I wonder if you could give me some advice please. My active mum has decided that she would like to have a dog of her own, however her needs are quite specific and different to mine, so I am looking for some knowledgeable suggestions. It is important to both of us to find an Assured Breeder of the eventual breed and ensuring that all the relevant health tests are done. Having bred two litters of a gundog breed under the scheme myself, lets just say that I will be extremely picky as to who we go to. These are her wish lists/deal breakers:

Must be small, so can sit on her lap of an evening (she lives on her own).
Not known to be a vocal breed (Ive fostered two jack russells and a papillon over the last few years and they have been very vocal) My mum wears hearing aids (as do I) and lots of barking really goes right through your head plus she has close neighbours.
Biddable and affectionate as part of their normal nature, some breeds are more aloof than others
Grooming isnt a problem
Im not sure she could cope with a true terrier personality, ie a border or a Min pin type and she does not like whippets.
We did discuss brachycephalic breeds such as pugs, but we felt that the potential for breathing problems was too great at the moment.
Ive had Cavaliers for the last ten years and although I will always adore them, even coming from the top breeders in the country, Ive lost them all before ten, to either eye/MVD/cushings :(
Looking forward to taking to dog training classes and we have plenty of off lead fields around here.

Doglet will be coming to me for holidays and wont be left on their own as my mum has just retired.

See my problem in trying to find a breed! Despite doing lots of 'find a breed' websites, it comes up with some completely unsuitable suggestions.
Any help appreciated.

What about one of the smaller spaniel breeds? If she is active enough, something like a cocker or field spaniel? Generally loving, biddable, quiet types. Or do you mean even smaller?

Cocker, or is that too active for her.

A toy or a miniature poodle?

Unfortunately so many small breeds are vocal.

As a former ABS member (did not renew this year, there are many excellent breeders who do not lie the box ticking and over prescriptiv3e, one size fits all direction the scheme has taken (inevitably with UKAS accreditation,  standardisation being a requirement).

Many small scale hobby motivated breeders (and I don't mean the breeding being a hobby but showing, trialling etc, with breeding being an extension of the primary involvement), feel the scheme is not for them, apart from money not well spent.

So I would always check a potential breeders credentials and reputation within their breed club.

In more popular breeds there are plenty of ABS breeders who do nothing within their breed other than breed.

Border terriers in my limited experience are much more friendly and laid back than your average terrorist (I mean terrier lol). Norfolk / Norwich? I'll always add a plug for Cavaliers, I see you have had bad luck even from good breeders, but they are still only breed for me. She does have to make sure all health tests have been done but I'm sure you know all that.

mini poodle as jean suggests. I don't know how quite they are though. Shame about whippets, very cuddly and usually quite I am told

Wow thank you all for your speedy replies, I think a cocker spaniel might be a little too busy for her really and possibly a little bigger than she was thinking. We have talked about poodles, I get confused which is the smaller, miniature or toy, I could probably do with talking to the breed club to find out more about them tbh. Are they considered really vocal?

I always thought Border Terriers earned their terrorist name a bit like JRT's? Im quite willing to be corrected if my assumption isnt correct. Independent, not really very cuddly (unless on their own terms) and can be a bit stroppy? Another dog my mum came up with was the yorkshire terrier, but every single one Ive ever met has been snappy (some have been with experienced owners as well and treated as dogs, so its not as if they were 'handbag dogs').

Cavvies will always be my first dog/soul dog/first breed, I just cant go through it again, my username was my last Cavvie and we lost him suddenly to a cushings tumour in the brain impacting on a significant area and it was possibly the most awful thing Ive ever experienced.

I understand completely what you are saying about the ABS, I suppose having a numerically high breed myself, people have rung me because they are using the ABS as somewhere to start, so yes, I will also check out the breed clubs and do some extra investigation, after all my second cavvie came from one of the top breeders in the country, yet she bred from a dog known to have syringomyelia :( but thats a different story altogether.

Whippets are a no-no due to my youngest son being bitten in the face by a whippet 7 years ago, completely unprompted with no warning and he was watching tv, silently, the dog came in from the garden and jumped on the sofa and bit him just at the side of the eye. The dog was 5 months old at the time :(

I'm a terrier person and am yet to meet a border that isn't also in the terrorist category. I wouldn't class them as a good older persons dog just because of their need for independence - like most terriers actually! Haha! Obviously there will be some lovely borders (don't want to tar them all with the same brush - but I havnt met one yet!)

