Hi all, I wonder if I could just ask some advice about which clippers people find best for grooming, both for using and maintaining. I am looking at initially using these for grooming my own dogs and a few of my friends of medium length hair, plus my neighbours shih tzu, thinking about potentially doing some professional training at a later date so want something that would cope with that too. Any advice would be appreciated as it's a confusing with all the different grooming equipment available. Thanks

One thing you'll find if you train to do professional grooming, is that many dogs don't actually need clipping, and it's far better if they aren't.

Their coats are more weatherproof, and easier to keep brushed.  Mud just falls off or brushes out.

The important thing is to groom the coat correctly :-)

If you intend to train as a groomer, it would be better to  contact the training centre for advice or maybe go along somewhere to try them out.  Different clippers suit different people, a lot depends on the size of your hands and what feels comfortable to use ;-)

They are a big outlay, so it's important to get the right ones for you

I wouldn't expect a Shih Tzu to be clipped, although some 'shearers' do it as it's quick and they can do more dogs that way.   I was trained to scissor a Shih Tzu, which leaves a lovely finish and suits the coat better.   Of course, if the dog is very elderly, then clipping wouldbe done for the dog's sake, so as not to keep it on the table too long and to reduce the length of time combing.  But a younger Shih Tzu should be well able to cope, and actually enjoy the attention :-)

>I wouldn't expect a Shih Tzu to be clipped, although some 'shearers' do it as it's quick and they can do more dogs that way.

I must object to your derogatory term of shearer and the assumption that the only reason it is done is to do more dogs and presumably make more  money.

I am a groomer and I do shear many Shih Tzu and other breeds. I very often cut them very short. It is not because of speed or laziness or lack of skill. It is because that is what the customer wants. They buy this cute fluffy puppy but find it doesnt stay looking that way. Its hair grows. They receive little advice from the breeder about  how to look after the coat so it mats up. the only option then is a short clip. I do prefer to keep dogs in full coats and spend time with my customers explaining how to groom and showing them but it soon becomes more work than they are willing to do every day so they ask for it to be clipped as short as possible. You cant force people to groom their dogs and I would rather clip off a dog than leave it longer and matted.

I currently have a 18 week old shih tzu and she has already been to the groomers for a couple of vists. They scissored her at my request as i read it can affect the adult coat if they are shorn. I also had an elderly shih tzu who had brachyial respiratory syndrome and she was close clipped so both work.

The elder dog found grooming stressful so that option worked for her and her health. The pup is a tart and loves the whole experience! Some clips are really skilled and well done but to me the finish on the pup with scissors was seriously impressive. Learn both i say and as smithy says tell you customers to groom their dogs in between - they learn to love it ! I still can't believe this puppy enjoys it so much especially her bits that naturally get more tangled.

I agree with Smithy, it isn't the groomer's fault if time after time the owner brings the dog in knotted in spite of me explaining and demonstrating how to brush and trying to make more frequent appointments, if the owner then says 'oh she doesn't need doing yet' and cancels the appointment, only to bring the dog in knotted the next time and says 'nice and short all over please'. I clip shih tzus, lhasas, Westies, cockers, daxies, you name it, though I do have some which I am able to do closer to breed standard than others. However if I refused to groom any dog unless it was given a show trim to breed standard, I think I would have perhaps 2 dogs on my books!

Tish, this is what happens when owner  and groomer work together the dog  enjoys it  :-)

Hopefully your pup will live  12 years + so it's really important that grooming is a pleasure.    Otherwise, that's a very long time for a dog to be uncomfortable with the process, and mostly knotted up :-(

As far as owners not wanting to make the effort to groom their dogs, it's a welfare issue.  I've seen the dogs that come in every 6-8 weeks for an all off.  They spend at least half that time knotted.   It's unfair on the dog.  I've also seen the dogs that get groomed twice a year and nothing in between.  Personally I would report to the RSPCA - it's neglect pure and simple.

Groomers who collude with this aren't really doing their job.  And they aren't doing themselves any favours either.  Word of mouth is what brings in business.  The ones who get an all off clip a couple of times a year usually tell people where to get it done.

So do the ones who are willing to care for their dogs, so the groomers that insist on dogs being groomed properly get the nice dogs, with the caring owners and really good adverts for their business, and the groomers who do the all-offs get the ones who aren't willing to make an effort.

