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Topic Dog Boards / Health / Sick Puppy Breeder won't accept him back (locked)
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- By Lokis mum [gb] Date 29.07.14 16:45 UTC
Have you spoken to the Trading Standards Office local to the breeder?   You may well find that there have been other complaints against him, and the Trading Standards may take the case up.
- By WestCoast Date 29.07.14 17:00 UTC
Whilst I don't think that the breeder has behaved very well - and we only have your side of the story of course - I do think that you have to accept some responsibility for this messy situation.

For instance, I wouldn't give any one £5 cash without asking for a receipt let alone the price of a puppy. 
And if I was buying a new breed, then I would definitely be buying from a breeder recommended by the Breed Club.
There are 4 pages on health tests that are relevant to Springers on the Kennel Club page.  I would have expected you to ask for copies of those as well, along with something from the docking Vet to support that the pups were healthy.  As it is, you appear to have nothing.......

Given the situation, you could ask for a second opinion from a Veterinary Surgeon who specialises in orthopaedics to both confirm the diagnosis and help with diet and exercise plan, both of which will greatly influence the way that your puppy grows.  I would give very little exercise and not allow any jumping or steps in and out of the garden for a long while.  And no tugging games or twisting and turning when running.

You pup has not had the best of starts but with careful management, may make a suitable pet.  Not by design of course, but some life's learning for your children too.
- By helenS [gb] Date 01.08.14 22:16 UTC
Westcoast, I find your tone slightly patronising - not a nice life lesson for my children, who plays with children's emotions like that, "here have a puppy that will cause trauma and upset and cost a fortune in vets bills and not the fun and joyful addition to your family you were expecting and have waited for, not the long walks and camping holidays and trekking and outdoor life that your family want and need from a dog  but it will put cash in my back pocket so I don't care!" - much nicer for breeders to be open and honest and not greedy, money grabbing idiots. I am not an expert and feel I did a lot of research but quite obviously I was blinded by the cuteness of our puppy.

We did get a receipt for the deposit and were expecting one for the balance.

We got docking paperwork but the vet check was carried out at 3 days old when the docking was done... Before the pups were walking - the breeder should have noticed the problem (if he was monitoring the pups) and let us know

We trusted the breeder - we are not professionals, you can do as much research as you want but joe public will never be fully aware of the scams or all the pitfalls - the only way to avoid this is for all breeders to be registered.

As far as our pup goes the update is that we have taken vertinary advice from 2 vets and changed his diet to adult food - wainwrights dogs best friend light, cut out fresh chicken (that the bob reeder was feeding) invested In a supplement for  strong bones for pups (junior joints), strapped his legs with vet wrap for part of the day, ensured he is not jumping up or down from height, ramped our back doors, cancelled crate training (as he just put his paws through crate and jumped up) limited excercise and I must say there is a visible difference - it's not better....but it's got no worse. He's definitely lost weight and all in all is a very happy and content little pup.  hubby has accepted that he won't ever be a gundog but he'll be a very happy and loved pet.

As for the breeder, well the less said the better. I have taken all advice and comments on board and will follow up in due course.... I'm not going to say much more on here, but shame on him, I hope he sleeps at night........

Thank you everyone for your advice and support it's been invaluable and apologies for not replying to every post but been a little busy with said pup and 6 and 3 year old girlies in school hols (with tonsillitis :() xx I will keep you informed of Progess of our little fella x
- By Brainless [gb] Date 01.08.14 22:23 UTC
Hopefully he will go onto be perfectly normal, as the prognosis for this issue does seem to be good.  He should not be in any pain, and won't know he is missing out on anything.

Yes agree the breeder is not worthy of the name and should be the one rehabilitating the pup before homing him.

Unfortunately no licensing would make one iota of difference, when someone has no ethics.
some of the worst puppy farms are indeed licensed.
- By tooolz Date 01.08.14 23:05 UTC Edited 01.08.14 23:07 UTC Upvotes 1
Not much more to add to the useful advice given by many...

But I agree with Brainless on this point....please don't have the take home message from this as " only licensed breeders"....

Being licensed wouldn't have stopped this happening, wouldn't have made the man any more ethical and unlikely to have given him any more repercussions for his actions.

A HUGE number of cheap Internet pups are thought to originate from "Licensed breeders" many having huge converted cattle sheds with a multitude of breeding bitches.

Best advice is.......Don't buy a puppy...Buy a BREEDER. One who loves and cares for their dogs, one who will give a lifetime of aftercare, one who is more concerned if YOU are the right owner for their puppy.....then you will be blessed with a well reared, well loved pup with all the back up you may need.

Hindsight is not much use to the OP but perhaps telling people this message may go someway to avoid this occurring.
- By Goldmali Date 01.08.14 23:08 UTC
Best advice is.......Don't buy a puppy...Buy a BREEDER.

