Hi

Its both me and my girls first litter and we are on day 61 today. She has shown a few signs of starting to get ready. A tiny bit of digging, lots of mucus discharge, occasional panting but mostly sleeping and following me around like a sheep.

Ive read a lot and to be honest I've scared myself to death! I am very worried she wont go into labour, wont progress or have some other emergency.

We progesterone tested her through the vet and only had 1 mating so we are very definite on her dates. We had her scanned and dates were confirmed, some pups measured a little bigger so we thought maybe she would go a day or 2 early - she's a medium short nosed breed and is huge!! We think 6-8 puppies from the scan.

So I guess my question is will I know when its time?? I was sure last night it was starting as she was pacing and panting...she settled though after a couple of hours and hasn't shown any more signs since. I can feel puppy movement and shes eaten her meals and is happy within herself. Have been taking her temp and its been pretty stable around 37.5...we had one drop 3 days ago of 37.1.

I have lots of support on the other end of the phone and nearby but I feel like I'm asking too many questions/fussing!! Sorry for rambling and Thank you!

bi5ches quite reliably whelp 62days +/- 1 day from OVULATION.  So you should be fairly certain when she ought to whelp, and if your vet had progesterone testing kit and blood sample shows she ahs dropped below ovulation levels then you know she should be whelping.

My most recent litter the bitch was in first stage for 36 hours, but whelped 5 pups in an hour and a half.

Thank you :-) yep I'm being too anxious! She has seemed more settled - sleeping very deeply. She's still losing mucus.
My daughter has been absolutely fantastic - couldn't do this without her really as she's the calm one!!!

Well we are on day 62 and she had a temperature job this morning 36.7...it is now 36.9. She has been 37.7 all week so im guessing this is the drop. :)

We have had panting and digging on and off but nothing consistent. Im going to take her on her lead into the garden in a minute to see if this helps move things along.

Sounds good

Has she eaten today? She may lose her appetite a few hours before....she also may get loose and mine very often start being sick when very close.

Good luck!!

yep, shes had a big breakfast and a smaller dinner tonight. Shes been to the toilet and her poo is soft but not loose. she's sleeping now so i'm letting her rest. Will update later on...

up all night with her...lots of panting and digging but no further forward. has passed some loose poo, is now sleeping but is very restless. Think I might take her to be checked at the vet later on this morning if no progression. She's fine in herself though so will play it by ear.

Oh my goodness - the wait is harder than I thought it would be! Juat wanna get on with it now! lol

Good luck, all fingers crossed.

Sounds normal.I would not rush to the vet if she is not showing signs of actually contracting and pushing....you really don't want to bring anything nasty back home with you.
Some bitches can have 48/72 hrs or more of digging/panting. The lose poo sounds like good progression........

All sounds like normal early first stage, as I have said it can go on for two days or just a couple of hours.

My most recent litter bitch was in first stage for 36 hours.

Unfortunately unless they breed themselves few vets have any idea about a normal whelping, and none on specific breeds (your bitches breeder is likely to be more help), and only ever really get i9nvolcbved if a C section is needed, or perhaps to give Oxytocin to speed things up once at least one pup ahs been born in a slow whelping.

> Unfortunately unless they breed themselves few vets have any idea about a normal whelping, and none on specific breeds (your bitches breeder is likely to be more help), and only ever really get i9nvolcbved if a C section is needed, or perhaps to give Oxytocin to speed things up once at least one pup ahs been born in a slow whelping. />

As always, 2 days over with no sign of any contractions is when I call the vet and take mine in.   Mine would go to uterine inertia (usually secondary - start but don't proceed).    And for sure, speak to your breeder more than the vet until it has gone 2 days.   Nothing like somebody who is experienced with THE BREED to give you the advice you need - and for sure, I'd not want to take a bitch of mine into the vet before the due date (distress apart) for fear of bringing home infection.

This is about as stressful a time as it gets - although if you have produced yourself, you should be one step ahead of me the first time I whelped my bitches.  But stressing out isn't going to help mum - try to keep calm.   What will be, will be and you are there, with a vet on hand!

ps   If you do need to get her into your vet, take a box with a warm pad/towels with you and somebody to either drive you, or watch your bitch because often a car trip will get things moving - be ready to pull over (and you'll need your whelping gear with you).

We have 9 puppies 5 boys, 4 girls. My bitch is ok, still panting a bit to get rid of some placenta. Going to the vet at 2pm to get her checked over.

I am thrilled and exhausted :)

Thank you all for your replies.

Scratch that we now have 10!!!! 3 hours after last one was born!!!

Boy or girl?