I know which I prefer :-)  

A good discussion and explanation of how this works here http://www.champdogsforum.co.uk/board/topic/69658.html

Dill the biggest shock after her first visit was the price 3.5 hours in London ? £20.00 !!

I even said to them i have to give you more she looked immaculate. But they said no needless to say the second visit included some goodies for them!

>Dill the biggest shock after her first visit was the price 3.5 hours in London ?

Well if I only charged £20 for 3.5 hours work I would be bankrupt in days. A full working day would not even cover my overheads let alone wages for me. I presume this must have some sort of introductory offer. What is the normal price if you don't mind me asking?

Wow, the only dogs I charge as little as £20 for are Yorkies, as they only take me 1.5 hours, and I'm in Suffolk! And mostly people seem pleased with my prices so I don't think I'm too expensive! :-)

It kind of is -they charge 35.00 plus for a full groom. to be honest i was shocked at the price but they warned me they may not get much done. When I saw how great she looked and how happy she was i would have paid double. They said it is a puppy price and to get her used to it. But the second was the same.  The next will be a full groom (it looked like it was to me) all her paws were beautifully trimmed her trousers shaped and her eye hair and chrysanthemum / beard was perfect. The only things they didn't do were her ear hair and nails both times as they had been done at the vets. they had Lil ' my last dog for ages so they do know me.  I used to pay 35.00 for her clip nails etc etc. this looked way more skilled that's why I was surprised.

My friend has an OES who they charge 45.00 for but he is close clipped.

I have actually lost clients through telling them how to groom their dogs in between visits. Some of the dog owners think groomers are there to sort out their neglect. It's infuriating when you get a matted dog but the owners still want them to "look fluffy" Miracle workers we are not. It is uncomfortable on the dogs to have matts removed, sometimes painful so I do try to educate. It's like talking to the dog most times.

When I took my last dog on she was 9 and it was due to my sister being sectioned. We took her to the vet and love her she was full of excema and matted underneath. This was my first dog since mongrels we had as kids and i had zero experience. The vet was fantastic and clipped her. It pulls their skin!!! How would you like someone back combing your hair and tying it so tight you couldn't move your head.where she was most matted was underneath so imagine "that" hair being matted and caught so you can't walk properly! I was so embarrassed even though we had only been looking after her for 2 weeks. This dog never learnt to love like being groomed despite all my efforts. At best she tolerated it. I am crossing my fingers the new pup will continue to see it as "our time" and improve with each groomers visit.

It feels fab walking out of the groomers with your dog looking pucker if you can't be arsed get a sphinx.

Hello,

I'm a professional groomer and I use Andis 2 speed clippers. :)
May I recommend buying both "Notes from the grooming table" and "The stone guide to dog grooming for all breeds".
Apart from show Shih Tzu's I've clipped them all as we get many in (In fact I'd say ALL the ones apart from show ones have been matted) with mats and flea's, sometimes so matted that even a 10 blade won't get through.

Sometimes clipping is needed, although unless for medical reasons I won't clip a double coated breed. IF a dog isn't being cared for very well by the owner (i.e elderly owner who can't groom the dog for whatever reason) then clipping is best for the dog.

If you need any other advice feel free to message me. :)

The trouble with sorting out people's dogs when they are severely matted and not touched in between grooms is that these people are neglecting their animals.

If all groomers refused to sort them out and sent them to the vet instead, they'd soon start at least attempting to groom.  Round here, vets charge £30 just for you to walk through the door!

When I was training, I was given a severely matted and felted Shih Tzu.  The only kind thing to do was take it all off.  I was very unhappy about doing the dog as she was panting so badly, and it was a hot day.  The dog was given several rests off the table and we kept her as calm as possible.   The person who had brought her in was advised that the owners should take her to their vet asap, as I, and the person in charge, felt the dog may have heart problems.

The coat came off more easily than expected, but it was mostly in one piece!  It stank, and the skin underneath wasn't in great shape either.

A couple of days later, the dog died.   She was 6 years old ! 

If for no other reason, owners should be told explicitly that their lack of attention to their dog's grooming is making the dog uncomfortable at best and at worst could kill it because of the stress of suddenly having to be groomed.

