less for people who knowingly and willfully misrepresent the facts in an effort to support their stance. Bottom line is that docking is not illegal if done in accordance with current legislation, which does not include the qualification that only dogs being used for breeding can be docked.

On a personal note, I would like to see the idiot who tried to dock the tail without any inkling of how tails are docked to be strung up and hung. Unfortunately, I also blame the veternarian world at large for their myopic politics. When medicine of any type (human or otherwise) does not stand free of politics, then we all lose.

:) Well said everyone! Its about time the RSPCA got off their butts and sorted out the REAL problems, not pottered about putting out half truths-or in the case of docking blatent LIES!
GOSH_that feels better :)

Doesn't the RSPCA's have an anti-docking policy? Maybe it was just a piece of nicely placed propaganda in an attempt to sway people into their line of thinking.

Call me cynical . . .:p

Thought the RSPCA was anti most things except spending vast amounts of money on lobbing and taking people to court who need help not punishment. I'm sure at a local level their inspectors do their best but while the managment seem to be hell bent on misinformation and inapproproate action toward people who need informed help, they will get no more of my money. Thats better, they make me so angry and it's not good for my blood presure. JH

Well said :-) Leigh

Why not give your money to the PDSA or the Blue Cross or the NCDL instead?

Well said! Jon and I donate money to directly to various animal sanctuaries and organizations. I have no interest in promoting the political concerns of an organization who has forgotten what their prime concern should be.

I saw a message somewhere on this messageboard which said that dogs docked after October would not be able to be shown?

I've looked at KC website and can't see anything on there - is it true or not?

Thanks

Welcome to the forum Kitty.

The October deadline refered to European Dogs and not dogs in the UK :-)

Leigh

We are Europeans aren't we. Just kidding:)

Speak for yourself ! lol ;-)

Does this mean that we will have Tails v Docks at Crufts 2002?
Jackie

Yep :-) Again

hear hear

I have to say I find these comments about the RSPCA extremely offensive. My father worked for the RSPCA for 35yrs and made many sacrifices to ensure that he did his job properly and that all of the animals he came across were properly cared for. During his time with the Society he had his life threatened on numerous occasions and was hospitalised twice having been beaten by dog-fighters and hare coursers. Until I was 7 and my father transferred to headquarters he was at home for 2 Christmases and 1 of my birthdays.

Every single officer that my father worked with in his 35yrs was as dedicated to their work as he was and did their best under very difficult circumstances. Don't forget that it is the courts that pass sentence on offenders - not the RSPCA, and the society only prosecutes if their lawyers are confident that they WILL get a conviction. With their limited funds they can't afford to prosecute if they aren't certain of a conviction. The RSPCA receives no government funding and is solely funded by donations and legacies.

Fiona

Fiona

Sorry. I didn't mean anything bad about the people who work for the RSPCA. I was just criticising some of its policies, that's all.

Sorry for any offence caused.

How are your cockers doing?

Kate

Fiona, the onus is not on the people who work for the RSPCA but rather on the administration who not only tie the hands of their employees, but also take on political issues in an agency that should be apolitical. I am well aware that the employees try to do what is right, but I would much rather see the RSPCA politicking if they feel they absolutely have to be involved in the political arena for things like mandated sentences for cruelty. The money that they spend on advertisements and campaigns against things like tail docking, hunting, etc. would be better served in a income-assisted spay/neuter program, education, more man-power on the streets so that perhaps you could have had more than two christmases and one birthday with your father.

My heartfelt thanks to those who actually work the streets.

I dont think that many people doubt the sincereity and hard work of the vast majority of those working for the RSPCA but one thing I do take exception to is the idea of the RSPCA having 'limited' funds. They dont they have more money at any one time than most animal welfare charities will EVER receive and I truely believe they should be spending more of it where it counts rather than just leaving it lying around.

Our local branch of the RSPCA is very definitly strapped for cash but applying to central funds is a total waste of time and effort no way will they help.So if anyone does donate to them make sure its to your local branch and not central coffers as thats where it'll stay!!!

I received an e-mail saying that if anyone had a complaint about the programme Animal Hospital to go to http:/www.bbc.co.uk/info/contact/com_email.shtml to put in you comment. I did it asks for the name (Animal Hospital), channel (BBC) and date (13.11.01)of the programme.