Personally I'd not take her into the vet unless worried in case of picking up infection, if need be better to have a home visit.

I agree Barbara, home visit for me every time after whelping. Vet removes shoes and washes hands in my antibacterial soap. 
Not worth the risk to take to the vet unless you are worried about a retained pup. My vet now brings the scanner out and scans the bitch just to be sure all are safely delivered.

Well we have 11 puppies!!! All doing fine so far. We went to the vets as she didn't have an afterbirth after 10 and 11. The vet gave her oxytocin and she is doing fine, still pushing a bit but settled with her puppies feeding.
So we have 6 boys and 5 girls. 2 whites, 6 reds and 3 brindles. All doing ok...but how on earth do I make sure they all get enough milk!!!!

They will......I have done a litter of 12 and everyone had plenty. She will supply to their demand.....just get plenty of food and fluids into her.

They can get unsettled after the Oxy injections from after pains so try and watch her carefully as she may keep digging the bed up and you need to watch that pups don't get buried.

She may get very sore nipples from the constant feeding with a large litter.....Lansinoh cream from boots is wonderful for this and very safe for pups to suckle.

Good luck with your new family.

My girl took a while to come into full
Milk so I had to aid them and supplement them until her milk came in fully

Just do make sure they all do get enough and ARE all feeding. I once missed one in a much smaller litter as they were all nestled with Mum but in fact it was just bouncing up  and down with MUm. I was too late and was devastated and angry with myself.
I have had a litter of 11 and not supplemented but more recently with 10 I found I had too. Guess it just depends on MUm and your common sense.

> ..but how on earth do I make sure they all get enough milk!!!!

I've never had 11, but with a litter of 9, I used to roll mum and plug in half and pulling her slightly back again, plus on the rest (obviously with 9, it was 5 + 4).   You may have to supplement as their demands increase (new born puppies don't need tons of milk), half on and half off but with good food (mum) and lots of it, she should cope.   You'll just have to go with it, and see how they do, remembering a contant litter is a quite one, apart from when actually nursing!   I'd get a supply of bitch replacer milk on hand, and some bottles, just in case.   You may have to consider weaning perhaps earlier than the norm - definitely by the end of week 3.

I hope you have the space for them and homes lined up!!

The good news is that with a good mum, your work shouldn't really begin until the weaning begins!!  Just keep a close eye on what's going on.

So Day 2 today and im exhausted! We are having to supplement as they just aren't getting enough from poor mum as her milk isn't in yet. She is constantly being suckled and we are just topping up the ones who don't get there turn. Poor mum only has 8 teats!
All have dropped a bit of weight which I know is normal but the smallest girl is really struggling, she has dropped 40 grams and is crying a lot. We are putting her on mum first to try and get some of mums milk into her and then giving her milk. She cries even when she's on the teat at the moment and I cant figure out why!!

Mum is doing a great job, her appetite has gone a bit but we are giving her anything she wants. Im really hoping her milk comes in soon. Am I ok to give her calcium? I read something on eclampsia and cant remember whether it was ok or not ok!

She cries even when she's on the teat at the moment and I cant figure out why!!

I assume she has been carefully checked for cleft palate? If she's fine, then I would just keep at it. I had a pup like that last year, she cried even whilst on the teat. I ended up weaning her onto solids at 13 days and from that day she stopped crying and was fine. She's the pup I kept in that litter and is now 17 months old and just fine.

I've just had a litter of 12 and found for the first few days some pups needed topping up but then it got easier and again all ended well.

Hi..Yes she has been checked and that has been ruled out. I think she just may be hungry. Topped her up the last 2 feeds and she has settled a bit. I think they are all a little frustrated that theres not enough milk yet. We will persevere with fingers crossed that everything is fine. Thank you x

Get lots of calcium into your girl. I fed lots of a mix of scrambled egg with goats milk and moscavado sugar. Also gave liquid calcium into her dry food too with hosts milk, it took over a week to really start coming in and she too only have 8 nipples.
I was supplementing mine also and it was hard work for the first 2 weeks, I was beside myself with lack of sleep.

You do realise that during the first few days, newborn puppies don't need lashings of milk - in fact if it comes in too fast, the puppies may not be able to cope with it all (unlikely with 11!) and she could run into mastitis.   I would also be careful re calcium supplementing (mum).   If she's having high protein food, and you could include eggs, cottage cheese, cooked chicken breast, this should help.   And yes, goats milk.   If the litter is quiet and start to gain on a daily basis, they are probably getting enough.   The one who isn't thriving will benefit from extra supplementing and making sure she gets hooked onto one of the middle teats - she may not be able to cope with the bigger back ones.