Can vouch for the poodle! My great grandparents had a toy poodle right until the end and he was a sweetie! My parents now have standard poodles. They are so intelligent and keen to learn. Where as I am discovering with terriers they arnt so easy to teach :P Maybe a Bichon could be an idea too? (Not much experience of them though).

Any of the Dachshund family...yes, they can be vocal but can be easily trained not to be.

Boston Terrier .... although be warned, they are very addictive (awaiting news of a litter due mid-October to add another furbaby to our family)    ;)

I'm not a small dog person, but I've always had a bit of a soft spot for Lowchens, ones I've met have all been sensible, affectionate sorts.

Thank you, because you obviously dont know my mum (after all its difficult to describe someone online) she is just soooo not the sort of person I would put with a terrier, it would be like putting a racehorse with a novice rider! I love daxies, especially the miniature smooth haired ones with shoelace tails, Im not sure that a dog we have to trained to be quiet is what we are looking for, if a dog is by nature vocal, (like a JRT) for example, then it will always be there. My mum does live in a bungalow though, so no stairs to worry about.

The BT's are not like terriers at all, infact ours is eager to go out for walks but just as happy being a hot water bottle.  Very rarely barks (and mostly at our rabbit if she ever does), certainly never has done if the doorbell rings, has a good recall and is generally just happy being with people.

What about an Italian Greyhound?   Very gentle dogs, not large and the ones I have met havnt been vocal either.

>We have talked about poodles, I get confused which is the smaller, miniature or toy, I could probably do with talking to the breed club to find out more about them tbh. Are they considered really vocal?

The toy poodle is the very small one (under 11 inches); the miniature is larger (11" - 15"). All the ones I've met have been remarkably quiet on the whole. The brred description says "Light-hearted, elegant, friendly and high-spirited, with a happy nature and sporting and home-loving instincts, the Poodle makes the ideal companion."

Actually a Boston terrier is a good option. They actually arnt in the "terrier" category despite their name. Completely different kettle of fish :)

Would a Clumber or PBGV be too large for her?
Lancashire Heeler? Sheltie, they seek to attract the slightly older generation, going by dog shows anyway.
Corgi?

Bichon?
Griffon?
Min Pin?

Lots in the toy group which may suit

French Bulldog
Shiba Inu

The German Pinscher is a smaller dog and I think a fab mid size slender dog

I second the Border terrier and suggest them often.
Real little wash and wear dogs, full of fun and generally very healthy.

> Whippets are a no-no due to my youngest son being bitten in the face by a whippet 7 years ago, completely unprompted with no warning and he was watching tv, silently, the dog came in from the garden and jumped on the sofa and bit him just at the side of the eye. The dog was 5 months old at the time :-(

I was naughty as a child & blew in the face of our dog, she...rightly so....nipped my nose. It certainly wasnt her fault & I was totally to blame. It never stopped me from loveing Whippets totally & i do on occasion still blow in their faces.

In your case, it may well have been a temperament issue with that particular dog, as Whippets are good with all ages normally...Mind you I doubt if I will alter your mind now anyway.

Strangely I was bitten by a Whippet as a child too.

Didnt stop me loving them....I probably went over and grabbed it...I was dog mad from as soon as I could walk.

What about the  Lowchen (little lion dog) they always seem happy little chaps

I know a few yorkies that arnt snappy  dogs.think it depends on their breeding and upbringing can't say they are overly noisy either. Italian greyhounds can be very excited busy dogs. I think they are lovely but not sure they would be calm enough again from research they seem to be very different from greys and whippets. Completely different does anyone know anything about pekenise. Companion lap dogs not too big although I will admit I don't know anything about them.

>I'm a terrier person and am yet to meet a border that isn't also in the terrorist category.

Perhaps it's a locality thing - I've never met one who isn't friendly and willing to learn. Not snappy when being groomed like Westies and Cairns so often are, and not noisy like Schnauzers.

Poodles yes are very sweet, intelligent and trainable, however I have a friend who has miniatures and they are noisy like you wouldn't believe, at least when she arrives at training they all scream their heads off! Mind you one of my Cavaliers is pretty shrieky too. :-p However a Cavalier might still be a possibility if she wants something more laidback than a terrier.

Most Yorkies I know are very sweet little dogs, IGs are also a possible as they are gentle and quiet, but might be perhaps too small and fragile?