Personally, if I get a badly matted dog in, I will take the whole lot off once, if I don't send them straight to the vet.  But I won't do it twice.   I also give the owners the whole matted stinking mess to take home.

I won't be the dog torturer and I refuse to collude with owners who neglect their dogs. 

At the end of the day, if someone always sorts out their mess, what incentive do the owners have to change their ways?

Just to be clear, I'm not talking about elderly dogs, and I'm not talking about elderly/infirm owners, sometimes there is a fair reason for not being able to groom properly, but I would expect these owners to have appointments every 4 weeks so that the dog isn't left too long in discomfort.

It pulls their skin!!! How would you like someone back combing your hair and tying it so tight you couldn't move your head.where she was most matted was underneath so imagine "that" hair being matted and caught so you can't walk properly!

Absolutely!

I do wonder why it is that not everyone understands this

It feels fab walking out of the groomers with your dog looking pucker if you can't be arsed get a sphinx.

It certainly does!   And it's a great advert for the groomer :-)    

It also feels great whenever you go out with your dog if it looks smart and well groomed, and all that takes is a regular brush and comb!

I agree completely Dill.  The very first thing that I was taught when I was training was that this is one profession where the customer is NOT always right!  It was going to be my job as a groomer to educate the owners to take care of their dogs to make the dogs' comfortable, and that was not to clip off at the owners request.

I was taught that most dogs can be scissored into a puppy trim where they are recognisable for their breed and could be kept feeling comfirtable and looking good with one brush, one comb and in usually 5 but a maximum of 10 minutes each day. That's what I taught my owners to do and I would explain that during their first phone enquiry.  Most were very excited and happy with the prospect - they thought that all groomers clipped everything off!  To those that were not, I gave them the phone number of the sheep shearers in my area as they weren't the sort of clients that I wanted.  It's the groomers' choice as to what sort of clients and dogs they want to be known for turning out. :)

I have reported a vicar to the RSPCA for continually neglecting his dog's coat, after trying to help him, even using the words "Are you aware that the RSPCA consider it an offense to neglect your dog's coat?" and still he presented a matted Cocker!

My clippers and blades rarely needed attention because they were used so infrequently.  :

Let's face it,  at the end of the day, as a groomer, you get the  dogs and owners you deserve.

I've  had no end of people come up to me when I'm walking my dogs, admire how  they are turned out and ask for the details of my groomer :-D

When I ask why, they tell me about the groomer they have who charges what I call peanuts and clips off their matted dog every  three months.  When I ask how often they groom, they  tell me thats the groomers job! They are always looking for someone who will do it even cheaper.

My answer is always the same - they are getting a bargain and they should consider buying a brush and  comb if they want it cheaper ;-)

I use the Oster Golden A5. Possibly not the quietest clipper around (although I understand the newer ones are a bit quieter? Mine is pretty old) but it has excellent durability and the only dogs I've groomed that were bothered by the noise were bothered by the quietest clippers around as well. I honestly haven't had to do any maintenance with the clipper itself so far, just washing, oiling and sharpening the blades.

A woman at the vets last week had a springer who had a drain in his lower back leg. It was a cruciate repair which she said he did chasing the cat on the kitchen tiled floor. I don't know if he had long hair on his paws but know when my little one starts "slipping" it's due to this so i try to keep that hair really short. the groomer said she would do just her face and paws if i popped in but i just take her regularly so it isn't an issue

I have an andis 2 speed burgundy one. And I use the andis ultraedge blades. Pretty good and not too expensive.  I have finished my first level and start my level 3 on monday. Im pretty proficient and can do many breeds start to end. Im actually working at a vets niw as a groomer. This is pet styling though. Very rare to have a breed standard clip.  Make my cockerpoo look like a schnauzer type thing. Coats all wooly from repeated clipping but I enjoy it and it pays the bills. I do plan to do my external exams and get my diploma and poss further after that. Wouldn't mind competing in grooming as well

Hi on they subject of clippers, I bought a set of Andis Agc ment to be for 'professional groomers' but after some bad experience with some cheaper clippers I just went with what my friends recommended to me. They are easy to maintain light and more than powerful enough to leave a perfect cut even on thick fur, I paid around £120 and got the from Anglia but in reality they have saved me more money than what they cost.

http://www.angliaclipperservices.com/dog