A lot of mine had C.Sections but in no cases was the milk significantly delayed, even after the surgery.

Go easy on supplementing with Calcium.....too much can CAUSE eclampsia.Her milk will not properly come in for a day or two after birth....the glands look quite small until then,the more the pups feed the more she will produce so by supplementing too much you will stop her production if you see what I mean......

Rather than putting little pup on first I would stick a stronger feeder on first to get milk flowing and then switch little one on and hold her onto the teat. I did this with a fading pup for over a week and he is now a bruiser in a five week old litter so don't give up.

Your bitch may well not eat huge amounts in the day or two after birth...the placentas will she ate after birth will nourish her and help with milk production but I usually soak her food and handfeed her in the box to encourage her...they usually regain appetite by around day 3 or 4.

I agree for the first three days I expect Mum to stay with pups 24/7 and need taking out to pee,  but the rest fo the time pups should almost constantly be on suckling which is what will bring milk properly in on the third day (I feed well coaked food 4 or more times a day in the bed) .

It's not Supply and Demand but Demand and Supply.

As I weigh pups routinely I have noticed with biggish pups that the next day they nearly always have dropped a little weight by two days they have regained or even got a little ahead and from the third day they should be gaining steadily.

Well I spoke to the vet today about her milk, he said that you can't give too much calcium! I'm not going to be supplementing her lots though.

They are suckling lots but I had to give a top up to each of them as the weight loss was getting dangerous. I don't want to inhibit her milk production at all but I didn't feel I had a choice.

She's started digging her bed up a bit today....not really sure why? And she's not as eager to get back in with pups when she's been for a wee. She has a little wander around the house and then goes back in.

On the plus side she has her appetite back and is eating regularly. Puppies are settled and quiet between feeds.

I have to disagree with your vet.....You most certainly can give too much calcium, for example giving too much during pregnancy is dangerous and can predispose a bitch to develop eclampsia ....vets are very limited with breeding knowledge unfortunately but I appreciate it must be hard to know who to listen to when you are worrying. Food sources should be ok just don't be tempted to use supplements

The bed digging will be after pains and should settle in a few days just watch no puppies get trapped under the bed.

Good sign pups are quiet between feeds....good luck..it will get easier.

> She's started digging her bed up a bit today....not really sure why?

Because she is in pain.   Some bitches take longer than others for everything to shrink back.  And it hurts.

> I have to disagree with your vet.....

Yes I agree.  Sigh,,,   Most vets know nothing about breeding because they only see bitches at the end of pregnancy when there are difficulties.  They certainly don't see healthy pregnant bitches.

We still have 11... I thought the tiny one wouldn't make it overnight but she's still with us. Mum seems to have more milk now thank goodness!!!!

She has very itchy skin on her back...it's dry and flaky and the hair is falling out. I've washed her and put exma rid ointment on it but thinking of using frontline spray in case it's mites. Will this be ok?

Just want to say thank you for following me through my first litter...you are all great and have been a huge support. Thanks again.

Good news.....she will make more and more milk now.....the more they feed the more she will produce. Just plug tiny on a back teat and hold her in position so she doesn't have to work to hard and watch the others don't bat her off.

Bitches do get itchy and flaky...her hair will come out everywhere...all sounds normal. You can use frontline but really I wouldn't at the stage as it sounds normal. By the time they are four to five weeks she could look quite bald in places.

The first 10 days is such a worry......it will get easier

Help!!!! I have one pup who has stopped eating and is making high pitched cries every so often. Was gaining weight well and seemed to be doing fine until last night????

What do I do??

seagull cries??

check the pup is warm.cold puppies do not nurse.check its hydrated.if pup cold you need to warm up gradually.

Is pup warm enough to eat and is he hydrated?

The pup..we called him blue died this morning at 7.30.
He was warm and hydrated but we think infection got him from the dew claw removal wound.
I am gutted, I will never have dew claws removed again.
Watching the other puppies like a hawk again now. Stupidly I'd started to relax as they were a week old yesterday.
The vets were hopeless too and just said - oh you expect one or two in a big litter to die. How insensitive! They told me about a Great Dane litter that lost 4 like it was supposed to make me feel better :-(

I am sorry, and yes although true it is insensitive, and caring breeders do no expect the kid of losses I have seen quoted of 25 - 30% of a litter.

I am so very sorry....you are so right..vets are very insensitive and quite dismissive of lost pups like it's to be expected. Whereas caring breeders we find a loss devastating and hard to come to terms with.

