I live on a busy road and a guy across the street has 2 Staffies who he regularly walks at all times of the day.  They ignore me when I'm alone, but while walking from my car to my front door with my 4yr old daughter, his dogs went mental from the other side of the road at her!  Just like you'd expect them to react to a dog they want to fight with.  They were barking aggressively and pulling towards her.

As he struggled to restrain them a third dog of his (a Jack Russell type) came out of his front door and began yapping while running towards us.
Hyped up with adrenaline and paternal protective instincts at this point, I aggressively raised my fist and shouted "f**k off!" at his approaching dog which immediately stopped where it was. 

The owner came running over (his Staffies now in his house) and acted like I had over reacted repeating "they're harmless mate" to which I highlighted that the harm had already been done as my daughter was terrified by the ordeal.

I've involved the police incase this happens again or we come to blows and they see this as wholly unacceptable. 

What do you guys think as owners of Staffies?  Is this normal behaviour that non-owners 'just don't get' or is the owner just not raising these dogs properly?

Staffies can be hard to read: they may well just be wanting to play, but can be VERY enthusiastic about life and it can look aggressive and frightening, especially with the delightful range of noises they make!  I worked with one not long ago who everyone thought was aggressive because whenever she saw a dog, she would be up on her hind feet, squealing and screeching her head off and straining to get at them, spit flying.  But it was all excitement - she's actually a very playful, friendly dog.  She just had very poor self control.

It's practically impossible whether these staffies are just excited or they are genuinely aggressive without seeing them first hand.  But, if they are scaring your daughter, and the guy is struggling to handle them and a third dog has then gotten loose because of it, then regardless of the reason behind their behaviour, the guy needs to train them not to react this way.

but can be VERY enthusiastic about life and it can look aggressive and frightening

I second that, Daughter had a Rott and a Staff x, used to let them off lead in a paddock with plenty of room to lunatic around................the noises were horrendous anyone who didn't know them would swear they were in the middle of killing each other, my Shepherd couldn't cope with it and used to have a play on his own after they had finished ! ............and that was 2 dogs who were both quite well trained and controlled.

I've involved the police incase this happens again or we come to blows and they see this as wholly unacceptable.

You were quite right to do so, under the 1991 dangerous dogs act a dog only has to 'appear' threatening and the person in charge of the dog at the time is guilty of an offence. I suggest you keep some kind of pocket camera ready in any place this might happen again with the guy and film it for evidence.

I hope the cops take this up & push it all the way for you and also that you dont think all dog owners sit around the net making up anthropomorphic excuses for irresponsible, potentially dangerous dog owners and their wotnot's.
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Sorry, just noticed en error - my post should say "It's practically impossible to tell whether..."

I don't care what my husband says but I dislike staffs and always have.  There are 2 uncontrollable ones in a rented house near me.  My husband is always stating how well behaved and loyal staffs are to their owners. They obey commands and walk well on leads. Yes, right!

They are generally really good dogs with people, not so good with other dogs, but are highly excitable, I always think of them as canine cannonballs.

Sadly they fall into three types of ownership, god owners who train and socialise their dogs well so that they learn self control, idiots who like to give the impression their dogs is hard and aggressive, so encourage OTT behaviour and aggression to other animals, and Pet owners who dodn't understand dogs, and because they are great with the kids don't feel their baby would ever hurt a fly, and depending on socialisation/dogs character they can be harmless or liability.

Not my cup f tea in looks or outlook, and I need dogs that get on with their own kind well, but they are not bad dogs if you realise they are both bull breed (Tenacious, courageous, stoic) and Terrier (Reactive, Game, High prey Drive) and understand the mental make up of such.

I hope the cops take this up & push it all the way for you and also that you dont think all dog owners sit around the net making up anthropomorphic excuses for irresponsible, potentially dangerous dog owners and their wotnot's.

Thanks!  I think it's just a theme.  I only know one person who owns a Staffie who's not a chav so I'd say on the whole the type of excuse you refer to goes with the chav mindset of not being aware of other people's right not to be threatened.

The "s/he's a noisy greeter!" or "they're harmless mate!" is definitely irrelevant.  When they're pulling towards a 4yr old and barking at her while the owner struggles to restrain them, I personally couldn't care less what their intention is.  If they come at us after doing that then I'll do whatever it takes to defend my daughter. 

Great idea about video recording it.  I'll have my phone ready and follow it up if it happens again.  The police said I could take it as far as I wanted.  I decided to give them the benefit of the doubt (despite his excusing instead of apologising).  If it does happen again then I'll prosecute.

brainless
three types of ownership, god owners

Ahhh...yes of course, thats explains we got the staffie signature tune!

http://bit.ly/1QpQq62
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Julie Warboys says: unsocialised dogs and/or owner not in control, if you inform the police, they should have a word with the dogs owner, i would, just in case it happens again, or to someone else, then there is a record of potential problems.

I'm not sure reacting with a f#$# off with and as you advise aggressive  fist is the right way of replying! Surely that in itself is just as bad behaviour?  it certainly would put me off attempting to placate neighbour. Plus not a good example to show in front of a child,a touch of  double standards here.
I do not feel it warranted police action possibly a once everything calmed a talk with neighbour.

it certainly would put me off attempting to placate neighbour

There should not be any need to placate a neighbour, if the neighbour in question had kept his dogs under control as all & any responsible owner should....plus, if strong dogs are straining on leash fastners that are not of the strongest type then those inadequate clasps and and do break easily.....as the one below broke on that staff......caution, video shows images of a bloody stupid staff owner.....some viewers may find them intellecualy frustrating

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X3XYGJScZVg
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It was quite a visceral reaction to my daughter being in danger from dogs I perceived to be threatening to maul her.  It was coming to us and it had the exact affect on the dog I intended it to: for it to stop and back off.

