Hi all,

Me again - theshowing novice!

Just when I thought I had the rules in my head regarding the junior warrant points I hear something which gets me questioning if I've understood it all over again!

In my mind you get 3 points for every 1st in a qualifying class at a Ch  show and 1 point for a qualifying class at an open show (As long as at least 3 dogs present), at least 3 points from a Ch and 3 from open. However I heard someone recently say they gained 2 points from an open show - how is this possible? can you gain more than 1 on the same day if you win 2 classes? or does just one class win get counted ? I didnt think you could claim for BP if you were claiming the points for the class win?

It's 3 points for a win in ANY breed class at a Champ show where CC's are on offer, NOT just qualifying classes. There must be three in the class when you win to claim the points

Its one point for a win in ANY breed class at an open show, as long as there are three in the class

You can claim more than one class win per show IF you enter more than one class and win each class. Again, there must be three dogs present for each class UNLESS the dog that should have been in the 2nd/3rd class with you was present in the first and did not enter the 2nd/3rd classes

Regarding open shows, you can ONLY claim a BOB point if you do NOT claim a class win point, there must be a minimum of three dogs present in the breed to claim that point

You can claim a point for BPIB at open or Champ shows (where no CC's were on offer) as long as you are NOT claiming a point for a class win, and the best opposite sex puppy has been able to claim a point

Yes you're exactly right, you can gain more than 1 point at an open show if you win more than 1 class, as long as there are 3 dogs present in the class (or 3 present in the first class, you can still count anyone who goes off in a huff at not winning their first class if they're entered in the others!).

It's almost impossible in my breed to get a JW as there are rarely three in a class in young classes.  the only way to get points is to win higher classes and enter say three classes per show, SO YES MORE THAN ONE CLASS WIN CAN COUNT.

I still haven't managed to get JW for my two youngest as never could get the Open show points (even at Ch shows without CC's that count as Open).

So if I came second in junior but own best puppy in breed - could I count the point?

If I came 1st in puppy dog only him in the class then won best puppy dog against winner of minor puppy then won best puppy in breed can I claim a JW POINT please

Sorry guys - but if I got 2nd in junior as no puppy class and then won best puppy in breed - can I claim the point for best puppy in breed? Or not as I didn't win a class?

Claire you can claim a point for BP in your situation IF there were 3 in the minor puppy class or the Puppy Bitch winner's class, I'm pretty sure about that as my friend's dog just got his JW and one of his points was by beating the puppy bitch for BP.

Ghost I would think you could claim a point for BP if you beat 2 other dogs in the Junior class that you were 2nd in and then got BP, but I'm less sure about that one. :p

There was 2 in puppy dog  he was the only one in junior and 1 in puppy bitch. He went head to head with the puppy dog for best puppy dog and then against the bitch where he won best puppy in breed with ccs so would he be entitled to the points please

If the bitch pup would have gained points from her puppy class win then yes, if there were only two bitch pups or less then not.

My one who won bpib was in junior only dog as I was handling the other in puppy dog 2 entered and there was only 1 entered in puppy bitch at show sorry confused

The option is there to prevent the anomaly of one pup getting a point but the one that beats it for BPIB not because they didn't' have enough in their class.

So if the bitch pup did not win a class of 3 or more then your boy would not get the point.

"4 One point for the award of Best Puppy in Breed at an Open Show (effective from 1st January 2011).
Only to be claimed if no qualifying Junior Warrant points were gained by that dog by winning a
Breed Class or Classes at that show and only to be claimed if the dog awarded Best Opposite Sex
Puppy has also gained one or more points having won a Breed Class or Classes at that show.

The rule only seems to apply to Open shows

How about this 1 - Win Champ show BPIB with 4 other puppies in breed but 1 per class (1MPB,1MPD,1PD,1PB) - no one gets the points?

No points.  I have had this situation got BPIB, beating the dog pup who had the RCC, but still no points.

We haven't had a JW winner in my breed for years, not since 2009 when two gained it, one of which was my youngster who was a champion by 14 months, from memory I had to enter Post Graduate to get points.

S

So if there is no puppy class and I enter my pup in junior, we get 2nd in junior but win BPIB as only pup under 12 months - am I correct that no point can be claimed for this ?
only 3 in junior so my dog only beat one other dog - who was a junior

Yes, I'm pretty sure that doesn't get you a point I'm afraid.

Thanks Lucydogs
I didn't think it did - but TBH I thought you only
Got a point if you won - and it would seem if you have no puppy class and win BPIB you can get a point if you have beat a certain number of others ?? I'm so confused!

It's a minefield isn't it! It would seem only fair that if you win BP even if you didn't win Junior if there's no puppy class, and you beat 2 other dogs, you should get a point. But then it's always seemed a shame to me that if you win BOB and there are 2 more dogs in the challenge you don't get anything for beating them - I've always thought it should count as another class.

I wish they would make the rules 'Me proof' ! ha ha!

We won 1st in puppy out of 5 at crufts then won bpib how many points can we claim. Also at a open show we had o enter open class in the breed and got 3rd and bpib can we claim a point for that as they winner was unable to claim points due to age

Just the class win giving 3 points at Crufts, nothing for the Open show.

Thank you

6 dogs in junior at an open show, a pup comes 4th - as highest placed puppy gain BPIB beating two other pups that we also in Junior.
I'm right that this does not give a JW point?
Also, if a dog is the only dog that turns up to an open show and gets bob by default no point can be claimed due to being the only dog in breed?

For JW points you have to win the class, any breed class.

BOB JW points only gained if beaten more than three dogs in the breed.

and as Brainless says point gained if class win not highest placed puppy.

This is one of the problems with open shows, they often don't have puppy classes and start with junior, if there had been a puppy class this pup would have won the class as it is it was beaten by three older dogs, shame but that is how the award has been set up and it makes it even more difficult to gain the needed open show points.

In part the JW was set up to help the open shows but then open shows were penalised for not having an average of, I think, 4 per class so the open shows dropped classes to try to achieve this and so cut out the class you need to get the JW points.

We haven't had a JW winner in our breed for a few years.  To few youngsters born and shown, and then as you say the stumbling block is getting the points at open level.

When I got my JW with my youngest champion and her Mum I had to enter and win Post Graduate at the very least.  My Jozi never won hers as at the time you had to have 10 Open show points.

More recently my two youngest bitches won plenty of classes but often there were not the three needed.  One was top puppy in the breed, and the other has a RCC, both are out of Post Graduate, so not unworthy.