Don't be too hard on yourself..it may not have been the dew claw infection...I had a pup start making the same noise as yours at the same age and we culled him....he was getting very weak and was in obvious distress.I never knew why and the rest of the litter were all fine as I'm sure yours will be.

Enjoy the rest of your litter...I hope you have an easy time of it from now on xx

I'm sorry you lost him, Ive lost pups early on and it is hard, I cried for England at the time and will always remember my little angels.
R.I.P little Blue another star shining in the sky tonight :( x

> I had a pup start making the same noise as yours at the same age and we culled him....

You did it yourself?

Hi my bitch gave birth on Saturday 18/07/15 to two girls. My dam had a emergency c- section which was expected but the vet insisted that we should let her try to give birth herself however she did really well and all is well with her and the pups. My query is that she will not leave my side she will go in the whelping box to feed and lick the pups but only if I am by her side and if I go to stand up or move away from her she will follow. She is interested in the pups and recognises there cry but will not attend to them unless I am with her she will follow me upstairs or out of the room and on return she will look at the pups but not go in there do you think she will come round?

Jean....No, I asked my vet to. It was heartbreaking and I always wondered if I should have tried a few more days but his breathing was laboured,his abdomen swollen and his crying was getting more constant. I really think he was dying and could not watch his pain any longer....I tell myself I would not watch one of my adults in that much pain and let it continue.....he is buried under my apple tree and I still go and talk to him...only 3 weeks old but I loved him...sorry rambling now.....

Bitches can be unsure and conflicted between their maternal instincts and their attachment to you.

You need to do everything to foster the maternal instinct which includes staying by her and supervising all the time, is she cleaning and feeding the pups properly?

Feed her in her bed, and encourage her to stay with her pups constantly fro at least the first three days where the constant suckling will bring the milk in, in sufficient quantity fro the pups.

As bulldogs can be clumsy and find it difficult to reach behind them you should not leave her unattended with the pups anyway, they are a very unnatural shape for a dog..

> we think infection got him from the dew claw removal wound. <br />I am gutted, I will never have dew claws removed again.

Boy does this ring a bell - I lost a puppy after the litter had their dew claws removed.   At the time we (vet and me) thought he may not have been doing very well which we both missed at the time, and having these taken off pushed him over the edge.  Heartbreaking ..... and FOR SURE I never had this done again.  Ever.   My then vet hated doing this in any case so he was more than happy I stopped!    But do keep a close eye on the rest.   I hope I'm wrong but there is the possibility that this could have been the start of something more sinister than just the dew claws.

I'm so sorry and know exactly how you feel right now.   Find another vet - his comments were out of order big time.   Expecting one of two in a big litter to die - yeah right.

We have now lost 2 and the whole litter is on antibiotics. I am very worried about them but there is nothing more I can do. They both stopped eating 12 hours before they died, swollen abdomen, crying, very laboured breathing and then blood coming from their nose and mouth. The vet said it could be anything from digestive issues to a respiratory infection. She said they will do a post mortem if any more die  - I am hoping the antibiotics will stop that from happening.
The first died at 8 days, the second yesterday at 11 days. I am heartbroken and will never do this again. I cant stand the worry and heartache. I am loving seeing them change and grow every day though, they are so precious.
My bitch is struggling with them, she isn't producing tons of milk so seems to run out and the last few to latch on are having to be topped up. The bottle feeding is fine but they are snuffly and as much as im being careful, they seem to be getting more rattley. Have looked up sponge feeding on the internet but am also considering syringe feeding.
I have never looked forward to time passing as much as at the moment. Roll on 8 weeks!!!

She is not left under any circumstances alone with the pups although she is very careful even though there are only two it's a blessing I think there is only two pups. I do stay in the box with her but she seems to stay outside of the box I think I just need to stick with it and hopefully she will come round I was just disappointed that she is not more motherly. She does not seem to settle in the box either she won't sleep in there as if she is on edge. I am encouraging her to feed every hour as I have to make her lie down the pups appear healthy and settled so I don't think it will interfere with them much
Thanks for the advice

Alfiesmum.....I am so so sorry....your first litter and you have tried so very hard for them. The only thing I can say that may help is that I lost a pup at 3 weeks that had been poorly for 10 days with the exact symptoms as yours apart from the blood from nose but I had him pts so that may have happened nearer the end....the rest of the litter did thrive however so there is every chance that it may stop at the two.

I know bottle feeding is scary to do for fear of aspiration ,if they are rattley it may be that....are their eyes open yet....you could start to wean onto solids at around 18 days.

So sorry you are having such a hard time....I really feel for you xxx

I have started pups on semi solids at 12 days, as soon as eyes were open when needed.