How about taking her to Discover Dogs in November?

What about a Tibetan Spaniel?
Not sure about the barkiness level with those, though.

Yeah we came to our decision by going to

Yeah we came to our decision by going to Discover dogs!

(To be honest I have only met certain Borders and I think they have put me off.... it may have been owners error though. But you can say that about any dog!)

I think the yappy thing can apply to any dog. My friends border never shuts up! lol! But my parents poodles dont make a peep. Im guessing it just depends on what they have been allowed to get away with.

> Whippets are a no-no due to my youngest son being bitten in the face by a whippet 7 years ago, completely unprompted with no warning and he was watching tv, silently, the dog came in from the garden and jumped on the sofa and bit him just at the side of the eye. The dog was 5 months old at the time

A five month old pup is not a grown dog, and can't be expected to behave like one.   At that age many pups can still be over boisterous and often see children as fair game.  

My friend's cocker pup was still trying to initiate play by grabbing at that age,  and often caught us with a playbite which really hurt.   At 8 months he has calmed down a lot and no longer does this.  ;-)

Regarding suitable candidates for your mum, 

The Lowchens I've met have all been really affectionate.    Tibetan Terriers too (not really a terrier ;-)   but TTs are a major commitment in grooming.

> xmlns="http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml">I always thought Border Terriers earned their terrorist name a bit like JRT's? Im quite willing to be corrected if my assumption isnt correct. Independent, not really very cuddly (unless on their own terms) and can be a bit stroppy?

Sadly with the breed now very popular temperaments in some circles have deteriorated.

The Borders I know are great little dogs.  One of my favourite breeds, but these are bred from really good stock, people with families and who care passionately about their breed.

One they had back went to live with my friends Mum and Dad when their Yorkie died as they wanted something reliable with the grandchildren.

She then at 12 came to live with my friend after her Dad had died and lived with two children, as he wasn't getting enough cuddles from widowed Mum.

I was going to say Tibetan Spaniel, but don't know how barky they are as the ones I knew at Ringcraft were very laid back and quiet (dignified really).  They do live forever though I'm told, well into late teens.

>I was going to say Tibetan Spaniel, but don't know how barky they are as the ones I knew at Ringcraft were very laid back and quiet (dignified really). They do live forever though I'm told, well into late teens.

As do Yorkies.... I'm not really into small dogs but I have liked the Tibetan Spaniels I've met thus far. A nice parcel of a dog, with no exaggerations.

>Im guessing it just depends on what they have been allowed to get away with.

100% correct.  :-)

This is the first time in many years that I've been without a Toy Poodle.  I've kept them alongside of Collies and found that they would warn off a Collie early on in the relationship.  I loved that they were intelligent enough to live with working dogs.  Once "warned off" I never had to worry about a large dog hurting a toy dog.

I always did obedience with my poodles, and I can't tell you just how much they loved it.  I did take one as far as learning tracking and I have never seen a dog so excited.  I never, ever had a barking problem.  Don't you think it's just like children, you teach them where the boundaries are.  (I do sometimes think dogs "get it" much quicker than kids.)  :-)

I think that a Toy Poodle could be a serious contender if your mum is happy to attend classes.  They are a handy size to sit on your lap in the evening.  I used to enjoy grooming with some of them in my lap.  With a full mane I loved combing it and fanning it out on my knees.

I've had Yorkies too, but they are more difficult to get a high degree of obedience.  I swear that some of them whispered "make me" at  some of my commands.  :-)

I would suggest a Tibetan Spaniel . I know two and they are quite little characters !

They are very friendly not timid and enjoy their walks !

As someone else suggested the Toy Poodle is the only one suitable.

As an owner of Tibetan spaniel although they are adorable. They can be a bit iffy on recall. I have done obedience with ours and she is probably 90% reliable on recall. However a lot of tibbie folks never let theirs off the lead. Personally I would suggest toy poodle or sheltie..

My neighbour has a minature Poodle, and it never, ever stops yapping....!

My breed(not advertising) are real cuddle monsters, very obedient, easily trained, but do need lots of grooming. My neighbour prefers my dogs to her dog LOL.

My sister has had two Shelties, to say they are vocal is an understatement, and it can be quite earpiercing.