Definitely! A good breeder will be there for the life of the pup no matter what, and often after that as well as they can become almost part of the family i.e. really good friends.
- By Carrington Date 02.08.14 08:39 UTC
Best advice is.......Don't buy a puppy...Buy a BREEDER.

I like....... that is very good tooolz. :-)

Also agree, licensed breeders can often be puppy farmers, after all it makes it a business if you are pumping out so many litters.

helenS, wishing your pup continued progression........... and just wait and see, 4 weeks from now the pups legs may indeed be straightening, time will tell, your hubby may end up with a working dog yet. Fingers crossed.
- By MamaBas [gb] Date 02.08.14 09:38 UTC
Again I'd just like to add most breeders care about their REPUTATION and if I had an unsatisfied puppy buyer, I'd move heaven and earth to help.   And that would always include wanting to have the puppy back, even if I got him sorted out, hopefully, and he went off again later on. 

I had one I sold to a lovely couple and as I always suggest, they took their new puppy to their own vet within 48 hours.  Yoiks.   This vet decided their puppy was 'all wrong' and wanted to x-ray front to back.   I pleaded with them to bring him back to me for my vet (with them there if they wanted, to see there was no 'funny business' going on).  They refused and went ahead.  The puppy left us on the Saturday and spent the whole of the following Wednesday in a vet's office being under a g/a and x-rayed.   What did they find ...... ABSOLUTELY NOTHING!    I'd had my own vet in contact with this idiot (vet) before he x-rayed but he insisted on going ahead.    Meantime my relationship with these new people had become 'strained' to say the least.   And as for a puppy going from all he'd known to a new home and then going through all that ...... I wept.    So fact is even if the breeder did step up to the plate, as I believe this one should have to see this puppy through the early development stages to hope he 'came right', sometimes the new owners won't cooperate!

I too hope your puppy improves as he matures.
- By Dill [gb] Date 02.08.14 10:29 UTC
the only way to avoid this is for all breeders to be registered

This shows what you haven't yet understood about dog breeding,  and perhaps would have, had you done more research when looking for a puppy.

If you really think, licensing would change things regarding breeders not being all they should,  perhaps you should watch this,  every one a licensed breeder and licensed pet shop seller.

http://iplayer.tvcatchup.com/programme/423313/the-truth-behind-the-bargain-dog-trade-tonight

Be aware,  it takes a strong stomach.
- By triona [gb] Date 02.08.14 11:36 UTC
With the change in feed and strapping it can take quite a few weeks, I'd advise to take photos each week so that you can compare... that way you can see the improvements and it does help moral, if you have a down day you can just go back to the photos and see all the good your doing. Good luck ;)
- By G.Rets [gb] Date 07.08.14 21:00 UTC Upvotes 1
My friend had a Bernese with this condition many years ago. It is definitely a case of the long bones developing at different rates. My friend's dog lived a full life of a normal span for a Bernese and, although his leg always looked a bit "bent", it certainly didn't seem to bother him.  It was his penchant for eating such things as socks, gloves, tea towels and even a tee shirt that almost killed him on several occasions but luckily, he survived all of those dramas.  Try not to worry unduly but I know that is easier said than done. Good luck.
- By gypsy [gb] Date 13.08.14 17:33 UTC
did the pup not come with 4 weeks free insurance from the k.c ? you need to get this man on judge rinder
- By snowflake [gb] Date 22.08.14 09:10 UTC
Helen

I have not been on this forum for  a while and read your story with absolute horror and it reduced me to tears.  I am so relieved though that you have decided to keep the pup and I am sure that with all that you are doing his legs will improve.

You have had a horrible experience and I hope you bring that dreadful breeder to book.

Do keep us updated as to progress.  Good luck.
- By Hethspaw [gb] Date 24.08.14 10:56 UTC Edited 24.08.14 10:59 UTC
Sorry I'm not much help, but I would be contacting Trading Standards ASAP.

Definatly thats the way to go ASP - what you also need to do is save every web page, add & info the person is putting out across the web & anywhere else you find it, if they are putting themselves across as an experienced or pro breeder then all the more reason they should have known, on the other hand, if they put themselves across as ordinary dog owners who got caught out then there is no realistic reason the should have known,

Collect whatever existing evidence you can off line but get onto trading standards tomorrow am, time in your case is very important.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?client=opera&q=trading+standards&sourceid=opera&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8
.
- By Admin (Administrator) Date 30.07.15 10:00 UTC Edited 30.07.15 10:12 UTC Upvotes 2
Update: Just to let you know that we have seen evidence that the dog is now living a fit and healthy life and does not appear to have the condition which was initially diagnosed by the vet.
Topic Dog Boards / Health / Sick Puppy Breeder won't accept him back (locked)
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