Had it got close to my daughter after that performance I'd have physically damaged it in whatever way was available to me before I allowed it to get to my daughter.

In the long run, the visceral response of swearing  and raising a fist probably saved everyone a lot of grief, vet bills and police time.

I stand by logging it with the police and if it happens again I'll video it and prosecute.

I've since found out that another neighbour has had an issue with him for not clearing up after his dogs poo everywhere.

Fair's fair though!  He's not brought them out before 7pm since.  This is why I only logged the first instance with the police- to give him the chance to sort it out.

Gosh, another example of someone who shouldn't own a Staffordshire Bull Terrier.

Facebook Reply:

Thomas Wilson says: Im a staffie owner and my dogs soft as hell hes been attacked by bichon frise's, westie's, cats etc it gets annoying sometimes because they stand and laugh thinking its funny because he refuses to fight back he usually subits and lays on his back but if it was my dog attacking theres i garentee the police would be knocking on my door, i get laughed at in the pub because of how soft he is his best mates a bull dog who he wrestles with and ocasionally it gets a bit handbags at dawn after 2 mins there best mates again i believe its abit of how there raised. my dog is intact and not been neutered but as a breed there known ans people dogs and not generally tolerant towards other dogs but im suprised by them barking at your 4 yr old as there also known as the nanny dog please dont tar all staffordshire with the same brush if you'd of met mine he change your opinion

If these dogs are barking so aggressively at a child whilst on a leash, my worry would be what may happen should they ever slip out of the owners premises free? 

Back in the early nineties the village I lived in then was surrounded by fields. One house backing on to a footpath was home to a large Great Dane, a breed generally known for it's docile nature. This dog did make a lot of noise when dog walkers including me and my Golden walked by. One day  my husband, self and our dog were walking over the other side of the field, with our dog on a lead.

Suddenly, this large dog came seemingly from nowhere and attacked me and my dog. It hit me hard with the result I fell backwards into a steep sided water filled ditch with my dog. This dog was above us growling and trying to get one or both of as as my husband tried to get it off us. It went for my dog and got him round the throat.The owner came tearing across the field shouting and swearing at my husband to leave his dog alone! I won't write the expletives which came from my normally genteel husband!
The owner managed to make his dog release ours and dragged it home.

My dog was a quivering wreck and I can tell you, so was I. We dashed across the field home, I got into dry clothes and off to the vet. My dog had bite wounds to his neck and a minor eye injury.  We called the police on our return from the vet, it being just after the DD act came in we were asked how far we wanted to persue our complaint.

I didn't want anything to happen to this dog but knew it should not be allowed to happen to anyone else!
The police went to see the owner and it transpired that this animal was never walked or socialised.
They told us that the owner was contrite but he never ever contacted us to apologise. After several discussions with the police we accepted that the premises would be secured with high fencing etc. The police would keep a watchful eye and any further problems would without doubt be treated seriously.

Fortunately, there were no lasting physical problems from this episode, however the mental scars took a very long time to improve. We never walked that way again in the remaining 4 years we lived in the village. I believe this dog hadn't intended to harm me but it was my dog it was after. The vets opinion from the injuries was intent to kill.  This dogs behaviour was in my opinion caused by severe frustration, he saw dogs running in this field day after day whilst he was cooped up and at the first opportunity he just imploded. After the incident, they started exercising him very early in the mornings.

From this experience I would never give dogs of any breed, without any provocation, behaving aggressively towards a child, the benefit of doubt. My sympathy lies very much with dibble 750 and his very natural reactions. I think the advice and intent to film any further incidents is very sound.

Thanks Golden!

It's nice to see you understand the natural 'cave man' defensive reaction like your husband seemed to have when his own were in danger.  It's instinctive for a reason though!  The dog halted in its tracks.  Evolution works!

I'm normally a gentle giant but when it comes to stuff like that, it's very primal and manners go out of the window.

I do understand dogs.  My parents always had a Golden Retriever as I grew up and I used to walk them regularly.  I don't have my own now though as my wife and I work full time and we wouldn't be able to give a dog the care it needs.

Like I've said, to be fair to the owner I haven't witnessed him walking them before 7pm since (he's a dole dossing layabout so early mornings would be out of the question!).

In the long run we'll be moving.  Our house was up for sale before this so hopefully in the new year we'll get it sold and put it behind us.

How is your daughter now?

She's physically fine but she's now scared of all dogs.  I tried to get her to stroke a lovely quiet Cocker Spaniel outside school the other day and she wouldn't move from behind my leg.

Thanks Golden!

Sorry, meant to say bestdogs

That's fine! I hope you are able to move and hopefully,given time your little girl will learn to trust dogs again. You know from your own childhood how wonderful it is for children to enjoy a good relationship with dogs. If or when your circumstances allow, I expect you will have a family dog.

Best wishes

It's good that she's fine, but such a shame that this incident has put her off all dogs. I hope she will get over the scare in time. My younger son was afraid of dogs, no particular incident to blame, but we got our first retriever when he was six and it's impossible to be scared of a Goldie pup!

We got our first Goldie pup when my daughter was six as well. She confessed to me years later that she was getting rather scared of dogs, but never said a thing to us as she could see the rest of us were so looking forward to getting our fluffball. She went on to say that within five minutes of the pup arriving home all her fears went and she loved her to bits. Seeing her now as a 36 year old down on the floor playing happily with our current young Goldie, you would never have known about her initial fears.
Do hope your daughter gradually overcomes her fear, but don't force her to stroke a dog if she doesn't want to, let her watch you stroke and play so she can see how nice a friendly dog can be.