My BILs Sheltie was vocal too, despite him trying to train the dog to be quiet :(

I was going to suggest Tibetan Spaniel, but all the write ups mention stubbornness, and the ones I have met, the people won't let them off lead as they can be independent minded about returning :(

Personally, I've been torn between the Tibetan Spaniel and a Lowchen for my 'After the Bedlingtons' dog.   With fewer safe places available to let them have a really good long blast off lead, I feel it's unfair to keep dogs which need that, especially when they require such a lot of space for running.

I would suggest a Bedlington for the OPs mum, but as youngsters they can be really hard work, being very lively and into EVERYTHING.  And of course, recall can depend on what training you have done with them, and whether or not you have more than one.  And of course they are independent minded, which can bring surprises on the odd occasion when they decide to be deaf, because there's something more interesting.  On the other hand, if you want a dog that isn't underfoot all the time in the house, fairly quiet, and loves to cuddle, then a Bedlington could be just the dog.

We are all, probably, going to suggest the breeds we have but not all breeds are going to suit all people, and individuals within a breed are not all going to be exactly the same either.   I would suggest, for instance that it would be very untypical of a Whippet to bite without provocation.    That one must have come from a poor background or something was going on that was missed.

I'd suggest, if you are not settled on what breed, you might be better to go to your local Shelter and see if there's a suitable dog in there longing for a permanent loving home.

A dog I have never had ( and I have had most flavours of dog) is  toy poodle, but I know plenty of people that have. They seem adorable little things and perhaps if not left alone much then they would not be yappy. I understand they are very cuddly and love their home comforts, but are very intelligent.
Most small dogs are mouthy and noisy but if you train them early enough to 'stop' or in my case with my dogs 'enough'  then you can at least control the noise when you are with them.
If I was looking for another small dog I would love a toy poodle but I have too many dogs as it is so this is out of the question.

How about a Miniature Schnauzer? I've met plenty over the years and they have varied considerably in how much they bark. Maybe if you did some investigations you could find a breeder with quieter dogs/lines. They're lovely little dogs, nice natured and cuddly but robust as well.

My Lab can sit on my lap of an evening.  Well, his head and front legs.  :)  I sit on a chesterfield so there is something to hold the rest of him up.  :)

However, assuming retirement age is 65 as it is in Canada, lifting in your Mum's later years may be a problem.  I'm 62 and I can lift 82 pounds of Lab out of my jeep.  But I am thinking the next dog might be a Brittaney Spaniel.  Not much more coat, probably more active, lighter weight.

I've never met a Miniature Schnauzer that wasn't a gobby little devil.  And that bark goes right through too! 

Lovely little dogs but awfully noisy! :-D

>I've never met a Miniature Schnauzer that wasn't a gobby little devil.  And that bark goes right through too!

I don't think I've ever heard my sister's MS make a sound. It's not through training, either, because lord knows she's certainly not trained him in any other way LOL. For all that, he is a lovely character though, I can see why they are so popular.

I also meet several out on walks regularly and have never heard a peep out of any of them either, although I appreciate indoors can be different.

>I've never met a Miniature Schnauzer that wasn't a gobby little devil.  And that bark goes right through too!

Ditto!

Yep ditto here. Standards I know just as gobby, and that's saying something being a  Spitz owner, though I am hard on any excess barking as can't stand it, so training makes all the difference.

Being a Miniature Schnauzer owner I'd like to give my two cents on the breed. I never heard a peep from my first mini for weeks, when I brought him home as a pup. I was quite concerned, as I'd done a lot of research on the breed and was expecting to unleash all my dog training tips on his noise pollution. To my surprise, he never bothered with the postman or car doors slamming in-front of the house, and has always been a quiet little soul. Now... my second mini is COMPLETELY different, and a right little madam from the get go! From an 8 week old pup, she's always had to have the last word, EVERYTHING is of her concern, she'll 'let me know' if anyone has dared step foot on our street, never mind in-front of the house!

So, from personal experience I think it very much depends on the individual. I'd like to add, my little madam is STILL a madam. But very much improved in her love of hearing her own voice. My little man on the other hand, I only hear from him if I ask him 'are you happy today?'

Good Luck on your quest to find a suitable breed :)

I do groom one very quiet laid back shy little mini schnauzer girl, she's an absolute darling. All the others I have met at training etc, and they are usually boys, are gobby little devils! :-p

> I do groom one very quiet laid back shy little mini schnauzer girl, she's an absolute darling. All the others I have met at training etc, and they are usually boys, are gobby little devils! :-p

Haha, total opposite to my two then :)